mrballsonya

Absolutely not, I also think Toyota has some very plain design. However Toyota has the advantage of perceived quality that Ford doesn't seem to have. When you have a huge hurdle like "no perceived quality" going against you, you really need to appeal to the market in visible areas such as exterior design. Unfortunately I believe the Ford Flex will stand out, but for all the wrong reasons. I like what I've seen of the interior in the Flex, it does appear that Ford has taken a cue from Audi and started to actually care about interior materials and design. But the exterior just screams of a typical bad concept to production evolution.... stretched, widened, raised, and proportionally nothing like the original fairlane concept. I just really think the looks are going to be the death of this vehicle.

Believe me house, I totally understand what your saying.... But at the same time 2 wrongs don't make a right. Just because Mullaly is making a totally absurd amount of money doesn't mean that we shouldn't take a long look at our position as factory workers in this new global economy. Through outsourcing, big business has put a huge dent into unionized labor. Big business now has us, the U.S. worker backed so far into a corner that there is no apparent way out. They've done every thing they can to sway public opinion against unions and to negatively portray our supposed "ridiculous pay and health care packages". Essentially Big Business declared war on the American worker, and soon they will be going in for the final kill. As much as I hate to say it, the only result from us taking a hard line in the upcoming contract negotiations will be the demise of Ford and the loss of all of our jobs. Unfortunately all our good paying jobs are now a global commodity. This commodity can be filled by Chinese workers making $1 an hour, Mexicans earning $4 an hour, or even U.S. scabs willing to work in a factory for $10 an hour. I really wish we could go back in time, back when the Unions actually had some political clout and try to figure out when our house of cards started to fall apart. Was the root cause labor leaders whose pockets had been lined with so much cash that they looked the other way as outsourcing became prevalent. Was it politicians whose pockets had been lined with so much corporate cash that they started selling out the U.S. worker. Or was it the average union member, who forgot that being part of a union sometimes requires some effort, participation and 100% support of other fellow unionists. No matter...we now have to deal with the consequences of the demise of the Labor Union in the United States. So how do you approach a negotiation knowing that your opponent is holding the majority of the cards? Basically you either have to Bluff or Fold. Bluffing only works when your opponent doesn't know what cards you have, unfortunately for us Ford knows ever card in our hand. So where does that leave us? Folding is the only option at this point in the game. Either we lose everything by bluffing or we fold and only give up a little now, with the hopes that we can win some of it back on the next hand. I really hate to be a defeatist about all of this, but until we as the American worker start getting really mad, desperately mad... we better just starting digging our own grave. Until we all get back together and act as one political entity, our voices will not be heard and we will all be continually trampled on by BIG BUSINESS. I'm just as confused as many of you are as to where I should constructively aim my ire, and this is a big problem. We need to figure how to make our collective will known, and start doing it soon..... before its to late.

I agree totally, the Ford Flex is ridiculous looking... The proportions are absolutely terrible. Ford Design has been horrid the last few years. IMO the Ford flex will be yet another in the long list of ugly or plain Ford vehicles that won't sell. I think the concept of a "cool" non minivan/SUV is right on the mark for the current market..... but the Looks are just going to eat this thing alive. LADIES AND GENTLEMEN.... MEET THE NEW FORD AZTEC. Pick any color you like and name your price, because we've got a 400 day supply of these bad boys. ANOTHER NAIL IN THE COFFIN!

The "OBSCENE C.E.O PAY" subject is far from dead. Every time another Joe Blow loses his Job to outsourcing and can no longer feed his family, I hope this subject will infuriate, and incite rebellion against these ridiculous compensation packages. These current C.E.O's are not Rockefeller, Carnegie, Buffet, Ford or Walton. The preceding gentlemen deserve every penny and accolade they received. They were all brilliant businessmen, salesmen, inventors, innovators and they all took full advantage of the U.S. free market system. They also did something else that's unheard of in todays economy, they all created great wealth for the U.S. and for the average U.S. worker. The Current crop of C.E.O.'s are all hell bent on either outsourcing every U.S. job to China, or reducing the average U.S. manufacturing wage to below poverty levels. Obviously Wall Street has a great deal to do with this trend, and this in itself is Ironic as these greedy traders or "traitors" are selling out the very Country in which they live. Even with the constant push of Wall Street.... These C.E.O's must be living in some alternate reality if they think their compensation packages are merited. I know.... you say, "but the Market Dictates salary"....B.S. What you currently have is a group of about 10,000 "decision makers" making themselves and their friends richer and richer off the backs of the average American, Mexican, and Chinese Worker. Until we as the Majority.. start making our will known (either via shopping habits or protest) this trend will escalate from the ridiculous to the absurd. It's up to us. Stop shopping at Walmart, Stop buying cars made in Mexico and Japan, stop investing in outsourcing companies and definitely pull all your money out of Wall street. Start a working class revolution, make it known that your 401K is small but when combined with your 200,000 laid off brethren, it's a nice chunk. Don't feel bad, your portfolio manager will still skim enough money to buy his pool, he just won't be able to build the Cabana this year. My best advice to everyone who's frustrated by the continuing wage gap between the C.E.O and the worker, get organized.... the only way one voice will be heard is if it's combined with the voice of millions. We have the Numbers... Just not the organization. POWER TO THE PEOPLE

Good luck Jason, it sounds like you've got a great plan for your life after Ford. I hope everything works out for you. Pete

We'll see how HAPPY all those NON-Union Toyota workers will be after the upcoming U.A.W contract negotiations. YOU CAN BET YOUR ASS, as soon as the big 2.5 and the U.A.W. agree to wage and benefit concessions "POOR TOYOTA" will HAVE to implement wage cuts as well...under the guise of JUST STAYING COMPETITIVE :shades: . Guess what Toyota hourly workers, your free ride is over....Get ready to take it in the ass...just like the rest of us poor "un-edjumicated, lazy" U.A.W workers. As our wages go down....so will yours, you can bet the house on that. Toyota is way to competitive of a company to let the big 2.5 get any type of advantage on them. Toyota workers unite now before it's to late. Presently, you the Toyota workers are probably the only factory workers in the U.S. that actually have some bargaining power. With Toyota making a mint and market share growing, it's your turn to guarantee yourselves a contractual wage, benefit and job security package. The days of the Warm and Fuzzy Toyota will soon be over. Every time Ford or G.M. moves another U.S. job to Mexico or China they are putting pressure on your Job. Do you think Toyota will continue to pay you $25 an hour, when Ford and G.M. are paying $18 an hour here, $4 an hour in Mexico and $2 an hour in China? If you do, I've got some nice land to sell you in Antarctica..... Guaranteed to yield bountiful citrus crops. Seriously though....right now YOU the Toyota worker have the power to insure your continued employment and livable wage, take advantage of it while you can..... YOU NEED COLLECTIVE BARGAINING!!

Great Link Fastime. That is a very interesting article that should be forwarded to every holier-than-thou "Pious" owner.

Good point Ktp1989... well said, but there are a lot of ifs and maybes in that postulation. As I recall Ford got something like 17 Billion in financing for the latest Turn around plan. I still find it very hard to believe that they would basically give away 1/3 of their Turn around money in September, no matter how much long term savings it would yield. IMO that turn around money HAS to be used for product development if Ford is to have any hope at long term viability. If Ford can make some great cars, then the business structural costs will be greatly offset by swift sales and high profit margin. YIKES SPRING!!!! that seems way to feasible. Lets all hope that this is not the Ford family's motive.

:beerchug: :beerchug: You people are crazy to believe this shit, do you realize how much this would cost Ford? $100,000 x aprox. 50,000 hourly(after buyouts) = 5 Billion dollars.... For a contract Bonus :hysterical: My brothers, uncles, nephew heard from a high ranking UAW official..... that ford will be handing out crack pipes and rocks to all it's hourly workforce the day before the vote for the new contract......Stranger things have happened. I never thought we'd all get bonuses for losing $12,000,000,000.... Maybe we'll all get $100,000 and crack...man thats a scary thought.

That R series is frugly. It must have been designed by the same people that are responsible for the New Caravan redesign. UGLY, UGLY,UGLY!!!

???? FROM LUTZ TO SPRINGSTEEN...... SO IS THE WAY OF THE INTERNET. :D

Mulally 2007 Total Compensation Opportunity $16,500,000 Fords 2006 earnings 12,000,000,000 LOSS Toyota CEO Hiroshi Okuda 2007 Total Compensation est. $930,000 Toyota's 2006 earnings est. 13,000,000,000 HMMMMM....SEEMS AS IF IT SHOULD BE THE OTHER WAY AROUND link to CEO pay http://www.manifest.co.uk/news/2004/20040510Forbes.htm

What? Not getting better any time soon... huh?. I guess the upcoming Pontiac G8 isn't an improvement. And lets just forget about the Saturn Aura, which has gotten pretty good reviews. But screw GM for a moment...what exactly does Ford have in the works? Oh... I know a re-grilled 500 or should I say Taurus. A redesigned focus that will appeal to no one except the die hard MPG fan. The Fusion triplets are fine, but I still don't think you can quantify them as a "HIT". The Crown Vic... OOH BABY, It doesn't get much better than a 20 year old platform with 10 year old styling. At least GM has shown signs of life with Lutz in charge, They still have many other areas to fix. But unlike Ford, GM seems to be heading in the right direction. I see no light at the end of Fords tunnel.

Wow... 630land, according to your rebuttal; Ford is in great shape. Why should I even bother being critical when Ford's doing so well. I guess in 630land all is well, make sure you say hello to the sugar plum fairy and oompa loompas for me. Unfortunately in the real world Ford is in deep trouble. Ford has lost almost 10% market share in the last 7 years, do you think this normally happens to a company that is making GREAT products? I don't. I think a loss of 1,000,000 sales in 7 years definitely warrants some serious product analysis and criticism. Ford has basically mortgaged the company to pay for this upcoming turnaround, So we're ALL IN. If Mulally doesn't get this right, whats left of the Ford Motor Company will be sold to the highest bidder. You mention that sales are up on the Focus, Imagine that.... $3.00 a gallon gas and Fords smallest car's sales are up. This says nothing about the style or design of the Focus. The people that are buying these cars are using these as appliances. There is nothing wrong with selling appliances, other than the fact that Ford makes virtually nothing selling these cars. Am I saying Ford should stop selling the Focus? Hell no, we need all the sales we can get. But why not make the redesign nice looking? A nice looking and good driving Focus might appeal to more than just the Appliance buyer and consequently could increase sales and profit margin. As far as the 500 goes, yes they could have "won in my book" and in the book of many other potential buyers. Ford could've given the 500 some decent styling and drive train options, and it would've appealed to more than just the 50+ set. Good design doesn't cost anymore than bad design. THE 500 HAS BEEN CRITICIZED over and over for its bland styling and lack of performance. I know EVERYONE HATES FORD and this is just a big conspiracy to bring FoMoCo down. Come on now. Eventually when 100's of people tell you somethings RED.... do you still maintain its BLUE? Yeah.... nothings wrong with the 500... or should I say Taurus. Crown Vic- Fleet Buyers love them, I guess as long as Ford makes money who cares. But Fleet sales do nothing for your brand image, recognition, resale value or desirability. "Newsflash Toyota's average age is 50". I can only speculate, but I would imagine most of these 50 year old buyers were once 25-35 year olds. During that 25-35 age period they probably got burned on some crap domestic offering, and are now turned on by Toyota's bland styling, and the misconceived notion that Toyota offers more reliability than the domestics. So whats my point? These impressionable younger buyers would do well to be awestruck with the fantastic looks and performance of Fords latest model "X". Once Ford sells them an "x" and they find that it lives up to their every expectation... Guess what?... when these "x" buyers turn 50 they'll be perfectly happy going out and buying a bland, boring Ford 500. Unfortunately Ford doesn't currently have the advantage of these "reliable Toyota Legacy buyers", Ford must do everything they can to start to appeal to the younger buyer. If ford doesn't appeal to todays 25-35 year old, than they won't be around in 15 years. As far as the Minivans go... yeah who cares. It's only 200,000 sales a year. Whoops. Just sweep it under the rug. Everyone I know that had a Windstar, really liked it. And now non of them own a Freestar. They either migrated to the Japs or bought a Chrysler. Why? Why just give up on 200,000 sales a year? As much as I hate them, Mini-vans are here to stay and for Ford not to have a viable option in this market is obscene. So in summation... I have to say, 630LAND..... please send me some of those happy pills you've been taking... as I'm worried about Fords future and could use them. Don't worry everybody......EVERY THINGS GOOD IN 630LAND.

On a lighter note... PCSARIO.... as someone who grew up watching He-man, that has to be one of the best avatars I've ever seen. I HAVE THE POWER!!!! Fantastic!!!

A viable Sport compact would definitely be a start. But Ford is just generally mired in bad design and poor performance almost across the board. If you look at performance numbers of anything currently produced by ford, they will always be trumped by other manufacturers... there are some exceptions to this ( Mustang GT.... no real comparable models and Ford F-series towing capacity). I've stated this countless times on this board, "you cannot regain lost market share with just average products". Yet ford continues to come out with Dud after Dud (Mustang and Fusion excluded). My dad loves his 200 H.P. 500, my grandparents love their Town Car... but these cars aren't even close to being on the radar of the affluent 30-40yr old car buyer. Ford might continue to eek out an existence with employee and legacy sales, but unless they start to produce some cars that will make average Joe BMW/Toyota buyer want to go to the Ford dealership... I think Ford will have to cost cut their way into oblivion. I hate to sound purely self centered and grandiose, but I honestly believe that the Day Ford comes out with something that I pine for .... will be the same day that Ford starts to right the ship. I know.... Fords existence just hinges on my approval of upcoming models... I'm not saying that. But I do represent a very desirable segment of the car buying market, and I know there are many others that share my same automotive desires and aspirations. Enough about me, back to Fords problems. The Focus is no longer a viable player in the compact segment, the re-design is terrible and there are no performance models to speak of. The Focus is the new Taurus, desired by no one (exceptions being the die hard MPG fans and the rental agencies). The Fusion has been somewhat successful, but I still maintain that it would've been a bona fide hit... had it launched with the 260HP 3.5 as an option. The Ford 500 is a terrible example of design by committee, Bland, bland , Bland. Ford has finally given the 500 a decent engine to go with its bland styling. With the new name and the new engine Ford might get a few more sales, but I wouldn't hold my breath. The Crown Vic is a Joke, it only appeals to police agencies, taxi companies, cop wanna- be types and to old men who love the reliability of the old Body on Frame construction. The Ford edge has the looks, but is hugely overweight and underpowered. The Mustang really has no competition right now. It does represent a great bang for the buck, but with the arrival of the new Camaro I think the Mustang sales will start to decline. The Mustangs retro design seems to appeal primarily to the 50 Yr+ buyer. I think the Camaro with its new edge theme will appeal more, to the younger "Honda/Toyota" set. The Freestar is terrible, it really is. I know of at least 3 people that were ready to buy one, but after their test drive chose to keep their windstars or look at the Chrysler minivans. Ford really blew about 100,000 sales a year with this model. I can see why Ford has left this market to Chrysler and the Japanese. I can't really make critical comments on the trucks, because I'm not a truck person. If I was, I'm sure I'd buy an F-150. I know a lot of guys that have been very happy with their F-series trucks. The trucks seem to be one area where Ford has gotten "IT" right. Unfortunately for Ford, Toyota has basically declared war on the full size market with their new Tundra, and Gm has just released their new Full size. I really can't see many of the people I know switching, but who knows how the Texas and California markets will embrace the Tundra. In summation I plead with Ford.... please show me some signs of life. Show me a concept that will get my heart racing. Show me that there are still some people at the glass house that know what constitutes a "good car". Right now all I see in the Future is more production cuts, more losses and even lower employee morale.

Where's Richard? According to him... Lutz couldn't run a lemonade stand... let alone a Vehicle Manufacturer. I think GM has begun to prove that if you make vehicles that look good, perform well, and are affordable.... people WILL buy them, even if they don't have that Japanese "T" on their name plate. Ford just doesn't seem to be grasping on to this concept, Ford seems to be content with the last years status quo and yesterdays design. I don't pretend to be any kind of automotive Nostradamus, but I do seem to have some sort of convoluted mental sales analysis built into my meager brain that enables me to see upcoming concept CARS and get a pretty accurate gauge on how well the model will sell. Maybe it's due to my 15 Automotive magazine subscriptions, or my love of Performance and the Automobile, I don't know. This 6th sense is the type of Car sense that cannot be had with every 4 year engineering/design degree, You have to actually love Cars to get this. I love Ford, I work for Ford, If there is anyone on this board that can actually make a difference please contact me; I'll be willing to offer my free time for the betterment of Ford design and engineering. I'm serious. I want to see Ford rise out of this design Funk. If you think I'm joking look at my critical posts of the less than stellar 500 triplets, the Stale Expedition, and funky redesigned focus. Look at my critical posts of the "New" Freestar. The Freestar was another joke in the great comedy that has become Ford. Ford no longer has a mini-van because of the this terrible redesign. The Edge isn't to bad but is over weight and under powered, the Mkx is UGLY and will not be viable in the market place. These constant missteps in the Ford lineup will continue to drag down a once great company. What happened to Lincoln? Lutz has proven that an American Marque(Cadillac) can be brought back into a viable money making entity. Ford has become a Company that has no marketplace vision, only marketplace reaction. My quandary as an hourly employee is that I can only react to the bad decisions of the company that I work for. Without a degree I have no say in the success or demise of my company, I can't be proactive I have to be reactive...... It's very frustrating. I could help.... but instead I'll be laid off just like the countless others that have been let down by the current management team. Please PM me... I drive to Dearborn every day...... I'll meet you. Ford should have offered a stake in the company to woo LUTZ from Gm, we need a Car guy right now.... not an airplane guru or a pretty boy Floridian. Since we couldn't get Lutz, maybe we can pay Tom Gale to do some critical design analysis. For what its worth, Nostradamus Ballsonya predicts that the upcoming Pontiac G8 will sell very well.

WASHINGTON POST PRESS RELEASE..... WARREN BROWN, EX-Washington Post writer has just become the latest victim of Globalization. Warren has been replaced by Xyang Shu, a better educated, more experienced Chinese National writer who was willing to do the job for 1/10 the wage with no health care. We are sorry to see Warren go, but feel that Xyang will be able to fill his void with no problem. We know that Warren will feel no ill will towards us, as he seems to be very understanding of Corporate protocol...and the constant need to save money at any cost. We know that our mismanagement and exorbitant corporate bonuses have turned the Washington Post into a second tier Newspaper that nobody wants to buy. But with our new WAGE STRUCTURE and outsourcing of writers, we seem to have a sure recipe for success. So please Warren, don't blame us and the sub-par newspaper that we produce.... blame yourself and your unbelievably high health care cost and wage for our undoing. Thanks for all your hard work over the years Warren, we'll make sure we remember you when we're spending our multi-million dollar bonuses.

Great comments guy's, this may be the first time I've ever read through the first page of a thread... and agreed with everyone. The only thing good to come from this 20% wage cut would be the fact that we'd no longer have to listen to those idiots that argue that the reason the big three can't compete is because of the "exorbitant UAW wages and benefits". We would now be making less than our non-union Toyota counterparts. This might actually expose the REAL problems that Ford has, Lack of desirable products and very poor management. FORD HAS TO START DESIGNING CARS THAT EVERYBODY WANTS. This is the bottom line. Unfortunately I have yet to see any upcoming concepts that really make me say "WOW....I've got to have that". Unless ford really has some aces up their sleeve, I think we're all screwed. NOW FOR MY TAKE ON THE 20% WAGE CUT The 20% wage cut will be just the first part of the "Wal-Martization" of the U.S. work-force. Our politicians and corporate leaders sold us all out years ago, we are now just starting to feel the wage and benefit pain of the race to the bottom. In my opinion the corporate greed of our high paid CEO's will be the undoing of our once great country. The wall street types all live for the next days profits, they fail to see the big picture and the detriment of living in a NON-MANUFACTURING country. A country CANNOT be a Superpower without the capability to Manufacture. I keep on hearing about a "service oriented" society, this sure seems like a reversion back to the old feudal system from the middle ages. Basically the LORDS (corporate elite) allow us PEASANTS (the ex-manufacturing worker) to work for food and shelter and protection, nothing else. With the declining wages of the working middle class, this work for food, shelter and protection idea seems to be coming to fruition. The only exception from the Feudal system being that, under Capitalism any PEASANT can invent the next greatest thing and become one of the LORDS..... So at least WE(the ex-manufacturing worker) have some hope.

This race to the bottom (U.S. wages) may seem like a good idea right now, but what these companies don't realize is they're eroding the very market in which they sell. Wal-mart is the biggest offender and the originator of this flawed sales logic. Basically, by outsourcing all these good paying manufacturing jobs these companies get a couple good years of cheap products and a strong market (U.S. manufacturers haven't laid-off all their workers yet), but as soon as these workers don't have a job and are paying $3.00 a gallon for gas... guess what..? they won't be spending their money on that bargain $30 Chinese made bike. I'm oversimplifying this, but I hope you can catch my drift. Here's an interesting article.. with comments for and against outsourcing. http://news.thomasnet.com/IMT/archives/200....html?t=archive In my opinion we WILL NOT continue to be a super power with the current migration of manufacturing jobs to China.

There will be no negotiation. To Negotiate you must have something to bargain with, the U.A.W has virtually nothing to bargain with. The company's will most likely get everything they ask for, and the workers will be lucky if they don't lose money (hourly wage). I hate to be cynical, but really what bargaining power do we have? We already make much more than our counterparts at smaller company's, and VASTLY more than our Mexicans and Chinese piers. Our current government doesn't seem to care that every manufacturer in the U.S. is making a B-line to China. Given the fact that our illustrious leader has never put in a hard days work in his life, I'm really not surprised. As long as Exxon-Mobil keeps on making 40 BILLION a year, Bush is perfectly content. The proof is in the statistics, Big oil has NEVER been more profitable than they have been under the Bush administration. All I can do now is laugh at all the U.A.W. idiots that re-elected Bush, "But Kerry's gonna' take our guns"... guess what Moron... you'll need that gun to rob somebody when you don't have a Job...... Thanks "BIG BUSINESS BUSH". Sorry I'm getting a little off topic....back to the subject at hand.... yeah we're screwed.

As long as I still had a job, I think I'd be pretty content. With only 7 years at Ford, and my plant closing I think I'd be Very Happy if I was only working 8 hour shifts at a viable plant. In my opinion, as an outsider (someone who didn't do their apprenticeship at Ford) there seems to be some sort of entitlement I.E. (I've been here for "X" years, I don't have to do shit) with the Ford skilled trades lifers. These guys really don't know how good they've had it, and for the unlucky ones I think they're going to have a rough transition back into the real workforce. Having worked somewhere else, I've been grateful for everyday that I've worked for Ford. I almost doubled my hourly rate when Ford decided to hire me, and with overtime I made more in the "good years" than some very high ranking U.S. government officials. Luckily unlike most "lifers" that bought cottages, boats, and snowmobiles based on overtime, I saved. I bought a House that was a little more than I could afford on 40Hrs. pay, but with the money I saved in the"good years" I'm fine. I saw way to many guy's piss their money away. Guy's that had 20 years+ of making over 100k and had multiple mortgages on their homes. It really is almost comical, it brings to mind the quote "A fool and his money are easily parted". These guys were great for the U.S. economy, but now that the shit has hit the fan in Michigan....they are the ones losing there houses. I already have another decent paying (2/3 of my Ford pay) skilled trades Job with my old company, If I don't get placed at another Ford plant I'll still be able to feed my family and keep my house. I'm one of the lucky ones. Thanks for the good years FORD, I'm still here for you if you need me.

That's strange, I don't seem to remember taking any painting classes during my apprenticeship. Seriously though, I hate to scab on the painters but If Ford is going to eliminate them no matter what, I'd rather paint than see outside contractors get the work.

:beerchug: Boy they do seem to be going a little crazy with the three bar grill. It really does seem like a move straight out of the desperate Company handbook. Here's an OVERHEARD "TOP TALENT" CONVERSATION.... "Oh Man, the people really love the Fusion". "Yup, it's got to be the three bar grill" , "o.k. then call up "Top Talent #3" and tell him we need three bars across the board". "No problem boss, I'll get right on it..Oh should I have "Top Talent #2" starts getting construction quotes on Three Bar Grilling the Glass House?" "Absolutely". I really get sad when I look at the concepts and future product previews that Ford has come out with recently, I don't see a home run in the bunch. If I open up a car magazine, all I see is picture after picture of other car manufacturers concepts and upcoming models that are very appealing to me. My only hope is that some of these indispensable "Talents" starts to look outside the Company for some new designers.

:o Was that directed at me? Believe me If I bought any kind of truck, it would definitely be a ford. I believe Trucks are one of the few things Ford has gotten right in the past four or five years. Unfortunately I'm not a truck person. There've been only three cars in the last 5 years that Ford Motor has produced that got my heart racing, The Aston Martin Vanquish, Aston Martin DB9, and the Ford GT. Unfortunately I can't come close to affording any of those models on my soon to be EX- Ford Skilled Trades income. So the only thing I can do is wait and watch as other manufacturers continue to come out with desirable and affordable vehicles. Hey sooner or later Ford will catch on right? :rip: