blksn8k2

I'm fine with the current tailgate step. It works and is simple to use. My hope would be that if they do go to a portrait orientation that they do something similar to what the new Ranger Raptor has.

Speaking of '24 F-150 changes, this article on Ford Authority has probably been posted elsewhere already but it does have Tremor specific spy photos. I like the new front bumper better but I will need to see the new grille design in a more finished and fully painted form before passing judgement on that. https://fordauthority.com/2023/07/2024-ford-f-150-tremor-shows-off-new-grille-and-front-bumper/ One possible interior change that I have seen mentioned for '24 is the switch to a "portrait" style infotainment screen. I'm not sure what other changes to the instrument panel would be included with that but I am not in favor of putting all of the audio and HVAC controls on a touch screen. I prefer physical knobs simply because they are less of a distraction than having to take your eyes off the road to adjust things like heating or AC settings on a touch screen. Most audio controls are already on the steering wheel so that wouldn't bother me as much if the manual dash mounted controls went away.

Agreed. From what I am seeing as far as dealer inventories of the '23s are concerned it probably makes sense to wait for the '24 reveal. If I'm not that impressed with the '24 there should still be a decent number of '23s to choose from and perhaps at a discount. Not holding my breath on that last part though. I finally got a callback today from the dealer with the '23 Star White Tremor. The main thing I was interested in was their installed cost of the Roush supercharger which they quoted as $13,500. That price seems high since you can buy that same F-150 kit at Summit Racing for $8649.99. $4850 sounds a bit ridiculous for installation. The Ford Performance guy at Carlisle said you should expect to pay around $1400 for installation of their Whipple kit at a Ford dealership and that kit includes a helluva lot more than just the supercharger. Even if his numbers were a little low that's still a huge difference from what this particular Roush dealer quoted. I then contacted Beechmont Ford in Ohio which is another Roush dealer who quoted installed prices of $11,450 for the Roush kit and $12,200 for the Ford Performance kit. That sounds a little more realistic. The dealer with the Star White truck also gave me a ballpark trade-in value for my '18 which is based on a national average that most dealers use and I already knew the MSRP of the '23 from the window sticker.

What I'm hearing is that '23 F-150 production will end sometime in Nov which means that '24 order banks should open about two months prior to that which would be sometime in Sep.

Not really getting too much in the way of response from dealers. If I fill out an on-line inquiry on a dealer's website they might message and/or call me and ask what I'm looking for and then say "if you have any questions call me". Some have gone a little farther and asked me to send them info and photos of my potential trade (low mileage, loaded '18 F-150 XLT Supercrew 4x4) and I basically get no further response. I assume that's because I didn't drive 500 miles and walk in only to have them take my keys hostage for a couple of hours. I'm not too concerned about all that just yet though. It might actually be a good thing. I'm more than willing to wait and see what changes are coming for the '24 F-150. If I like what I see then I would probably order a '24. If not then there should still be a decent selection of '23 Tremors to choose from. Most larger dealers have more than one on hand right now and very few are including markups. Some are already offering discounts. I doubt it will ever be like the good old days when you could find some exceptional end of model year deals like I did when I bought the '18 but it can't hurt to wait and see how things shake out. It's not as if I need a new truck right this minute. With the overall crappy economy and high interest rates that could begin to put pressure on dealers to move unsold inventory. Those same issues could also convince me to just keep what I have and be happy that I won't have a car payment.

This particular truck was supposedly a retail order that did not sell and was ordered in Star White Metallic Tricoat which is shown as a $795 option on the window sticker. Sorry if I used the wrong terminology. I'm not a car salesman. LOL

Thanks tbone. I'll definitely keep that in mind. I just spoke to a dealer that has a 402A Tremor in stock that was a customer order that did not sell. As a matter of fact, it just arrived on their lot last night. It has all of the options I want plus a couple more that I can live with. This is also a Roush dealer that can do either the Roush or the Whipple supercharger. They sell vehicles like that for MSRP plus the cost of the blower and installation. No markups. The MSRP on this one is $74,590 so with the cost of the Roush adding approximately $12k installed that would put the final price in the $87-88k range or slightly below the white Tremor R at Long McArthur in Kansas. Again this one has the $7525 402A package, moonroof, front axle Torsen diff, trailer tow package, interior work space, special order paint and the bed utility package which includes the tailgate step, but not L-M's suspension and wheel/tire upgrades. And it would have the smaller factory Tremor decals, not the gaudy L-M Tremor R stuff. I sent them photos of my '18 F-150 along with the current mileage.

Well, the local dealer didn't bite on adding anything to their demo. However, they did offer me another $1000 for my trade and they lowered the price of their demo truck from $73,000 to $71,500. When you factor in the decrease in sales tax that you pay on the difference it works out to almost $2650 lower than their initial deal. But, it's still a used truck. My next option will probably be to have them give me a quote on ordering a Tremor High with the moonroof, towing package, Torsen front diff, and the bed utility package in lieu of the Pro-Power Onboard. The price for either of those last two is the same ($995) and you can't add the blower if you have the Pro-Power. I priced the tailgate step at Tasca Ford and the step assembly alone is more than the cost of the Bed Utility Package. Hopefully, they will keep my trade-in value the same as their last offer. I will probably then take that offer to the dealer I actually purchased my '18 from and see if they can beat it.

What I would really like to do is order a Tremor with the High (402A?) package and the other options I want and then have whatever dealer I buy it from install just the Ford Performance Whipple supercharger kit. I'm not really interested in all the other stuff that comes with the FP700 package like the wheels, Borla exhaust, decals, etc. As tbone mentioned earlier the supercharger kit itself sells for $9500 + installation. If they can do that and still offer the factory 3/36 warranty that would be the way to go. If I decide I want different wheels, tires, suspension and exhaust I can do that later and probably for less than I would pay for that Tremor R package from Long McArthur. As tbone and fuzzy also mentioned, another option might be to go with the Roush '21-'23 5.0L supercharger kit which uses an Eaton TVS 2.65L blower and is the blower used by Long McArthur. That might be a little less expensive than the FP kit and it comes with the Roush 3/36 warranty. Ironically, adding a supercharger kit would most likely force me into running premium fuel which was one of my concerns with the Ranger Raptor. Turns out that was incorrect but the major difference here would be the 36 gal tank on the Tremor. I have to drive to the same larger towns anyway for groceries as I would for premium fuel but the larger tank would mean fewer trips. I've pretty much ruled out the RR anyway. All I would be gaining would be a slightly smaller footprint and a suspension I don't need that can't haul or tow what I do need a truck for. I might also take another run at the demo truck the local dealer has. If I can convince them to order and install the parts to add the tailgate step and Torsen front differential for the same deal they have already offered me I would have the truck I'm looking for. It's even the right color (Carbonized Gray Metallic). I could then add the SC, etc. as time and finances permit. That truck does not have the 2.0kW Pro-Power Onboard option but I don't think you can add a supercharger if you have the extra alternator, or at least that's what the Roush kit states.

I'm with you and already considered the 4A issue. I've been corresponding with that dealer today and have asked them to quote a Tremor with the factory options I mentioned before and then the same truck with their "R" package. I also gave them photos, mileage and VIN for my current truck. I realize it's probably an exorcise in futility but what the heck. I also wonder if they start with the base Tremor because adding the 4A setting might be problematic with that much power? Does the Raptor R use the AWD transfer case? Let's see... which would I rather have, AWD or 705hp? Hmmmmm? ?

The sticker on the truck in the video is way larger than the factory F-150 Tremor decal. I assume they did that to emphasize that this is their special package and not a normal Tremor. I agree to a point. For someone like myself who doesn't need the extreme off-road suspension of the Raptor but does want the towing and payload capability of the Tremor along with power similar to a Raptor R this might be a really cool alternative at a price that is quite a lit lower than that of a Raptor R. They do currently have a white Tremor R listed for $89,950. https://www.long-mcarthur.com/searchnew.aspx?q=tremor Edit: I also agree on the gargantuan stickers. I have a heat gun.

This is interesting....

After going through the F-150 Tremor Build & Price webpage I've come to the conclusion that Ford must have recently changed the packages and options. From what I can tell the major change is that they now have two Equipment Groups for the Tremor, Standard and High, instead of the previous numbered groups like 401A and 402A. Most of the reviews you see on youtube of 2023 Tremors still refer to the numbered system and that's what is shown on those older trucks' window stickers. That was confusing as hell when I first started looking at the B & P webpage. I'm also thinking they may have eliminated what some of the reviewers were referring to as the "mid-level" 401A package group. However, since you can't create an actual window sticker in B & P it's impossible to know what would show up on one today. My guess is that Ford is also trying to simplify the ordering process. For example, a lot of the reviewed trucks' had on their window stickers the option to remove the Auto Start-Stop feature. (BTW, why isn't that Auto Stop-Start? I mean it has to stop before it can start, right? LOL) Now I can't even find the option to remove it so I'm guessing Ford removed the feature altogether. I'm also seeing that the 36 gal fuel tank seems to be standard now on the Tremor regardless of which Equipment Group you choose and that may have been the case before since there was no mention of fuel tank size on any of the older window stickers I have seen. What's a little confusing is that there is still an option to add the bigger tank but under that option it says "Included", regardless of which Equipment Group you choose. They should probably just list it as part of the groups instead of showing it as an option. I guess you could say that for a lot of other options as well. I suppose the real problem is that they use those same options on other F-150 models besides the Tremor in which case they could actually be an option. :shrug: So, after all that, the major options I've picked so far are: High Equipment Group, Trailer Tow Package, Twin Panel Moonroof, Front Axle with Torsen Differential, and 2.0kW Pro-Power Onboard. As best I can tell, the 36 gal fuel tank, 4A transfer case setting and 3.73:1 axle ratio are now either standard on all Tremors or part of the High Equipment Group. Haven't decided yet if I would want to spend another $995 to get the tailgate step since it's part of the Bed Utility Package. I already added the Boxlink handles on my '18 which I can re-use and I'm pretty sure I can find the tailgate step in a bone yard. I can do without all the fancy extra lighting and electric opening and closing tailgate that comes with that package. I would also keep and re-use most of the accessories I added on my '18 including the tonneau cover, interior floor mats, bed mat, etc.

Hopefully I won't get a double post but I thought I already posted this last night. Anyway, Ford introduced that package basically during the Carlisle show a couple of weeks ago. Here is a video from Carlisle that explains the package pretty well and, no, installation is not included in that price. The guy doing the interview, Dorian (Boosted F-150) had been racing a combination he built several years ago that was real similar to the black reg cab in the video. His truck was 4WD.

I also have an 18 ft box trailer and my '18 F-150 pulls that with no issues whatsoever. The RR is not rated to tow anything of that size. And, as we've already discussed, there are desirable options on the Tremor that are not even available on the RR. As far as suspension, like I said, I'll never find the limits of either truck no matter which one I choose. The FX4 suspension on my current truck works pretty well as is and the Tremor should be an upgrade over that. I'm obviously still leaning towards the F-150 Tremor. I would definitely go with the 402A package and mainly because, among other things, that gets you the 4A transfer case setting. I would also go with the 3.73:1 axle ratio, moonroof, tailgate step, towing package and 36 gal fuel tank. I might also consider the B&O sound system. I realize that with all the options I am considering the price of a Tremor would not be all that far from a "standard" F-150 Raptor. But you can't get the 5.0L in the Raptor. Yeah, yeah, I get it, it's not as powerful as the Raptor's 3.5 but it's still no slouch and it sounds the way I want a truck to sound. Period. Not saying I would do this but Ford Performance just announced a 700 hp Whipple supercharger kit for the F-150 with the gen IV Coyote and it comes with a 3/36 warranty. Ain't cheap but what is these days? Oh, and the salesman actually agreed that ordering a truck makes more sense than buying their dealer demo Tremor. Imagine that!

That's interesting. Just out of curiosity, I did a search and found this Ranger Raptor spec sheet. The recommended fuel is 91 octane but it doesn't say anything about the use of 87 or what the minimum octane is. https://media.ford.com/content/dam/fordmedia/North America/US/product/2024/ranger/All-New 2024 Ford Ranger Raptor Technical Specifications.pdf What really caught my attention though was that it also states that it uses both port and direct injection. The Ford specs for the Bronco Raptor show DI only for the same engine. Seems odd that they would not be the same but they also don't have the same output numbers with the Ranger version being rated the lower of the two. With the dual injection system you would expect just the opposite or at least that was the result when they switched to dual injection on the 3.5L EB in 2017 from DI only in 2016. I've seen errors before on the media.ford site so there is that as well. I just wish I had seen this before looking at the RR and talking to Carl Widmann at Carlisle... BTW, the forums on broncoraptor.com seem to agree with you. https://www.broncoraptor.com/threads/curious-to-know….598/ This might all be a moot point anyway since I'm leaning more towards the F-150 Tremor anyway. Just a way more useful truck with little or no disadvantage in efficiency. A little harder to park perhaps but I've gotten used to that and since I retired I no longer live in an urban area where parking is an everyday issue anyway. I also have a larger garage now and a full-size truck fits just fine. I'm also spoiled by things like the moonroof, 36 gal fuel tank and tailgate step that are not available on the RR. I can also swap some of the accessories from my '18 like the Ford tonneau cover. And with the aluminum body there is far less risk of it becoming a pile of rust in less than ten years.

I mentioned several days ago in another topic that I was still on the fence about the Ranger Raptor. I did talk to the local dealer about placing an order but the salesman didn't seem too hopeful about getting one. I've also had second thoughts due to it requiring premium fuel and the fact that the only gas station in my hometown only sells 87 octane and the nearest station selling premium is 15 miles away and their 93 is currently averaging 30 cents/gal higher than the 87 in town. Add to that the relatively small 18 gallon fuel tank and that all becomes a bit of an issue. So, while I was at the dealer I test drove a '23 F-150 Tremor which was a dealer demo with a little under 1400 miles. It was equipped with the same drivetrain as my current '18 F-150 4x4 S-crew XLT Special Edition. Both have the 5.0L, 10-speed auto and 3.73:1 axle ratio with electronic locking rear axle. The Tremor was also an extremely nice truck and, just like my '18, it can burn anything from 87 to E85. I thought their pricing was a little out of whack though since they were asking more for that used truck than the MSRP shown on its original window sticker which I asked for and received a copy of. They also told me again that I could order any new vehicle including a Ranger Raptor or F-150 Tremor and pay MSRP with no markups. So, based on that, I could actually order a new F-150 Tremor with the options I really want and still pay less than they are asking for that used truck. It also shouldn't be long before the '24 F-150 specs are available so there's that as well. Then there is also the intriguing possibility of a Ranger Tremor at some point. As far as the potential wait for any ordered vehicle is concerned, I have no issue whatsoever with driving my '18 for as long as it takes. It still has less than 38k miles on the clock. Even a base F-150 Tremor is a few thousand $ more than a base Ranger Raptor but you are getting a much more capable TRUCK (especially payload and tow ratings) and with the V8 it should have similar performance and fuel mileage to the RR considering their similar power ratings and the fact that the F-150 could actually be lighter than a similarly equipped RR. The F-150 S-crew Tremor with the base V8 is listed as 4912 lbs curb weight while the Ranger Raptor is 5325 lbs. Granted the base RR is better equipped than a base F-150 Tremor so once you add a few heavy options like a moonroof (which isn't even available on any Ranger) that weight difference would likely evaporate but still, aluminum does matter. I still believe the RR would be the better off-roader of the two but I also know that I would never test the limits of either one. I don't live anywhere near sand dunes or rock crawling trails. Even if I did my old Bronco would be better suited for that sort of abuse anyway. That's not to say that I never drive my '18 F-150 off-road. I do, especially during hunting seasons.

So what about the fact that the front suspension was moved forward by almost two inches and the track width was increased by about the same amount on the 2024? Wouldn't those changes require at the very least different mounting points for the front suspension? If the frame itself is not wider in the front then they would have to use longer control arms in order to increase the track width. The Nano V6s have the turbos attached directly to the cylinder heads, I.E. no separate exhaust manifolds. By not having exhaust manifolds I suppose you could save a little width but it would be more than made up for by the size of the turbos hanging way down there. I wish now that I had looked a little closer at the Ranger Raptor at Carlisle to see exactly where those turbos are placed. I suppose they could be above the frame rails which would go along with Fuzzy's point about the fender aprons having been changed. But the point is that a V6 with turbos hanging off the sides is a much wider beast than any inline engine used in the previous gen Ranger. Keep in mind that international markets also have the option of the 3.0L Powerstroke Diesel V6. Here's a photo of the 2.7 setup from the F-150 which is probably different from the Ranger but at least you can see how the turbos are attached.

Got to see and sit in a 2024 Ranger Raptor at the Ford Nationals in Carlisle, PA on Saturday, June 3rd. I was also able to talk to Ford Performance chief engineer Carl Widmann. Anyone who is seriously considering this truck is probably already aware of its performance capabilities. While all of that is great and I hate boring vehicles just as much as anyone, I am just as concerned about its livability. After all, this might be my next daily driver. I was pleasantly surprised by the seating comfort both front and rear. Much better than I expected. Awesome truck overall and it looks fantastic in Magnetic! BTW, I think Carl was a little pissed when I asked him to demonstrate the folding capabilities of the rear seat. He was probably thinking why is this jackass even interested in this thing. I didn't want to ruin it by telling him what my other vehicles were. LOL.

Pretty sure Ford has already said the 2.7 will be available on the XLT and Lariat. I doubt you will ever see a moonroof as the current cab, which seems to be almost a carryover from the previous gen, was probably never designed to accommodate one. Does anyone know if any of the body or frame parts are sourced outside of North America?

I was a bit shocked when I had a message from the local dealer this past Saturday reminding me that the RR is now available for ordering. I had talked to them almost a year ago about the possibility of getting a Raptor. At the time they told me that because I was the first to ask them about it they would give me first shot at getting one of their allocations. After that amount of time I wasn't really expecting the call. I guess the fact that they kept my contact info at all is a good omen... I finally took the time to get back to the salesman today. He told me that so far their dealership has not been told whether or not they will get any Raptors from the first run. He did say, however, that the best they could do at this point would be to go ahead and place an order and see what happens. I told him I would try to stop in sometime next week. He also said that they do not require a deposit on orders and that if I decided not to take the truck it would simply be put on the lot. Not sure if I'm believing this part but he also said that they do not add markups to retail orders but if I decided not to take the truck and it goes on their lot then they would most likely add a markup. If I do decide to place an order it will probably be in Velocity Blue with the only option being the spray-in bed liner. I also gave him a short description of my '18 F-150 and told him that I have no good reason not to keep it since it is really well optioned and just turned 37k miles. The original MSRP on it was $56,450 or just about the same as the base price of a new Ranger Raptor. The more I think about it if I did decide to buy something new I would probably be leaning more toward an F-150 Tremor with the 5.0L. I did a cross-country trip this past weekend through the mountains of North Central PA and my truck averaged 22.0 mpg with the 5.0L and 3.73:1 axle ratio. A Ranger Raptor would never do that and my all aluminum body shows zero signs of corrosion after four PA winters. That alone is a huge deal for me.

I'd be happy with something similar to the '23 Ranger Tremor but with the 2.7L as an option. After seeing what the current options are for the '24 Ranger, if I were to order a new truck today it would probably be an F-150 Tremor with the V8. I really like what I have seen of the Ranger Raptor but I just couldn't justify the expected out-the-door price knowing that I could buy an F-150 Tremor that fits my needs so much better and for probably similar money considering the tacked on ADMs that the Ranger Raptor will surely have. If I want to go places where an F-150 can't I can do that in my '75 Bronco.

$3.59 in my home town which is in PA, the land of road taxes.

Mine does.

Me likey. So the engine tag on the pre-production Raptor from a few weeks back was accurate...we did get the 2.7. Awesome! I'm in no hurry to ditch the F-150 so I'm willing to wait to see if the Tremor comes back. Would be nice if they added a moonroof and rear seat HVAC vents but those are not deal breakers. I seldom use the moonroof on the F-150 and I don't sit in the back seat when I'm driving. I do have my name at the top of the list for the Raptor at a local dealer so I will investigate that option as well. I don't think $58k is outrageous for what you are getting but ADMs will likely be the killer.