Bob Rosadini

You are 100% correct on the E-550. It was a good seller and gaining ground. Friend of mine was managing a big Sterling Ford store when they dropped it and he was disappointed as they had made sales, the customers loved the truck and they were looking at repeat sales. Oh as to someone's comment that .. a 24,000 lb towing capacity is not a "Heavy Duty Truc"- its not -we are talking about "Heavy Duty Trucks as in class 8- not pick up trucks. Don't confuse "heavy duty" as a marketing term vs "heavy Duty" as a GVW classification.

That is a good point. It then becomes a matter of checking the class 6 and 7 sales figures as reported vs Ford's "Heavy Truck" numbers same period. If 7Mary is correct, then the higher class 6,7 numbers as reported in the trade press will in fact be 550 sales. 7Mary- Ford does advertise 650/750 in two heavy construction mags I get- Construction Equipment and Equipment Today. For the last two years they run copy featuring a 750 dump. Kind of short on technical merits although they talk about its available 14,000 lb front axle, bolted frame and a few other goodies. Still, the "hairdresser" mentality comes out. Istead of showing the truck with a premium dump body, complete with auto load cover etc, they show it with a cheesy body and in fact, it has the tail gate release handle on the curb side! I have a son in the printing business and he explained how some technical aberation like that can happen but to me it shows a lack of attention to detail, indifference, or stupidity- or most likely all three. Pisses me off- In pariticular when my share basis is close to 23 bucks! But what treally frosts my ass is when you look at the push Hino is putting on. Ford has the beachead and the question is will they surrender another product to Toyota. And we all know, Toyota can put a set of good looking wheels on a milk crate and it will get rave reviews! You can bet your ass while some idiot at Ford is making speeches about ..."focusing on our core business", Hino/Toyota will say..."thank you very much- we will take your non core business and WE will make money at it- in spite of the fact we have no dealer base".

Ah 7 Mary. The glass is always half empty! Perhaps you are right about 550- I actually never thought about 550 being a class 6. Let's see, you are a GMC salesman in disguise right? You say the 750 is a "pick up cab" on a medium chassis yet the GMC is a van cab on a medium chassis- so what's the diference? I personally think the visibility in the GM's sucks with that 30" of flat dash panel in front of you- or so it seems. Again - perception. To support your GM bias, no doubt they are better marketers- just look at the GM web site for mediums and then look at Ford's. Ford needs to clean house and get some truck people in medium truck marketing. But Joe, I agree with you. They have good numbers and they don't try- they are brain dead. look at their marketing. They spend money in Heavy Duty Trucking and what is their add copy? A 450 dually pick up! Why spend money advertising a pick up truck in mag whose mere title implies "heavy duty"? I get a couple of mags that cater to the fuel oil business. Freightliner like clockwork has specific ads that show a 33,000 gvw F'liner equipped with a 2800 gallon tank- the std "tax cheater" in the residential oil delivery business. Ford owned that market in the old days with C series and LN's and even F-800's and 8000's. The 750 specs will work. this was a market they owned! Do they advertise? Nope On another advertising note, Light and Medium Truck Mag also caters to the utility industry. 750's are a very popular truck at least in New England with several utilities as big bucket trucks. What does Ford advertise in that mag? F-350's with 10' boxes! They don't even advertise the LCF. Which on second thought, says that ay be a dead duck in anycase if Bluediamond goes away.

Thx for the update- if someone should know you would think a guy such as your buddy would have some sort of inside track on the rumor mill. As for the GM/International thing, I still say it reminds me of what happened to the GM class 8's with "WhiteGMC" As someone explained to me, it was a gimmick to keep GM from being sued in the short term. Think of the devaluation of a franchise if all of a sudden your supplier says..."by the way, in x months you no longer will have a product line to sell."

Well I have to disagree with you big time here. Ford built this truck from 2000 to 2003 in their plant in Cautillan Mexico. So what's the big deal? Did they throw the prints away? And as others have pointed out, its not exactly rocket science. How much did it cost to engineer the Ford GT-40- excuse me Ford GT? A 1000 "halo" car project! And as for your comment on Hino not being a new effort as they are big world wide, I don't beleive they have ever built a conventional such as they are building in this country. And more importantly, my point is, Hino (Toyota) has the nerve to jump into this market from scratch. I don't care how many trucks they sell in the rest of the world, they think there is a good business case to go after this market in this country- with no customer base and no dealer base. The point is Ford is the commercial truck leader in class 4-7. They should walk away from this? More defeatist bullshit!

"Working on it" to the degree it will be built in this country, in a Navistar plant, by the end of the year!

Richard- Why ae you forgetting KTP? It was the biggest HD truck plant in the world when it was opened in 69. I've also been told by KTP people that they in fact have an extra line available. But whatever- It WAS a heavy truck plant and was reconfigured to build Super Duty in 98. seems logical it would go back. And you and 7 Mary are right of course- big question is what happens to 650/750 as Bluediamond falls apart. Logic says it goes back to Cautilan where it was built when it first came out in 2000 but again, in spite of the labor advantage, there has to be some big cost shipping the cabs to Mexico ( I assume 650/750 cabs are built or stamped at KTP?) and then the freight in shipping the finished truck back North. As for dropping 650/750, Ford is the market leader by a huge margin in 4- 7 trucks. Why would they quit? Now I know someone will say .."they can't make money" or .."its not a core business" but I say that is bullshit. Toyota is starting from scratch building Hino 6 and 7 trucks in this country. From scratch! And Ford can't compete when they have a legacy in the business?????

Edstock. A gold bulldog signified truck was powered by a Maxidyne engine which Mack introduced in 66/67. It was a departure in engine design as it was mated to a five speed (six for off road use) and had a broad usefull rpm band- you lugged it down to 1200 RPMs before downshifting. A silver dog was a non -Maxidyne Mack engine - or it could have been a vendor engine.

Well for those of you who read these forums and have an interest in big trucks, Friday I believe marks the end of the no compete that was established as a part of the deal when the Trotman/Nassar clique gave the big truck business away to Daimler. Much has been said about the likelihood of Ford jumping back into class 8 or even "baby eights" (tandem 750) but I was thinking that a couple of thigs have been changing rapidly over the last couple of years. It seams that the trend in big trucks is going back to some degree of vertical integration- at least as far as engines go. Remember the old days when a Mack was truly a Mack and even a GM with a Detroit in it was a GM. Well look around- Sterling/Fr'liner/W'Star will have Mercedes, Mack/Volvo will have Volvo, Paccar will have their DAF conection. Navistar will have their MaxForce/MAN connection. What volume does that leave for Cat and Cummins.? Maybe survival for these two might mean some sort of partnership with someone else????? Just a thought.

My two cents. I guess I truly am a loser. I have an 07 CV Sport that is great and an 04 Ranger Super Cab FX4,Level II. Both great vehicles that the brilliant planners have banished from the future product slate. And the sad fact is, both could be revived without spending a fortune. I've posted may times about the great MPG of my CV, its comfort and its reliability. The one it replaced had 216,000 and was bought in two hours after the want ad rag hit the newstand. It was going oversees so the ramp truck driver said who picked it up. As for the Ranger, its as everyone has previously described. Great value for someone who wants the convenience of a pick up without paying the price of a 150-or Ram -or Silverado. It replaced an 89 that I bought with 47,000 on it and on which my two sons learned how to drive a stick through high school, then they both took it to college ad with almost 200,000 on it, I gave it to friend who replaced the auto hubs with manuals, changed the dome cover gaskets and its still going strong. Also, key point, how many years ago was it one of the top 10 sellers in the US? Not that many. My only hope is that unlike the idiots who have been calling the shots, Mulally is reviewing a lot of recent decisions and is asking the kind of questions that will produce answers that seem so obvious to many of us. If he can salvage 20 years of name recognition with the Taurus, maybe its not too late to reverse some of these other dumb moves. Why give up on segments you've owned???

Anyone's guess but given the fact that Ford IS the commercial truck leader, I find it hard to believe they would give up any segment. Give up 650/750 and the next thing you know Hino/Freightliner are nibbling at 550, then 450 sales. I think a key issue will be can they incorporate production into KTP. Assuming they are trucking/railing the cabs to Mexico now, and given freight alone in bringing finished units up. maybe all the other cost penalties will be slightly off set. Other side of the coin, they built 650/750 before i the Ford plant at Cautilan so maybe they can move it back there. Again when I look at what Ford's market share was in the old days in class 7, I shake my head. And class 8 was certainly better then what Sterling has managed to accomplish today. Ok all of you who say Ford never made any money in big trucks, flame away. but while you are at it, you better send an a few e-mails to Toyota (Hino) and F'liner and tell them they are losing their ass! And by the way, on your Hino e-mail, copy Roger Penske because as smart a guy as he is, he hasn't figured out yet that backing Hino in their push to be a player in class 6 and 7 is going to cost him his fortune!

I'm amazed this hasn't happened sooner. When you think of the strides made in electronic control of everything and the parasitic loss that has to exist around a camshaft actuated valve system, its seems its a worthwhile objective that will pay off big time.

Good point-which is what I thought this thread was all about before we started talking about Accuras! Also as someone else pointed out who seemed to have some KTP knowledge, on whatever line /process the Excursion was built, some potential exists. Think about what KTP was during the old days- the largest heavy duty truck plant in the world Building vehicles as diverse as the C series cabover, the high tilts (W's then CL's,) F series, and of course Louisvilles. One other point that you made, I would bet that the bulk of KTP's Super Duty production is truly commercial- not the 150 "FX-4" Off rd pkg! Real question in my mind is, in this day when commonality of components can be truly beneficial, how can you justify a separate cab structure for 150 and SD? If the cab structure was combined what kind of efficiencies would that produce? Perhaps that might figure into the F-100 equation as well. Last point, while you make valid points about the CAFE issue, I hate to sound like a broken record but my 07 CV Sport with 3.27 gears and its antiquated 4 speed,gets a solid 22-23+ mpg. Right now with snows on it and five concrete blocks in the trunk-I live in snow country- its showing 21.5-22. Chop a foot of overhang off each end, throw a 5 or speed in it, and what would it get? Not the best but there will be a market for such vehicles- IMO And for those who hate Panthers- fine stretch the Mustang platform. Although I do like a frame- but again I date myself!

IMO the entire interview was one softball after another with the obvious answers. Alan is "the man" in my book for the job. But he didn't reveal anything but the obvious. No mention of any specific product info other then ...Lighter, more economical, greener blah blah. Some comments about the need to integrate the world wide effort but no specifics. Nothing about diesel technology and with so much of ford resting on the success of the 150 and commercial trucks (200,000 plus Power Strokes a year right?) and with the GM announcement this week of the new GM/Navistar "love in". maybe a question about Ford's relationship with Navistar might be in order. And maybe even a question about the future of RWD in Ford platforms. One thing that did come across was the size of the task to bring about all the changes at once in products, manufacturing efficiencies, relationships withe the UAW etc, but I wish he had taken a stronger shot at the guy from the WSJ as they are the idiots who always push the "short term results" button. Which in my book is the one thing that has put ALL American industry in trouble. Everyone is driven to look good by the next quarter so they will get a good press review. Instant results except it just leads to real lasting long term problems.

Well nothing to "Lightenup on"- no sarcasm intended-and nothing offensive (I hope) in my question. Just looking for any facts anyone might have. As for 2012, as a stockholder, I would hope that is not the case. Lets face it- the expiration of the no compete in February is not a surprise. The ongoing downward spiral with Navistar is what? Two years old? And we are not talking about some radical new OTR tractor- at least I hope not. If they learned their lesson 10 years ago, they hopefully know that their niche is a vocational one- not "large cars" as the guys who buy those will never buy anything but a KW, a Pete or even a Freightliner. But it would not take a ton of engineering to slap a heavier front axle, a frame with a higher RBM, and a tandem suspension on a 750 and you have a new 66,000 gvw dump truck chassis that could be cost effective. Or an 80,000 GCW day cab tractor. Keep in mind, we loyal guys who bought big Fords 10 years ago are getting older. There still plenty of us around but as time goes by, so does the connection to what was a very loyal customer base. And, who IS Al Stewart?

OK I'l bite. And the basis for your statement is??? What happens betwseen now and 20012? I can't believe Bluediamond can survive that long. I don't think International is willing to do anything that will keep ford as a promnent competitior.

Hard to believe! Some good news with respect to Ranger. And lets hope it truly is a "truck" instead of some yuppie featherweight. Leaf springs??? A good sign! Again a segment that Ford owned but then neglected. Remember it was not that long ago that in the list of top ten selling vehicles Ford had ranger, Taurus, 150, and Explorer. Only bad news in the post was no mention of a RWD sedan.

Well I've printed the 08 order guide and it appears to be as complete as the 07's. As for sales, using June YTD, Ford had 14.4% of class 6 and 7 sales, vs 7.4% for GM/Chev, 30.6% for Freightliner, and 30.8% for International. The big question remains, what happens to Bluediamond. If the Ford/Navistar brawl continues and they part company, what does Ford do? Move everything back to the Mexican plant that built the 2000-2003 650/750??? To those who say they should get out given their financial position and the competing programs, I just look at Hino (Toyota). these guys have 3.8 % of class 6 and 7 and they are aggressive in everything they do. I see class 7 Hino tractors o a regular basis and I have NEVER seen a 750 tractor on the road since the 650/750 came out in 2000! Why? I guess they just don't market- even though they offer a tractor package. And think about it- Ford was a major player in the old days when it came to class 7 city delivery tractors. Today? You won't see one. As with a lot of things at Ford. They owned a particular market (Ranger, Crown Vic) and they piss it away. Let's hope it doesn't happen with these trucks as well.

Why bother- but again, sheer stupidity. The car is bullet proof. My last one had 218,000 on it, looked great and was sold within two hours when the weekly want ad rag came out. The buyer? It was going oversees. My "new" one? An 07 Sport that in 11 mos has 41,000 miles on it, last saw the dealer when it was delivered, and gets 22.5 mpg typically in mixed driving and close to 24 when driven at 70/75 highway. Doesn't sell? of course- a self fullfilling prophecy. No marketing, no inventory and no effort. In the meantime the only thing we read about is all the RWD variants that will soon be coming to market by others. Cadillac has a revived image based on rear wheel drive, has the "Car of the Year" ( I agree -screw MT but its still "press") and what do we Ford people have? Another FWD /"AWD" shitbox from Lincoln. Flame away geniuses!

No its called "Freedom of Choice". For the outside guy looking in who is working at Wal-Mrt or some other shit hole its a better opportunity. To the guy who has put 20 years in, it protects his senioritybecause there is someone coming in beneath him. Two tier will work. And what is your option to this? learn Spanish and move? And to the guy that says--"we all should take the hit"- stand up at your ratification meeting and say that. Flame away. PS Loyal shareholder who has supported Ford and its workers for more years then I want to admit.

Amazing! Actually capitalizing on a strength instead of ignoring it and letting it die on the vine a la Lincoln LS, THUNDERBIRD- AND YES- PANTHER!

The Sterling dealers will continue to sell the Sterling Bullet which is a Dodge pickup with a different grill. If that relationship continues, I'm sure the Sprinter deal will continue. It makes sense for both companies.

I did a post on the employee forum theother day asking if anyone at KTP saw signs of any line modification that would indicate 650/750 (850??!!) was coming back to Louisville. Igot one respose in which the basically saidthey didn't knowwhat shift they would beworking never mind if big jobs were coming back. I had an e-mail from someone in Commercial truckat Ford who said 650/750/LCF were very much in their plans for the future-we shall see. And goinbroke2, you are correct- we all see the old Fords everyday still on the job. Ford owned the vocational truck market and they pissed it away. sad part is the 750 has the specs to do a lot of those jobs today (home oil delivery) but they don't aggresively go after anything- brain dead marketers IMO

How about it KTP. The Trucking/Construction Equipment rags keep running stories about the pending end of the no compete and will Ford get back into class 8's - or "baby 8's" for that matter (an F-750 with a tandem.) With things not exactly "friendly" between Ford and Navistar, if the wheels come off the Bluediamond JV where does 650/750 go? Any signs of activity at KTP that might indicate a different product line?