Mags10

Do you remember by chance what the tranny temp would run on your 450 when pulling? We just got back from the PNW, and in 100+ temps across northern Nevada the Allison tranny in our 3500 High Country dually would normally be +/- 175deg pulling a 15k lb fifth wheel RV. The highest I saw it get to was 181deg pulling a several mile long incline. I had to punt on an F450 as well, or this summer’s trip wouldn’t have happened. I’ve heard several guys say the Ford 10 speed runs up to and over 200deg (which may be fine).

Let’s look at the sales numbers going back to 2017, because they reveal why there is so much aggravation with Ford by many on here, including me. Dealers would sell trucks if they could get them, they aren’t the problem. Data is from Motrolix. I’m going to combine the GM brands since they are the same truck except for a grille and badging. 2017 to 2019 was the boom time for Ford. Let’s round the numbers below off to an average of 900,000 trucks per year. 2017 - 896764 units 2018 - 909330 units 2019 - 896526 units GM trucks during that time were pretty consistent as well. I’ll go with an average of 805,000 trucks per year. 2017 - 803807 units 2018 - 805135 units 2019 - 807923 units Now let’s look at the Covid years. In 2020, Ford sold 787422 trucks, or about 113000 less than the prior 3 year average, whereas GM sold 847110, over 40000 more than their 3 year average. In 2021, Ford sold 726004 trucks, or 174000 less that the ‘17-‘19 average, whereas GM sold 768689, or about 36000 less than their ‘17-‘19 average. 2022 is the staggering year. Ford sold 653957 trucks, or 246000 less, whereas GM sold 764771, or 40000 less. For 2023, let’s double the first 6 months for a rough projection of a yearly number. Ford is on track to sell 765000 trucks, or 135000 less than the ‘17-‘19 average, whereas GM is on track to sell 822000 trucks, or 17000 more than their ‘17-‘19 average. The moral here is GM navigated the “supply chain” issues incredibly better than Ford. Ford went off the rails, and hasn’t recovered yet. This should cause management to do a serious introspective look, and if they don’t see a problem, they aren't being intellectually honest. This would be a fantastic case study for an MBA student somewhere. It’s time to stop blaming the supply chain, stop blaming dealers, and stop telling your customers to “shut up and wait.”

I’ll second that curiosity. My wife will argue they are focusing too many resources on the Lightning.

I think it could change in ‘24. In my area, the Ford dealership lots are filling up with F150s, up to and including Platinums (or “Platinum-minus”, cause they are still missing options), and discounts are back. Same with GM, except they fixed almost all of their deletes due to supply chain problems in the latter half of ‘22. I’d say the trucks are piling up because of interest rates. So, as enough buyers are pushed to the sidelines, the situation should get better.

Dealer lots in our area are starting to fill up with trucks, when they were barren before. Not Superduties, but F150s, up to and including quite a few Platinums (albeit missing options). I’m assuming interest rates must be having an effect. Maybe things will finally get straightened out in 2024 for Superduties as well.

I’m going to go ahead and put in a 450 Platinum order for ‘24. I don’t expect it will get built, but I’ll be ready to trade the Chevy dually High Country by then. If it shows up, great. If it doesn’t, I’ll be back in a GM again I guess. Just for kicks, I checked to see if there are any F150 Platinums within a 100 mile radius of home. There are 84 (albeit missing options). I thought it was odd to find that many F150 Platinums available, with them building so few ‘23 Superduty Platinums.

Agree on all points, I wouldn’t take it either without multi contour, and I’m not interested in the trading game either. The ‘23 model year KRs and above are going to be unicorns.

Aside from all the cameras, buttons, and technology I haven’t gotten used to yet, the thing I like the most is the Allison 10 speed. I’ve never in forty years driven any vehicle from any manufacturer that shifts as smooth as this tranny. If you didn’t hear the rpm change, you wouldn’t know it just shifted. I wish they had the multi contour seats though. But then, no guarantee I would have gotten them anyway with the F450.

That’s why I had the 450 on order. I have to say tho after driving the Chevy 3500 dually for 6 months now, it’s a pretty darn nice truck. No CP4 pump either.

Don’t know, but the clock was going to start fresh with what the dealer said was another 6-9 months. It was a Platinum, so job 2. I figured the new estimate would likely be no better than the initial one I had in January of ‘22, so I pulled the plug and bought a Chevy High Country. As it turns out, that looks accurate. Maybe next time.

I was a 2, when the order had to be rolled to a ‘23. And it had been a 2 for a while….

I suspect you are a Job 2 order? Your situation will likely dictate, but for what’s it’s worth, I really wish I had left my F450 Platty order out there, just to see how long it would have actually taken to get it. By then it may have been time to trade again anyway.

All this chatter doesn’t solve anything. The first step for an alcoholic to actually get better is for said alcoholic to actually acknowledge that a problem exists. A system that relies on dealer competence to manage an order bank so a customer can actually get a truck is BROKEN. Period. Fix it, Ford. A system that has a customer order a truck in January of ‘22, then VERY LIKELY not receive it in 2023 and have it roll to a ‘24 with God only knows how many more months of delay is BROKEN. Spare me the “supply chain issues” comments. GM got it figured out. Every single option on my High Country works. Fix it, Ford. Regarding the dealer protectionism allocation model…look at the Tesla model and my Elon Musk comment. He would have this BS at Ford fixed inside of two weeks. “It’s much more complicated than just what you see as a consumer” Huh? No, not really. All that matters is WHAT THE CONSUMER SEES. That’s Marketing 101.

Wholeheartedly agree. This isn’t rocket science. We need Elon Musk to ditch Twitter and buy Ford. He’d have this nonsense fixed inside of two weeks.

All good points, and this above is why we punted. I think seeing a ‘23 Platty or Limited will be about as rare as a Yeti sighting. Until enough brand agnostic folks (like me), together with enough blindly brand loyal folks, see the light and send them a message thru their purchase decisions, nothing will change (because it doesn’t have to).