TStag Posted June 11, 2007 Author Share Posted June 11, 2007 UK government being told of Ford's intentions to sell Land Rover and Jaguar according to the BBC: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/6741809.stm This practically signals the end of Ford in Britain. Ford made a big deal recently about the fact that Jag and Land Rover was it's representation in the UK. It's a shame, there have been some great Fords from Britain like the original GT40 and the Capri. Ford UK racing teams were legendary. I think the press will play on ford quitting Britain as ford meant a lot to Brits (Brits really did adopt it), a lot of die hard Ford fans may well switch to GM over this. Suddenly even Toyota seems more British.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TStag Posted June 11, 2007 Author Share Posted June 11, 2007 So is there anyone else here that thinks Ford would do just fine with Ford Lincoln Mercury Mazda and Volvo? Maybe Ford is at the point where they should focus on those 5 brands and let Jag and LR go if the price is right. I hate to see the Company sell anything...but if it would improve their focus on those 5 brands...then let Jag and LR go. In the end...Ford is and always was a volume producer of lower to moderately priced automobiles. Most reports seem to suggest Volvo is up for sale. BMW being linked again. Apparantly BMW are even preparing for a fourth brand and have started JV talks with Mercedes on the basis of this! So I think it's reasonable to think that Volvo's going too. Guy's Ford is screwed. It's selling all the best bit's off. Don't bet against Mazda shares being sold off. Ford needs the cash! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LincolnFan Posted June 11, 2007 Share Posted June 11, 2007 About time, I mean the British government is a joke. They crowned that idiot Ghosn a knight while Bill Ford was too busy throwing money at their shitty companies. To hell with Jaguar and LR. Bring on the Lincolns. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
one2gamble Posted June 11, 2007 Share Posted June 11, 2007 In a separate report in City AM, private equity firm Alchemy Partners was said to be lining up a £3bn offer for the two luxury brands. If they only get 3b for these two Ford deserves to go under, actually selling them at all and they deserve to go under.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted June 11, 2007 Share Posted June 11, 2007 Your link says this little interesting passage: The reports that Ford had named three banks to sell Land Rover and Jaguar first surfaced in the Financial Times. In a separate report in City AM, private equity firm Alchemy Partners was said to be lining up a £3bn offer for the two luxury brands. Ford would only sell Jaguar and Land Rover if it could get good money for them. £3 Billion, is that about US$5 -6 Billion? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bolita Posted June 11, 2007 Share Posted June 11, 2007 UK government being told of Ford's intentions to sell Land Rover and Jaguar according to the BBC: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/6741809.stm This practically signals the end of Ford in Britain. Ford made a big deal recently about the fact that Jag and Land Rover was it's representation in the UK. It's a shame, there have been some great Fords from Britain like the original GT40 and the Capri. Ford UK racing teams were legendary. I think the press will play on ford quitting Britain as ford meant a lot to Brits (Brits really did adopt it), a lot of die hard Ford fans may well switch to GM over this. Suddenly even Toyota seems more British.... I think it is a little extreme to think that because Ford dumps Land Rover & Jaguar - that it will be the end of Ford in GB. Ford was #1 before they picked up LR & Jag. How long ago was it that Ford injected 2 billion into Jaguar anyway? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edstock Posted June 11, 2007 Share Posted June 11, 2007 Guys, Guys, Guys remember that Ford NORTH AMERICA is the only business marque that has the mortgage payment coming due in 2009, not the other ones! You're right. Ford UK has no mortgage payment to make. Ford Europe has no mortgage payment to make. Ford Brazil has no mortgage payment to make. Ford South Africa has no mortgage payment to make. Ford Australia has no mortgage payment to make. Ford Thailand, Ford Russia, Ford China, well, you can figure it out. The point is, there is a lot more to the Ford brand, and a lot of other sources of revenue, besides Ford US. Fade to black? Not any time soon. Payments will make profits slimmer, but it looks like Ford has and is acquiring the product to make that profit. 2K9 will be here soon, and we'll know. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wescoent Posted June 11, 2007 Share Posted June 11, 2007 So, rumor has it Ford got offered 6 billion for the Jaguar Land Rover package by a PE firm. Ford paid about 3.6 billion for Land Rover, and 3.2 billion for Jaguar, so its not a TOTAL wash like the Daimler-Chrysler deal was. While part of me is convinced that if Ford waited a couple of years, they could get a MUCH better price for it (with the XF and XJ on sale), I do not trust Europe's climate Nazis to pull any punches with the GW frenzy kicking into high gear. New regulations could make those brands worthless. Ford can do a lot with 6 billion in cash. Develop an all-new flexible global RWD platform for Ford-Mercury-Lincoln, for starters... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edstock Posted June 11, 2007 Share Posted June 11, 2007 In the end...Ford is and always was a volume producer of lower to moderately priced automobiles. Well, Ford has been building luxury Lincolns for approximately 80 years. That's a long time. The point is, 80 years means Ford has a legitimate claim to a luxury market presence — under the Lincoln badge. However, the last 20-25 years have not been good to the brand, and it will take time to fix. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TStag Posted June 11, 2007 Author Share Posted June 11, 2007 Daggers are out for under pressure Mullaly now: Source: Times Online Ford could soon sell Jaguar and Land Rover, its premier British marques, after the American car giant appointed banks to examine a sale. The move comes only months after Ford said that its Premier Automotive Group, which links the luxury marques, was performing well. News that Ford has appointed HSBC, Goldman Sachs and Morgan Stanley throws the businesses into fresh uncertainty less than a year after a series of reviews at Ford questioned their viability and then appeared to reprieve them. The expected sale of the brands comes after Ford sold Aston Martin for £450 million to a venture capital consortium led by the racing driver David Richards. Jaguar and Land Rover are expected to be sold together because they have been heavily integrated by Ford. They share components and production facilities. Premier Automotive, which also includes Volvo of Sweden, saw its losses more than treble last year to $327 million from $89 million in 2005. Last year Ford recorded the worst losses in its 103-year history at $12.7 billion, equal to a loss of $4,380 on every car it sold. The first-quarter profits from Premier Automotive improved to $191 million this year from $129 million for the same period in 2006. Yesterday Jon Moulton, the head of the venture capital group Alchemy, said at first he would be interested in bidding. Later Mr Moulton, who failed in an attempt to buy Rover seven years ago, pulled back, saying that he was only showing an emotional interest. A sale of Land Rover and Jaguar is likely to attract the interest of other leading car companies, unlike Aston Martin, which was not viewed as a key asset. Premier Automotive has been dogged by the underperformance of Jaguar, which is loss-making. Land Rover, meanwhile, is believed to have been strong. However, Ford appeared to give Jaguar backing last year when it invested $1.2 billion into the operation. Jaguar stumbled after Ford, which bought the brand in 1989, attempted to move it into the volume market with the cheaper X-type model. The car, which is made at Halewood, was poorly received because of similarities to Ford’s Mondeo, with which it shared some design and parts. Together Jaguar and Land Rover employ about 19,000 at three main sites: Solihull and Castle Brom-wich in the West Midlands and Halewood on Merseyside. Ford declined to confirm or deny an impending sale, describing the idea as speculation. Alan Mulally, Ford’s chief executive, is under pressure to turn around the huge losses at the business. Ford is cutting 12 per cent of its US workforce. He set out a business plan last year when the sale of Aston Martin was announced. But analysts believe that the plan may now be in shreds because of poor sales in North America. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bolita Posted June 11, 2007 Share Posted June 11, 2007 Daggers are out for under pressure Mullaly now: Source: Times Online Ford could soon sell Jaguar and Land Rover, its premier British marques, after the American car giant appointed banks to examine a sale. The move comes only months after Ford said that its Premier Automotive Group, which links the luxury marques, was performing well. News that Ford has appointed HSBC, Goldman Sachs and Morgan Stanley throws the businesses into fresh uncertainty less than a year after a series of reviews at Ford questioned their viability and then appeared to reprieve them. The expected sale of the brands comes after Ford sold Aston Martin for £450 million to a venture capital consortium led by the racing driver David Richards. Jaguar and Land Rover are expected to be sold together because they have been heavily integrated by Ford. They share components and production facilities. Premier Automotive, which also includes Volvo of Sweden, saw its losses more than treble last year to $327 million from $89 million in 2005. Last year Ford recorded the worst losses in its 103-year history at $12.7 billion, equal to a loss of $4,380 on every car it sold. The first-quarter profits from Premier Automotive improved to $191 million this year from $129 million for the same period in 2006. Yesterday Jon Moulton, the head of the venture capital group Alchemy, said at first he would be interested in bidding. Later Mr Moulton, who failed in an attempt to buy Rover seven years ago, pulled back, saying that he was only showing an emotional interest. A sale of Land Rover and Jaguar is likely to attract the interest of other leading car companies, unlike Aston Martin, which was not viewed as a key asset. Premier Automotive has been dogged by the underperformance of Jaguar, which is loss-making. Land Rover, meanwhile, is believed to have been strong. However, Ford appeared to give Jaguar backing last year when it invested $1.2 billion into the operation. Jaguar stumbled after Ford, which bought the brand in 1989, attempted to move it into the volume market with the cheaper X-type model. The car, which is made at Halewood, was poorly received because of similarities to Ford’s Mondeo, with which it shared some design and parts. Together Jaguar and Land Rover employ about 19,000 at three main sites: Solihull and Castle Brom-wich in the West Midlands and Halewood on Merseyside. Ford declined to confirm or deny an impending sale, describing the idea as speculation. Alan Mulally, Ford’s chief executive, is under pressure to turn around the huge losses at the business. Ford is cutting 12 per cent of its US workforce. He set out a business plan last year when the sale of Aston Martin was announced. But analysts believe that the plan may now be in shreds because of poor sales in North America. So, according to this, only LR & Jag are on the table and not Volvo. I don't know - seems to me that PAG and Ford is pretty integrated in Europe.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TStag Posted June 11, 2007 Author Share Posted June 11, 2007 It's interesting to note that the price is going up for Land Rover and Jag. I think Ford will get more for the UK business than it hoped. Land Rover is generally considered the new BMW in the UK and as I've said before it has the brand equity to start making cars with much bigger margins than Volvo. I'm actually looking forward now to Land Rover being free of Ford. Ford has starved Land Rover of cash when it want's to replace the Defender, build the Landie and a Freelander sports model. A private equity firm will fuel Land Rover and fix Jaguar. No more crappy retro Jag's, maybe a new F type, no more stupid consumer survey in the USA and no more giving other Ford divisions designs like the DB7. Meet Land Rover/ Jaguar - the new Porsche! Ohh and all that Ford investment will be usefull... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blue II Posted June 11, 2007 Share Posted June 11, 2007 UK government being told of Ford's intentions to sell Land Rover and Jaguar according to the BBC: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/6741809.stm This practically signals the end of Ford in Britain. Ford made a big deal recently about the fact that Jag and Land Rover was it's representation in the UK. It's a shame, there have been some great Fords from Britain like the original GT40 and the Capri. Ford UK racing teams were legendary. I think the press will play on ford quitting Britain as ford meant a lot to Brits (Brits really did adopt it), a lot of die hard Ford fans may well switch to GM over this. Suddenly even Toyota seems more British.... What was your opinion of Ford before they bought Jag and LR? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edstock Posted June 11, 2007 Share Posted June 11, 2007 This practically signals the end of Ford in Britain. Really? They keep on selling Mondeos and Fiestas and Kas and Transits and other sleds and building diesels in Dagenham. Ford UK had gotten on quite successfully for almost 80 years before PAG came into being, and should continue if Jag and L-R are liquidated, because they've got product and long-established, successful dealers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
suv_guy_19 Posted June 12, 2007 Share Posted June 12, 2007 I think you have that backwards.... I would say reallly backwards....It will be sad to see lr go....jaguar not so much. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardJensen Posted June 12, 2007 Share Posted June 12, 2007 1) Volvo is used as security in Ford's loan, Jaguar and Land Rover are not. Volvo is not for sale. 2) g48150 should shut up about mortgage payments. Ford is already paying interest on the loan. Continually making knowing and thoroughly inaccurate references to Ford loan payments is not productive. 3) As has been mentioned before, everything is for sale. If Ford got a sizable offer privately, it may have moved them to consider a public sale. However, I do not believe that selling Jag and LR to bail out the NA ops makes any sense. Ford will not sell Jag/LR under the table--nor are they likely to wrap up a deal within a few weeks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mackinaw Posted June 12, 2007 Share Posted June 12, 2007 Volvo is used as security in Ford's loan, Jaguar and Land Rover are not. Volvo is not for sale. Wish this was the case, but apparently it's not. This is from today's Detroit News. BTW, the sale of PAG is now called "Project Swift." http://www.detnews.com/apps/pbcs.dll/artic.../1148&imw=Y Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardJensen Posted June 12, 2007 Share Posted June 12, 2007 Wish this was the case, but apparently it's not. http://www.iht.com/articles/2006/11/27/bloomberg/bxford.php Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mackinaw Posted June 12, 2007 Share Posted June 12, 2007 http://www.iht.com/articles/2006/11/27/bloomberg/bxford.php Richard, I'm with you on this one but I fear for the worse. Here's another article from today's Detroit Free Press: http://www.freep.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article...ESS01/706120335 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickF1011 Posted June 12, 2007 Share Posted June 12, 2007 I think it might be time to become a BMW fan instead. I just don't see myself buying a Ford product again anytime soon, unfortunately. This is all terribly disappointing, and will do nothing but instill a sense of fear in consumers who are going to shy away from a "desperate" Ford. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardJensen Posted June 12, 2007 Share Posted June 12, 2007 Richard, I'm with you on this one but I fear for the worse. Here's another article from today's Detroit Free Press: http://www.freep.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article...ESS01/706120335 It's not a question of you being 'with me on this one'. It's a question of fact. Ford's stake in Volvo is used as security in their current loan package. They cannot sell Volvo without renegotiating their loans. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mackinaw Posted June 12, 2007 Share Posted June 12, 2007 Ford's stake in Volvo is used as security in their current loan package. They cannot sell Volvo without renegotiating their loans. Your last sentence says it all. If the new Ford management figures that it's in the long-term best interest of the company to renegotiate these loans, they will do so. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mackinaw Posted June 12, 2007 Share Posted June 12, 2007 Newest update from the Detroit News. It's significant that only Jag and LR seem to be on the table, at least for now: http://www.detnews.com/apps/pbcs.dll/artic...PDATE/706120415 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickF1011 Posted June 12, 2007 Share Posted June 12, 2007 Ford currently sells the most luxury cars in the US. They'll be damn near dead last after this goes through. Way to go, Ford!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Reynolds Posted June 12, 2007 Share Posted June 12, 2007 I'm still left scratching my head, I have friends that work for PAG in Irvine........and the only rumors circulating around that place is a move to Dearborn. Anyhow it is a dumb idea, and there is a way to have Lincoln, Jaguar, and Volvo operating under one house (I purposely left off LR) and compliment one another. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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