National Health Care

[mountaineerwv]

Yea, cut benifits and raise the money coming in. Ask my grandmother.

 

Which way is the US headed compared to the world in rankings???? I'll give you one guess and it's not up.

 

What do you liberals do best?? Let me ask you this, if I was to invent the worlds greatest invention(whatever that may be) your saying I owe it to you, your entitled to it???

 

 

Which ranking? Our WHO health ranking, since we are talking about National Health Care, right?

 

If you invented a cure for cancer, wouldn't you want everyone to have it? What if the government helped to fund your research and supplied you with a grant?

 

You are confusing entitlements with responsibilities. The government has the responsibility to make its' citizens' lives safer and to supply basic services like public education, public transportation, pubic water/sewer systems, ... and a public health system. After all, it takes a village!!!!!!

[mountaineerwv]

Any UAW member earning what you do who would want to pay more in taxes and then have to wait behind someone who just got of the boat and has not paid into the system is a fool.

 

"9 months on the waiting list, just take these pain pills till then and hope you do not go into withdrawal after the surgery and no more pills"

"I don't care if you do not like my attitude or the service, this is it so shut up and get in line"

"I know you paid 40% of your $70k income in taxes but you still have to wait behind all these illegal and legal immigrants who are collecting social services"

FOOLS FOOLS FOOLS, YOU SHALL REAP WHAT YOU SOW!

 

As a UAW member, is your pension and health benefits safely in place? Are you guaranteed your retirement benefits? Who would hold the companies to their promises if not the government? I know, the corporations do not need oversight as they always have the best interests of their employees in mind, right?

 

Ford, GM, Chrysler would all like a national health care plan since they want to rid themselves of the BILLIONs in future health promises.

 

The Fools are those who are not pushing for a National Health Care System. Stop spending BILLIONs on Iraq and Bechtel and Haliburton and other corrupt contractors and spend it on it's own citizens!!!

[mountaineerwv]

Any UAW member earning what you do who would want to pay more in taxes and then have to wait behind someone who just got of the boat and has not paid into the system is a fool.

 

"9 months on the waiting list, just take these pain pills till then and hope you do not go into withdrawal after the surgery and no more pills"

"I don't care if you do not like my attitude or the service, this is it so shut up and get in line"

"I know you paid 40% of your $70k income in taxes but you still have to wait behind all these illegal and legal immigrants who are collecting social services"

FOOLS FOOLS FOOLS, YOU SHALL REAP WHAT YOU SOW!

 

So you want to throw away a chance at a National Health Care System because you are afraid that some illegal will get some service? We can have a better system, with better outcomes at a lower cost, but you are afraid that Pancho will get a free shot? Now, that is FOOLISH.

 

What is happening today when they show up at an emergency room? How expensive is that service? You are paying now, my friend, and for a VERY EXPENSIVE medical treatment at your emergency centers. That is FOOLISH.

[mountaineerwv]

OK, since you guys do not believe me, maybe you will believe a Doctor: Dr. John P. Geyman, Professor Emeritus of Family Medicine at the University of Washington. I know it will not sink in, but what the heck, I like to stir the pot!!!!!

 

http://www.pnhp.org/reader/Section%208%20-...%20(Geyman).pdf

[fmccap]

Where did I say SS was overfunded? Typical conservative crap, make stuff up.

You did not. It is a FACT, LOOK IT UP.

[fmccap]

You are thick, aren't you? SS is not going broke, just ask Alan Greenspan.

 

Some one lied to you. I asked him and he told me the opposite.

SOCIAL SECURITY REPORT

Former Federal Reserve chairman, Alan Greenspan, reported to Congress that the social security system cannot survive, without massive tax increases together with major benefit cuts. Of course every congress person already knew that, but they prefer Greenspan to say it instead of them. Meanwhile they allow every penny of paid in surplus to the trust fund to be siphoned-off to support other spending, as fast as it arrives. And still they say they want to 'save social security.'

Edited October 7, 2007 by fmccap

[fmccap]

Wasted the money? How was it wasted? On the little old grannies out there?

Wow, for all the edumacation you say I lack. You don't seem to have any common sense. The answer to your question is that they take the surpluses out of the funds they belong to and put them in a general fund leaving IOU's in the fund that it came from. They waste it on there porkbarrel projects and special interests.

[fmccap]

Which ranking? Our WHO health ranking, since we are talking about National Health Care, right?

Once again, did you go to one of those great public schools our government provides?????? That explains the current situation in this country.

 

Read your post #183. The

The Government also administers many programs more efficiently than the private sector, like public schools.

part.

 

I know it's hard to understand FACTS. We were talking about National Health Care and you decided to bring up public schools as something the government does right.

[mountaineerwv]

SOCIAL SECURITY REPORT

 

My turn:

 

http://www.usatoday.com/news/washington/20...-usat-fri_x.htm

 

Excerpt:

 

Federal Reserve Chairman Alan Greenspan said Thursday that Social Security is not in "crisis" as President Bush has declared, but emphasized that Congress must quickly address future funding problems in the program and far larger shortfalls in Medicare.

 

http://www.csmonitor.com/2005/0127/p09s01-coop.html

 

Excerpt:

 

Is Social Security headed for a crisis sooner than thought? Although President Bush says so, not everyone agrees. The system's trustees estimate the Social Security trust fund is in good shape for another four decades. The nonpartisan Congressional Budget Office figures five decades. Many independent economists think Social Security is healthy for more like six or seven decades.

 

http://asp1.umbc.edu/newmedia/sites/chetah...SSA_RS%2016.pdf

 

 

http://www.dollarsandsense.org/archives/2004/1104orr.html

 

 

Social Security is not "in crisis". Medicare is the real looming problem.

[fmccap]

My turn:

 

http://www.usatoday.com/news/washington/20...-usat-fri_x.htm

 

Excerpt:

 

Federal Reserve Chairman Alan Greenspan said Thursday that Social Security is not in "crisis" as President Bush has declared, but emphasized that Congress must quickly address future funding problems in the program and far larger shortfalls in Medicare.

 

http://www.csmonitor.com/2005/0127/p09s01-coop.html

 

Excerpt:

 

Is Social Security headed for a crisis sooner than thought? Although President Bush says so, not everyone agrees. The system's trustees estimate the Social Security trust fund is in good shape for another four decades. The nonpartisan Congressional Budget Office figures five decades. Many independent economists think Social Security is healthy for more like six or seven decades.

 

http://asp1.umbc.edu/newmedia/sites/chetah...SSA_RS%2016.pdf

http://www.dollarsandsense.org/archives/2004/1104orr.html

Social Security is not "in crisis". Medicare is the real looming problem.

If it's not in crisis then why must they "emphasized that Congress must quickly address future funding problems "?????

 

I think you answer the National Health Care topic yourself.

Medicare is the real looming problem.

Is that not a government run program????????????? Edited October 7, 2007 by fmccap

[mountaineerwv]

Once again, did you go to one of those great public schools our government provides?????? That explains the current situation in this country.

 

No, the current situation in this country is caused by the policies of Reagan/Bush/Bush, economic and diplomatic bungles. No Child Left Behind was an unfunded mandate and is the brainchild of Shrub.

 

Want to return to the topic of National Health Care? That is what this forum is about. If you want to talk about the K-12 education system, start that topic.

 

I stand by my statement: The government run Medicare program is more efficient than for-profit insurance companies.

[mountaineerwv]

I know it's hard to understand FACTS. We were talking about National Health Care and you decided to bring up public schools as something the government does right.

 

If the private sector can do education so much better, then why did the Edison Project fail? Public schools do an excellent job with the resources they have and the fact that they have to accept every child that appears at their door, unlike private schools that can pick and choose.

 

Do you believe in the public school concept?

[mountaineerwv]

If it's not in crisis then why must they "emphasized that Congress must quickly address future funding problems "?????

 

I think you answer the National Health Care topic yourself. Is that not a government run program?????????????

 

Oh boy, it is a full time job keeping you informed.

 

Yes, Medicare is a government program. It is in crisis because of the large number of people now coming into the system and the run away costs of the health care system.

 

SS is not "in crisis", it is funded for many decades to come.

 

You want to scrap both programs and let people fend for themselves? Is that your solution? Even with some of the warts of the existing systems, your solution would just make matters worse.

 

People who criticize should have another solution. What is yours?

[fmccap]

No, the current situation in this country is caused by the policies of Reagan/Bush/Bush, economic and diplomatic bungles. No Child Left Behind was an unfunded mandate and is the brainchild of Shrub.

 

Want to return to the topic of National Health Care? That is what this forum is about. If you want to talk about the K-12 education system, start that topic.

 

I stand by my statement: The government run Medicare program is more efficient than for-profit insurance companies.

You are the one that brought up schools. Would you like to answer post 187? You know the one that says the government is the ones right now that spend the most on healthcare.

[mountaineerwv]

You are the one that brought up schools. Would you like to answer post 187? You know the one that says the government is the ones right now that spend the most on healthcare.

 

What answer do you want? That government spends alot on health care? Yes, they do.

 

Now, can we move on? Or do you still want to pick at nits?

 

Do you favor the Public School System?

Do you think the present Health system needs improvement?

What is your proposal to solve these problems?

Do you trust corporations more than your government?

 

Inquiring minds want to know.

[unionj]

It is amazing how many people are willing to adopt plans that have failed elsewhere and how many countries are moving to similar systems to what we have in place.

[Trimdingman]

Eat out of dumpsters? You're a complete idiot. Goodbye, no sense wasting anymore of my time with such idiotic statements as has come from your keyboard.

 

I am just showing you what people can do. These social programs are making people soft and making them feel entitled to other peoples' money. Do people on welfare ever say thank-you to the ones who are paying their way? Do they ever offer to help out around the house? No; they just take and demand more like spoiled ungrateful moochers. I would eat out of a dumpster before I would accept a penny from you. My father would have beaten me if I ever asked for anything from anybody.

[mountaineerwv]

It is amazing how many people are willing to adopt plans that have failed elsewhere and how many countries are moving to similar systems to what we have in place.

 

Who says they have failed? The Health Insurance industry? Big Pharma? Who?

 

Why are those "failing" programs producing healthier people at a lower cost? Is that your definition of failure?

 

Which country(s) is moving to our system?

[fmccap]

What answer do you want? That government spends alot on health care? Yes, they do.

 

Now, can we move on? Or do you still want to pick at nits?

 

Do you favor the Public School System?

Do you think the present Health system needs improvement?

What is your proposal to solve these problems?

Do you trust corporations more than your government?

 

Inquiring minds want to know.

I was just trying to clarify that. You mentioned that the private sector (that spent the most) was the problem with healthcare.

 

Most public schools suck.

 

Yes.

 

Put it in a totally free market.

 

No. I trust the ones that I hear good from and the ones I know first hand that I can trust. I don't trust the government either. Look where they have us now.

[mountaineerwv]

It is amazing how many people are willing to adopt plans that have failed elsewhere and how many countries are moving to similar systems to what we have in place.

 

OK, I will ask you what is your solution to the Health Care crisis? Health Savings Accounts? Tax subsidies? Stay the Course? Get rid of all the programs like some on this board want and let each person/family fend for themselves?

What current proposals would you get behind?

[unionj]

So you want to throw away a chance at a National Health Care System because you are afraid that some illegal will get some service? We can have a better system, with better outcomes at a lower cost, but you are afraid that Pancho will get a free shot? Now, that is FOOLISH.

 

What is happening today when they show up at an emergency room? How expensive is that service? You are paying now, my friend, and for a VERY EXPENSIVE medical treatment at your emergency centers. That is FOOLISH.

So your mother is is agony and needs surgery but she must wait her turn like everyone else. The fact that your family has paid into the plan for generations does not matter as all your money is being spent on those who have not and who are ahead of your mother in line.

Ask people in the UK about the NHS or just do some research yourself. It amazes me that a country (UK) with the fantastic NHS which you want to adapt has advertisements everywhere for medical insurance so people can see what they refer to as Specialists or Private Doctors. Why would they need that? I mean it's all taken care of right.................Non Profit equals no incentive. Do you want the typical "I get paid anyway" government worker handling your health?

[mountaineerwv]

I was just trying to clarify that. You mentioned that the private sector (that spent the most) was the problem with healthcare.

 

Most public schools suck.

 

Yes.

 

Put it in a totally free market.

 

No. I trust the ones that I hear good from and the ones I know first hand that I can trust. I don't trust the government either. Look where they have us now.

 

OK, so you do not support the concept of Public Schools, right? Sad

[mountaineerwv]

So your mother is is agony and needs surgery but she must wait her turn like everyone else. The fact that your family has paid into the plan for generations does not matter as all your money is being spent on those who have not and who are ahead of your mother in line.

Ask people in the UK about the NHS or just do some research yourself. It amazes me that a country (UK) with the fantastic NHS which you want to adapt has advertisements everywhere for medical insurance so people can see what they refer to as Specialists or Private Doctors. Why would they need that? I mean it's all taken care of right.................Non Profit equals no incentive. Do you want the typical "I get paid anyway" government worker handling your health?

 

You start out with another Myth that has been repeatedly debunked: Long waits. Did you read ANY of those articles? Your lack of information on this important issue and being guided by debunked Myths will do you and your family no good. You are falling prey to the lies and myths of those who profit from the curent system and they are glad that you are so easily manipuated by their PR firms.

[mountaineerwv]

I was just trying to clarify that. You mentioned that the private sector (that spent the most) was the problem with healthcare.

 

I think private, for-profit insurance companies have to be eliminated for any progress to be made on making health care affordable and available to EVERY American citizen.

 

We need government to put controls on the runaway cost of presecription drugs, something that was prohibited by Bush's Medicare Part D Prescription Drug Program. Who benefitted from that provision? It was not the American public.

 

I believe that Medicare should be applied to every American, just like it applies to every Congressman, Senator and their families.

[fmccap]

OK, so you do not support the concept of Public Schools, right? Sad

No this is SAD.

Education in the United States

The national results in international comparisons have often been below the average of developed countries. In OECD's Programme for International Student Assessment 2003, 15 year olds ranked 24th of 38 in mathematics, 19th of 38 in science, 12th of 38 in reading, and 26th of 38 in problem solving.[44] In addition, many business leaders have expressed concerns that the quality of education given in the US system is generally below acceptable standards, and should be adapted in order to conform to the needs of an evolving world. Bill Gates has famously stated that the American high school is "obsolete".[45]