Kev-Mo Posted October 21, 2013 Share Posted October 21, 2013 Hello all, recently visited my sister in Florida where she is a certified child seat fitter/inspector for Manatee County. She and her husband are Honda loyalists and Ford bashing is a way of life. She says there is no "official' statement from Ford on child seats compatibility with inflatable seat belts- and this could be a big problem. She implies Ford screwed up and is scrambling. I remember from my days with the infant and the Britax that the shoulder belt was routed through the seat frame in a manner that was critical to proper fit and position. I find it hard to think - but could it be that this is an "oh sh_ t" moment and Ford completely forgot that these vehicles will be used with child seats? If any insiders or others here in the know have the official Ford answer, I would be very interested to know. Thank you! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
92merc Posted October 21, 2013 Share Posted October 21, 2013 Advice for ParentsThose manufacturers that advise against using the inflatable belts with their infant seats recommend using the child restraint anchorage system, Lower Anchors and Tethers for Children, (LATCH) instead. If they recommend against using the inflatable belts with their booster seats, they suggest moving the booster to a position that has a standard three-point seatbelt. That is an acceptable solution, according to NHTSA. A suitable alternative to using an inflatable belt is to install the child restraint in a seating position that does not have such a belt, or to use a LATCH instead, according to NHTSA. The inflatable seatbelts typically are offered on the outboard second-row seats, but not the center seat. http://www.edmunds.com/car-safety/inflatable-seatbelts-pose-new-challenge-for-parents.html As I understand it, if you use the proper current LATCH system to install the car seat, you don't need to use the shoulder belt. That just stays to the side. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvrsvt Posted October 21, 2013 Share Posted October 21, 2013 Here is an article: http://www.edmunds.com/car-safety/inflatable-seatbelts-pose-new-challenge-for-parents.html They are optional...I'd suggest NOT getting them if the car is going to be used to transport kids in the rear that need child or booster seats. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coupe3w Posted October 21, 2013 Share Posted October 21, 2013 Here is an article: http://www.edmunds.com/car-safety/inflatable-seatbelts-pose-new-challenge-for-parents.html They are optional...I'd suggest NOT getting them if the car is going to be used to transport kids in the rear that need child or booster seats. That is if you buy new, but not if you buy used. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted October 21, 2013 Share Posted October 21, 2013 That is if you buy new, but not if you buy used. They're still optional - find a used car without them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PREMiERdrum Posted October 21, 2013 Share Posted October 21, 2013 Anything other than a quick ride with the grandparents should see a child seat installed with the LATCH tethers, not the seatbelts. I presume that the belts only inflate if they are latched into the buckle, correct? If so, there shouldn't be an issue. - PREMiERdrum, a father of two kids who ride in LATCH tethered child seats 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fordmantpw Posted October 21, 2013 Share Posted October 21, 2013 Anything other than a quick ride with the grandparents should see a child seat installed with the LATCH tethers, not the seatbelts. I presume that the belts only inflate if they are latched into the buckle, correct? If so, there shouldn't be an issue. - PREMiERdrum, a father of two kids who ride in LATCH tethered child seats Agreed! Once you've used a car seat with the LATCH system, you won't want to go back. Installed properly, the seats connected via LATCH are practically one with the seat. With that said, booster seats, OTOH, are a bit different since you have to use the actual seat belt. However, I don't see how it wouldn't be safer with inflatable belts vs. standard belts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sullynd Posted October 21, 2013 Share Posted October 21, 2013 (edited) I do not have inflatable belts - however the weight limit for LATCH is less than the weight limit for my child seat. I believe the weight limit for latch is 40 pounds, and then you need to use seatbelts. Edit - Per the manual it's 48 pounds. Edited October 21, 2013 by sullynd Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fordmantpw Posted October 21, 2013 Share Posted October 21, 2013 I do not have inflatable belts - however the weight limit for LATCH is less than the weight limit for my child seat. I believe the weight limit for latch is 40 pounds, and then you need to use seatbelts. Edit - Per the manual it's 48 pounds. Yes, more than that and you need to use the seat belt in a booster seat, and not a child seat with the 5 point harness. All of our child seats maxed out at 40 lbs. (or less) with the 5 point harness. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fordtech1 Posted October 21, 2013 Share Posted October 21, 2013 (edited) That is the dumbest statement saying Ford didn't think about child seats.....Here is a quote from CR http://carseatblog.com/20654/ford-explorer-limited-with-inflatable-seatbelt-technology-the-kids-carseats-boosters-review/ http://www.consumerreports.org/cro/news/2011/03/the-ford-inflatable-seat-belt-how-it-affects-car-seats-and-children/index.htm The inflatable belt is indeed thicker—two to three times the thickness of a traditional seat belt. As child passenger safety technicians, this was one of our greatest concerns, because we know how difficult some child car seat features like lock-offs can be, even with normal seat belts. The lock-off on most child seats is designed to lock the lap belt from moving so that it holds the seat or infant seat base securely. The key to the Ford inflatable belt system is that it is not a continuous loop like most lap-and-shoulder belts. Instead, there are separate lap and shoulder belts attached to a specially designed latch plate (the piece that pushes into the buckle). The shoulder belt and the lap belt each have their own retractor system. This allows the lap belt to be locked from moving by pulling it out and switching the retractor beneath the cushion into ALR (automatic locking retractor) mode. This is similar to the switch many parents use today to lock the shoulder portion of most vehicle belts when installing child restraints. The big potential advantage here is that the lockable retractor on the lap belt may eliminate the need for the lock-off feature on some seats, making the seats easier to install. It also means that some child seat manufacturers may need to add or modify instructions that would guide parents to use the belts correctly or modify lock-off designs so that seats could be installed without their use. From Britax Yes. BRITAX has revised its recommendations and based upon an analysis of vehicle seat belt system testing results, the current Ford Motor Company (Ford and Lincoln vehicles) Inflatable seat belt system is approved for use with all BRITAX car seats made to date. BRITAX will continue to evaluate information provided by automobile inflatable seat belt manufacturers and may revise these recommendations as new data becomes available. I don't see the problem. If you can purchase a $40k vehicle and it has inflatable seats, you should research and purchase an compatible child seat or use LATCH as stated in previous replies. I see so many poorly installed child seats. the CO2 deployed seatbelt is the least of the problem for some parents. Edited October 21, 2013 by fordtech1 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted October 21, 2013 Share Posted October 21, 2013 I don't see the problem. If you can purchase a $40k vehicle and it has inflatable seats, you should research and purchase an compatible child seat or use LATCH as stated in previous replies. BINGO....cart leading the Horse...AGAIN! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trvlrschick Posted October 22, 2013 Share Posted October 22, 2013 LATCH is only good up to a certain weight limit, and it is VERY possible to get a carseat with a higher limit than that. The Clek Foonf, for example, has a FIFTY pound REARFACING limit, and a SIXTY-FIVE pound limit front-facing. After that, you can get a five-point harness booster that is fullback up to ONE HUNDRED pounds. You definitely can't use the LATCH anchors that long. I'll be getting the Foonf for my new car, because it's one of the best seats on the market, with the highest rear-facing limit. Basically, Ford should have added in a measure to turn the airbags in the seatbelts off. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fordtech1 Posted October 22, 2013 Share Posted October 22, 2013 Looking in the owners manual for inflatable seat belts, it shows running the belt through the back of the seat. The lower retractor locks. If the belt deploys, it's behind the child and it's only CO2 charged. What is the issue? Another question, how much weight rating is enough? If you have a 65 pound child, should they be in a booster instead in which this is the situation these belts are for. I would think a child of that size would benefit from the belts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoonerLS Posted October 22, 2013 Share Posted October 22, 2013 After that, you can get a five-point harness booster that is fullback up to ONE HUNDRED pounds. Why in in the wide, wide world of sports would you have a child that large in a car seat? I was always on the tall end of the childhood development charts, and I'm pretty sure I was in the 5th grade by the time I weighed 100lbs. Heck, even my handicapped brother wouldn't have been in a car seat that long... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sullynd Posted October 22, 2013 Share Posted October 22, 2013 Yes, more than that and you need to use the seat belt in a booster seat, and not a child seat with the 5 point harness. All of our child seats maxed out at 40 lbs. (or less) with the 5 point harness. My Graco Nautilus Carseat goes to 65 pounds with the 5-point harness, and 100 with the seatbelt. Many carseats go higher than 48 pounds today. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fordmantpw Posted October 22, 2013 Share Posted October 22, 2013 When you get down to it, height plays as much (if not more) of a part than weight does in determining whether you use a booster or car seat. For the most part, a kid that reaches 65 lbs (unless he/she is really husky) is going to be over the height for the car seat before he/she reaches the weight limit. My oldest daughter is 10, and though she is rather skinny for her age, barely weighs 65 lbs now. My son is 8, is a few inches shorter, and weighs about the same. He is about average build. They're both over 4' tall, so I couldn't imagine them riding in a car seat with a 5 point harness. My son rides in a booster, my oldest daughter just in the seat. The important part is that the belts be at the proper height for the child, meaning that it hits them properly across the legs, and just right on the shoulder. Not into the neck, and not falling down the arm. The weight doesn't really matter as much for that. The weight restrictions (maximums) are there so that you don't overload the carseat, not that the kids need to remain in them until that weight. My guess is that over 90% of kids outgrow the car seat height-wise before they do weight-wise. And once the kid is out of a car seat and into a booster, the inflatable belts surely have to be a safety addition. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kev-Mo Posted October 22, 2013 Author Share Posted October 22, 2013 Good discussion - thanks for all the input. Guess from the reaction this needed to be discussed. My kid is long gone out of the BRITAX, but my sister knows I am Ford guy so she used the opportunity to dig in a little -of course her Honda is perfect in every way. Special thanks to fordtech1, 92merc, and silvrsvt for quotes and references. fordmanptw - good luck to your Cards! I always root for the NL in the World Series. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fordmantpw Posted October 22, 2013 Share Posted October 22, 2013 fordmanptw - good luck to your Cards! I always root for the NL in the World Series. Thanks Kev-Mo! I'm the same, even without the Cards, I would be rooting for the NL. The DH just isn't right! Judging by your screen name, aren't you from MO? I would love to relocate to CO, but that's just not in the cards (no pun intended). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickF1011 Posted October 22, 2013 Share Posted October 22, 2013 Why in in the wide, wide world of sports would you have a child that large in a car seat? Happy Meals. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kev-Mo Posted October 22, 2013 Author Share Posted October 22, 2013 (edited) Judging by your screen name, aren't you from MO? I would love to relocate to CO, but that's just not in the cards (no pun intended). I am from NJ (lifelong Mets fan). My friends call me Kevmo because I have an affinity for American Blues music and of course the artist Keb'Mo, whose real name is Kevin Moore. Yes, the DH is one of the greatest absurdities of all time. Edited October 22, 2013 by Kev-Mo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fordmantpw Posted October 22, 2013 Share Posted October 22, 2013 Judging by your screen name, aren't you from MO? I would love to relocate to CO, but that's just not in the cards (no pun intended). I am from NJ (lifelong Mets fan). My friends call me Kevmo because I have an affinity for American Blues music and of course the artist Keb'Mo, whose real name is Kevin Moore. Yes, the DH is one of the greatest absurdities of all time. I was thinking you also mentioned one time you were from MO, but guess not. At any rate, Go Cards!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoonerLS Posted October 22, 2013 Share Posted October 22, 2013 Thanks Kev-Mo! I'm the same, even without the Cards, I would be rooting for the NL. The DH just isn't right! So, you choose the Bunting Pitcher League over the Junior League? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fordmantpw Posted October 22, 2013 Share Posted October 22, 2013 So, you choose the Bunting Pitcher League over the Junior League? I have you know, the Cardinals' pitchers have one of the best batting averages in the game (for pitchers). But seriously, the DH is ridiculous! Part of the game is double-switches, and teaching your pitchers how to move runners over. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kev-Mo Posted October 22, 2013 Author Share Posted October 22, 2013 But seriously, the DH is ridiculous! Part of the game is double-switches, and teaching your pitchers how to move runners over. And pitchers having to dig in and face the opposing pitcher after intentionally throwing at the batter - you know who you are Roger Clemens. Strongly agree - DH takes too much strategy out of the game. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickF1011 Posted October 22, 2013 Share Posted October 22, 2013 And pitchers having to dig in and face the opposing pitcher after intentionally throwing at the batter - you know who you are Roger Clemens. Strongly agree - DH takes too much strategy out of the game. And allows for too many players who likely get winded just lifting a fork to their mouths. Ahem*DavidOrtiz*Ahem. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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