Jump to content

2015 FORD RANGER RUMOR


gafry

Recommended Posts

Any company that tries to produce every product and feature that some customer wants without regard to their cost to do it and ROI will be out of business very quickly.

 

The same argument would apply to selling F150 in Europe or Asia.

 

People who only think like a consumer without any regard to how a company like Ford has to make business decisions will never understand anything the company does.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Any company that tries to produce every product and feature that some customer wants without regard to their cost to do it and ROI will be out of business very quickly.

 

The same argument would apply to selling F150 in Europe or Asia.

 

People who only think like a consumer without any regard to how a company like Ford has to make business decisions will never understand anything the company does.

 

In the end, companies are in business to make money. If that means upsetting a few customers along the way in order to satisfy the majority, so be it.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Yes I am a member of the Ranger Mafia. I would like a small truck as my daily driver. However much of my travels takes me through downtown Columbus. So parking does become a issue. What I don't understand with this site is how condescending people can be here on this site. Just because a loyal Ford fan would like to see a new Ranger, they are shot down just because they think Ford should offer something besides the almighty F150.

  • Like 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Yes I am a member of the Ranger Mafia. I would like a small truck as my daily driver. However much of my travels takes me through downtown Columbus. So parking does become a issue. What I don't understand with this site is how condescending people can be here on this site. Just because a loyal Ford fan would like to see a new Ranger, they are shot down just because they think Ford should offer something besides the almighty F150.

 

Because people don't come here and say "I really wish Ford would bring a new Ranger because I'd love to have a slightly smaller truck."

 

If they did then nobody would have an issue.

 

But no. Everybody has to say "Ford should bring the new Ranger because everybody wants one and they can make a ton of money on them and if they don't then they're stupid and the only reason that sales dropped is they didn't update it." THAT's what everyone gets upset about because the facts don't back that up and we've explained it over and over and over.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Which is exactly why you almost never see me on this site anymore and why I haven't been in a Ford dealership shopping for a new vehicle since 2007. Neither offers me little or anything I need or want. I have been a member of BON since 1999 and I WAS a loyal Ford customer since 1977. This is made all the more exasperating in light of the fact that Ford does sell a vehicle exactly like I want and need, just not here. Screw them. I will definitely be in the market for a 2015 GMC Canyon and I suspect there are a lot other buyers who will take a similar path and who, like myself, have been hanging on to their old Rangers and Sport Tracs in hopes that Ford would allow us to buy a vehicle they already have in production and that could be sold here with relatively few modifications.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Perfect example of someone who thinks Ford should sell whatever they want to buy without any regard to whether it's a good business decision for Ford.

 

I'm sure there are just as many folks outside North America who are saying the same thing about the F-150.

 

It's impossible for Ford to sell every vehicle that anybody wants to buy. It's just not feasible. What GM is doing with Colorado and Canyon makes no business sense at all - turning one global truck into 3 different ones which will most assuredly eat into their full-sized truck sales increasing fixed overhead and lowering profits.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 2 weeks later...

Henry Ford started to make cars and I am sure a lot of people thought that was stupid. People want small trucks and if Ford won't build them they will buy GM, Toyoto, or Nissan small trucks.

 

I see those companies are also looking into diesel engines for better gas mileage. Mr. Kirby has his opinion but there are thousands of Ford Rangers on the road today and there will be

 

small trucks on the road in the future. WILL FORD GET THE MESSAGE ???

Edited by gafry
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Henry Ford started to make cars and I am sure a lot of people thought that was stupid. People want small trucks and if Ford won't build them they will buy GM, Toyoto, or Nissan small trucks.

 

I see those companies are also looking into diesel engines for better gas mileage. Mr. Kirby has his opinion but there are thousands of Ford Rangers on the road today and there will be

 

small trucks on the road in the future. WILL FORD GET THE MESSAGE ???

 

Nobody said there wouldn't be small trucks on the road in the future. There will also be minivans and other vehicles that other mfrs choose to sell. That doesn't mean it's the right business decision for Ford to sell them.

 

Ford has diesel engines readily available in Europe should consumers start demanding them and there is a sufficient business case for producing them.

 

Just because there are a few thousand (or tens or even hundreds of thousands) people willing to buy a product doesn't mean it should be built.

 

 

Let's go back to the Ranger and let's say Ford can sell 100K but they have to add a new plant and a new shift to do it. And let's say that 50K of the 100K Ranger sales come at the expense of the F150.

 

Ford has to spend a ton of money to open a plant just to run one shift of production - 100K units per year. Meanwhile they just lost 50K F150 units replacing them with lower ATPs and probably lower profit margins.

And you just spent a TON of money opening and staffing a plant to produce an extra 50K vehicles. Virtually no way you can do that and make money especially with nothing else to share the platform R&D or manufacturing costs.

 

It might perfect sense for another mfr who has spare plant capacity that would otherwise be idle and who would not be cannibalizing sales of a cash cow like F-150. Every situation is unique and it also depends on what other projects the mfr wants to invest in and whether they have a better ROI or long term strategic benefit.

 

Same with diesel engines. Or station wagons. If you're saying that Ford SHOULD build it (as opposed to "I wish they would") then you can't ignore all of those factors that affect Ford's decision.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 3 weeks later...

It would be nice to see a smaller truck, but don't see it happening. Because Ford would have to make available just about every configuration possible (standard, extended cab, quad cab, bed sizes, engines available for towing, maybe gearing), pricing would probably be close to the F150's now.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 2 weeks later...

there are many posts on the web that Ford may bring back the Ranger in 2015

 

as a 30 mpg small truck ??

 

any news out there on this info??

 

If the Ranger ever came back it better do way better than 30 mpg because the 2015 F-150 will be near 30 mpg.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 1 month later...
  • 3 weeks later...

The size issue is a very real issue for me. My 1991 Silverado fit n the garage with a comfortable amount of room to walk beteeen the rear bumper and the closed garage door. With My 2002 Sierra the amount of room shrunk to about 10 inches (we have to scootch by sideways). With the 2015 GM and Ford full size pickups we would be down to about 6 inches of scootch room left and that makes them to large for my garage.

 

I'm currently considering a new GMC canyon as it would give us plenty of room to walk by and it will easily tow our 4000 lb boat. This makes me very sad that Ford does not have pickup that will fit in my garage and tow our boat.

Edited by Texasota
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 4 weeks later...

I had a new Ranger back in 87 and following that was a new 91 3/4 ton Silverado pickup. The Ranger was a good vehicle and the Chevy was a great vehicle ( 5.7 350 V8). My intended use required a larger vehicle thus trading the Ranger in for the Chevy which was the better truck at the time between the F150 and Chevy.

 

In the not too distant future I am considering another pickup and will look objectively at what available from the big 3. The F150 is an excellent vehicle ( today ) but having a midsize vehicle with better MPG is attractive to many buyers , myself included. While true any other truck manufactured and sold by Ford would impact their full sized truck sales the medium duty / size truck market is there IF the vehicles are priced competitively and the features and MPG are sizable enough to see real fuel saving each fill up or yearly.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

There is definitely a market (around 250K vehicles most recently) but it's very small compared to full sized trucks (~ 2M+). But the potential is definitely limited and for a company that would stand to lose a significant portion of full sized truck sales (like GM, RAM and Ford) it makes the business case much harder to prove out as opposed to other mfrs where net sales would be higher.

 

Here is an example for the financially challenged......

 

Let's say a full sized truck grosses $10K profit and a mid sized truck grosses $5K.

 

You bring out a new midsized truck and sell 100K. But 50K of those were instead of a full sized truck, so you lost 5K on the first 50K vehicles or $250M.

 

The other 50K are net new sales so you made $250M on those.

 

Last time I checked $250M - $250M = $0 net profit. Now throw in the added costs to develop and market a completely new vehicle and you just lost money. Lots of money. Bad business decision.

 

If the Canyorado can sell 100K without cannibalizing Silvererra sales then that's great but I just don't see that happening without huge incentives.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Unit cost X units sold = Gross $$

If the smaller truck can not be sold in volume then the cost point needs to be in a sweet spot for the math to work out.

 

No disagreement on the math needing to be favorable to the company to produce the vehicle but its nice for one stop shopping when a company offers several options instead of fewer.

The appeal of a Ranger size vehicle is lower operating cost ( fuel savings, smaller tires / lower cost, etc).

 

Lots of concept vehicles made that never hit job 1 on the production line and the high end vehicles like the GT40 eat up R&D dollars and never sell in volumes but are cool as hell........

Link to comment
Share on other sites

But you have to consider whether it's worth the additional customer satisfaction or retaining more customers by having that vehicle even if it doesn't provide more profits. If it loses money then those benefits would have to be huge to overcome an operating loss.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

A midsize truck or smaller will come back as soon as either:

 

A. Fuel prices permanently appear to impact F150 sales

B. The chicken tax goes away and Ford thinks it can improve its CAFE rating by biulding one or make a profit by building one.

 

There has been some talk about creating another World Ranger in 2017 that is a little wider than the current one. That one might be made out of a Narrowed F150 frame and if designed that way would open up the doors for a smaller F100 in the US.

 

Such a truck would be aluminum skinned and weight 500lbs-700lbs lighter than the 2015 F150 and leverage the 2.0 and 2.7 liter Eco-boost as the engines.

 

Think 28-34 MPG midsize truck.

 

I don't plan on waiting that long, my 2001 ranger is almost a flintstone vehicle. Assuming its not junk I 'll be driving a loaded Colorado in the spring.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Full sized sales would have to drop AND midsized sales of other brands would have to increase. 28-34 mpg while retaining any significant truck capabilities will be very very difficult.

 

I don't think mpg is going to do it. Truck owners concerned about fuel cost have already switched to other vehicles. Current buyers either need a full sized truck or don't care about fuel prices.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I disagree, Akirby. It's the same as the current midsize argurement, is 85% of a 1/2 ton truck enough.

 

I sure know that if it's the difference between being able to own a truck or not, THAT will drive sales. If you work in the city, have a smaller garage, or forced to park inside due to a HOA. It also helps that full size trucks are becoming more capable and the entry price is continuing to climb.

 

For some of us the difference between a full size and a midsize is a body covered in dents when you park in the city.

 

I'll settle for what one considers to be required capabilities. For me it's hauling lumber, mulch, furniture, and being able to tow 4000lb loads comfortably. But an F150 is huge. I can fit it in my garage, but can't walk around it. There's no significant room around it in the smaller parking spots in the city garage, the total cost to own is higher, in a quad cab it costs $6-7k more than a midsize after discounts. If it was a work only truck I could write it off, but I'm not going to buy a SUV as a family vehicle only to trash the interior hauling stuff.

 

The switched to other vehicles comment is amusing as well, as there are plenty of us that are holding onto our old rust buckets, purchased tacos or frontiers. 170,000+ in yearly sales for an outdated platform isn't too shabby.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Nothing you just said had anything whatsoever to do with mpg or fuel prices. An increase in gas prices isn't going to drive more buyers out of full sized trucks and into mid-sized trucks. Full size truck owners have either accepted $4/gallon gas or they ditched their full sized trucks for something else with much better fuel economy (and midsized trucks don't offer that).

 

Size is a totally different argument. Of course there are buyers who want a smaller sized truck for parking purposes. Ford sold 60K Rangers the last year it was made. But that market isn't big enough to justify the investment right now especially when you consider the impact of some lost F150 sales to the bottom line. Every time you replace a F150 sale with a Ranger sale you probably lose $5K in profit (at least). If the profit margin on a Ranger is only $5K and half your sales are pulled away from F150s then you've actually lost money considering the development costs.

 

If all these midsized truck buyers really want a new truck then go buy a Canyorado and prove to Ford the market is as big as you think it is. Then maybe they can justify it. It's like the argument that everyone wants wagons. When the mfrs build wagons, nobody buys them. Put your money where your mouth is.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

If all these midsized truck buyers really want a new truck then go buy a Canyorado and prove to Ford the market is as big as you think it is. Then maybe they can justify it. It's like the argument that everyone wants wagons. When the mfrs build wagons, nobody buys them. Put your money where your mouth is.

 

I know I will. SUVs are the new wagons, wagons currently don't have the cool factor. Well maybe the Madza 3 and the S5...

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

×
×
  • Create New...