The new Bronco/Ranger/MAP thread

[akirby]

. Coming out with a new 4 door-only Bronco would be akin to if Ford had released the 2004 mustang as a 4 door.

 

Knowing what Jeep knows now about their buyers - what do you think they would come out with first if they were doing a new Wrangler? A 4door or a 2door?

[Anthony]

Ford is going to produce what they can sell. A 4 door SUV (regardless of size or intent) will outsell a 2 door version. A 4 door is almost guaranteed. I'd question more if they are going to bother with a 2 door.

[rmc523]

Some observations. If Ford wants a vehicle to compete in the space where the Wrangler is, a 2 door is necessary. That is where the bulk of sales seems to be. On the road I rarely see the 4 door Wrangler, but more than a few 2 doors. Also, I drive by a Chrysler/dodge/Ram/Jeep dealership (boy, that does not roll off the tongue nicely, keeps hanging up) nearly every day, and on their lot there are about six 2 door Wranglers for every 4 door Wrangler.

 

Yeah, it's definitely the opposite here (vast majority are 4-doors, with a handful of 2-doors). That said, there are obviously areas in which the 2 door is a better fit for the market. The question is how large is that market and how difficult will it be for Ford to cater to it with a 2 door.

 

Presumably a 2 door would mean a different wheelbase than a 4 door. And I'm assuming any truck option would potentially have both a SuperCab (suicide doors) and SuperCrew (4 full doors) option unless they go SuperCrew only. In theory that could get you your two wheelbases shared over the truck and Bronco models, unless they go the route of one truck wheelbase with a SuperCab model getting a longer bed.

[rmc523]

Ford is going to produce what they can sell. A 4 door SUV (regardless of size or intent) will outsell a 2 door version. A 4 door is almost guaranteed. I'd question more if they are going to bother with a 2 door.

 

I think the only thing that would help the case for a 2 door model would be ROW sales. If the Troller were indeed produced here and sent elsewhere, it would make sense to offer a 2 door model....if you're building a 2 door "Troller", you could build an identical 2 door "Bronco."

[J-150]

 

As J-150 points out that's no longer the case. I see way more new 4 doors than 2 doors. It might be more than 70% here in Atlanta.

 

Same thing happened with pickups. In 1970s/80s supercrews were virtually non-existent outside superduty type work trucks. Now they're way over half the market - probably closer to 70%.

Further to that, 2 dr pickups are almost non existent.

 

In construction fleets, I'm seeing more and more super cabs to accommodate the excessive paperwork supervisors and superintendents need to carry.

[J-150]

I think, ultimately, Bronco would follow the path of Wrangler. That being 4 door models to produce the volume that allows the 2 dr to exist.

[Hugh]

Further to that, 2 dr pickups are almost non existent.

 

In construction fleets, I'm seeing more and more super cabs to accommodate the excessive paperwork supervisors and superintendents need to carry.

Or perhaps carry more workers instead of using more then one truck to ferry personnel from point a to b.

[J-150]

Or perhaps carry more workers instead of using more then one truck to ferry personnel from point a to b.

 

In those cases I'm seeing the true crew cab super duty. There is still a minimum amount of box size desired.

[SoonerLS]

Maybe, but pickups are also engineered for maximum efficiency with the tailgate closed (contrary to the somewhat popular belief that removing the tailgate improves fuel efficiency). Adding a cap does the same thing so from that standpoint it's kinda redundant

Adding a cap might do the same thing, but Ford doesn't sell trucks equipped like that, so it has no effect on CAFE.

 

I'm not saying that a RCSB-sized Bronco would have better fuel efficiency than a RCSB F150, I'm just saying that, if it did, that might give them enough incentive to make room for it on one of the F150 lines.

[Anthony]

Adding a cap might do the same thing, but Ford doesn't sell trucks equipped like that, so it has no effect on CAFE.

 

I'm not saying that a RCSB-sized Bronco would have better fuel efficiency than a RCSB F150, I'm just saying that, if it did, that might give them enough incentive to make room for it on one of the F150 lines.

 

 

Side topic: Is there a reason auto manufacturers don't offer caps from the factory or as a dealer-installed item? Seems like a no-brainer option so I'm sure there's a good reason for it.

[fuzzymoomoo]

 

 

Side topic: Is there a reason auto manufacturers don't offer caps from the factory or as a dealer-installed item? Seems like a no-brainer option so I'm sure there's a good reason for it.

 

That's a good question. I'm guessing its because dealers don't want to deal with them? Vendors would rather do it themselves?

[akirby]

There wouldn't be much profit since they'd be sourcing them from the same vendors as the aftermarket. Plus the hassle of keeping that inventory.

[blazerdude20]

There wouldn't be much profit since they'd be sourcing them from the same vendors as the aftermarket. Plus the hassle of keeping that inventory.

They could certainly produce them in house. However you again have the hassle factor. A company can probably find a better use of manufacturing space than a truck cap.

[Donaldo]

I think we still see a lot more 2 door Wranglers on the road since they've been selling them for decades vs just the last handful of years for the 4 door version.

 

That being said, Bronco has always been a 2 door, so I think there will at least be a 2 door version. Especially if Troller relation rumors are true. Coming out with a new 4 door-only Bronco would be akin to if Ford had released the 2004 mustang as a 4 door.

 

4 door Wrangler sales dominate the 2 doors these days. How many other 2 door SUVs are sold now? Even the FJ Cruiser was not a real 2 door and got killed due to sales shifting to the more spacious 4 door 4Runner.

 

The SUV market has changed a lot in the last 20 years since the last Bronco was made. How many unibody SUVs were made 20 years ago vs. BOF?

I think a modern 2 door Bronco is pure fantasy, the costs to federalize it for crash testing and emissions would only make sense if it were priced to compete with an ICON Bronco.

[BlackHorse]

 

Knowing what Jeep knows now about their buyers - what do you think they would come out with first if they were doing a new Wrangler? A 4door or a 2door?

 

 

 

That's a tough question and I'm not sure we should apply the answer to the broader SUV market in general. Keep in mind that a lot of people still buy the Wrangler for the specific purpose of having fun off road and to that end the 2 door is the preferred model because of the break over angle. The 4 door version is definitely popular but mostly with the buyers who have families and want to be able to put the kids in the back and go have some fun out in the wild green yonder. It is still a very capable off road vehicle, just not quite as capable as the 2 door version. I think the Wrangler is probably the one SUV that still sells well in the 2 door version simply because of its intended use. I think if Jeep were coming out with a new Wrangler they would co-develop both the 2 and 4 door versions with equal intent because both are going to sell well. It's not like that for any other SUV out there that I know of.

[bzcat]

 

 

Side topic: Is there a reason auto manufacturers don't offer caps from the factory or as a dealer-installed item? Seems like a no-brainer option so I'm sure there's a good reason for it.

 

 

There wouldn't be much profit since they'd be sourcing them from the same vendors as the aftermarket. Plus the hassle of keeping that inventory.

 

Also selling the cargo area cap as an OEM accessory opens you up to all kinds of product liabilities. Those things are not crash rated as they are not part of the structural weight or safety cell.

[fuzzymoomoo]

 

 

 

Also selling the cargo area cap as an OEM accessory opens you up to all kinds of product liabilities. Those things are not crash rated as they are not part of the structural weight or safety cell.

That's the most plausible theory

[Bob Rosadini]

Further to that, 2 dr pickups are almost non existent.

 

In construction fleets, I'm seeing more and more super cabs to accommodate the excessive paperwork supervisors and superintendents need to carry.

For sure on that. The super cab offers the convenience of "In cab" storage vs. say a cargo box of some sort. Nothing like being able to reach in back of you and grab a roll of "prints"- assuming there is still some degree of "old school" use of such things vs having everything on a laptop. To say nothing of securing items of high value or sensitivity (laser?) that you might not want stored in an uninsulated aluminum or steel box.

 

Granted the seats in my super cab Ranger are far from the arrangement in a 150 but I can count the number of times they have been used. As far as a tool compartment, excellent space.

[jpd80]

Funny how at the very hint of a "Bronco" project all the "experts" declare it a non-starter because two-door SUVs are non-existent.

Ford has plenty of four-door utilities in all shapes and sizes.... perhaps it knows something about a niche market tha we don't?

[sullynd]

Ford has plenty of four-door utilities in all shapes and sizes.... perhaps it knows something about a niche market tha we don't?

Ford is not GM.

 

[jpd80]

 

But if you take say, the low selling single cab F150 and turn it into a SWB 2-door Bronco, is that not an incremental product?

[fuzzymoomoo]

But if you take say, the low selling single cab F150 and turn it into a SWB 2-door Bronco, is that not an incremental product?

On that note as well, wasn't that essentially what the last bronco was?

[rmc523]

But if you take say, the low selling single cab F150 and turn it into a SWB 2-door Bronco, is that not an incremental product?

Sounds great, but I highly doubt that's what it'll be.

[SoonerLS]

The super cab offers the convenience of "In cab" storage vs. say a cargo box of some sort. Nothing like being able to reach in back of you and grab a roll of "prints"- assuming there is still some degree of "old school" use of such things vs having everything on a laptop.

All the construction projects we've had done at work have used prints. Considering how some of the guys on site could've screwed up an anvil with a rubber hammer, I'd be surprised to see this stuff go digital on-site any time soon--plus, it's a lot easier to transport a roll of 65" diagonal paper than to transport a digital display of similar size.

 

FWIW, it's nothing compared to the SuperCab or CrewCab/SuperCrew, but my regular cab has a surprisingly large amount of space behind the seats. With the seat all the way back, I still have room for a small Craftsman mechanic's toolkit (the case is maybe 20"x16"x6") and my Rigid drill/driver set in its bag, along with the rolled-up towel that I use to cover the seat when I've been cutting/raking/baling hay and a scattergun, and that's just the stuff behind my seat.

[blazerdude20]

Funny how at the very hint of a "Bronco" project all the "experts" declare it a non-starter because two-door SUVs are non-existent.

Ford has plenty of four-door utilities in all shapes and sizes.... perhaps it knows something about a niche market tha we don't?

Which wrangler sells more? The 4 door handily outsells the 2 door. The volume of the 4 door keeps the 2 door viable. Would likely be the same with a bronco. 4 doors for the average buyer who wants a light off road vehicle (image) and 2 doors for the hardcore base user.