blwnsmoke Posted October 27, 2017 Share Posted October 27, 2017 Hope this doesn't turn into something.. https://www.yahoo.com/finance/news/u-probes-ford-fusion-cars-potential-detached-steering-114942383--finance.html 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blwnsmoke Posted October 27, 2017 Author Share Posted October 27, 2017 (edited) WASHINGTON (Reuters) - The U.S. National Highway Traffic Safety Administration said Friday it was opening a preliminary investigation into 841,000 Ford Motor Co vehicles over concerns the steering wheels may get detached while the cars are in motion.The auto safety agency said it was investigating 2014-2016 model Ford Fusion cars after three reports of steering wheel bolts becoming loose, including one completely detaching as a driver attempted to turn into a gas station. Edited October 27, 2017 by blwnsmoke Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fordtech1 Posted October 27, 2017 Share Posted October 27, 2017 Although this should never happen. How long do you continue to drive a car when the steering wheel feels lose? The new steering wheels don't have to be pulled off with a puller like the old days. So that means that wheel had to feel loose as hell before it completely separated. People amaze me how inattentive they are. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blwnsmoke Posted October 27, 2017 Author Share Posted October 27, 2017 I agree. On the Explorer forum, there is a guy in a 13 that had his EPAS fail. He is out of warranty and after the warranty extension date that Ford published and was told he is on his own. He had if completely fail and cpould not get it to reset. After a few days, he got it to work again and then smashed in to a road barrier doing a hairpin turn at 25 mph. Now granted he is pissed because Ford wouldn't help him (they should have) BUT why are you con tinuing to drive after it has failed for so long? Now he is trying to put 100% of the blame on Ford instead of blaming himself for ignoring the failure and continuing to drive as if it is fixed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coupe3w Posted October 27, 2017 Share Posted October 27, 2017 It really amazes me that stupid stuff keeps happening at Ford. It's not like a steering wheel hasn't been put on a car before. What ever changed? It's a big freak'n lock style nut that shouldn't ever come loose. The vendor(s) that are building these things need to wake up. Or Ford has to put more stringent process in place. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fuzzymoomoo Posted October 27, 2017 Share Posted October 27, 2017 Or Ford has to put more stringent process in place. This. Now that Ford is (finally) starting to bring more design in house they need to make sure that shortcuts don't get taken in manufacturing both on their end and on Vendor's ends. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted October 27, 2017 Share Posted October 27, 2017 Although this should never happen. How long do you continue to drive a car when the steering wheel feels lose? The new steering wheels don't have to be pulled off with a puller like the old days. So that means that wheel had to feel loose as hell before it completely separated. People amaze me how inattentive they are. only a couple of years ago, we had a Rupert Murdoch journalist review an early built Everest that had been used as a press car in Thailand. At some time it suffered a flat battery and was recharged and sent to Australia as part of the product launch. The journalist had the vehicles for about a week but after a few days in he noticed lots of electrical faults and gremlins but instead of taking it back to the dealer, he continued to drive it, all the time building a hatchet article to destroy the vehicle's credibility. Suddenly the vehicle caught fire and fortunately, he got out and watched it burn to the ground. By now, he was ready to go to town on Ford and released his article.... you could imagine the blow back when the cause of the fire was revealed as loose battery terminals, a vehicle burned to the ground because simple safety checks and return to the dealer wasn't done... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fuzzymoomoo Posted October 27, 2017 Share Posted October 27, 2017 only a couple of years ago, we had a Rupert Murdoch journalist review an early built Everest that had been used as a press car in Thailand. At some time it suffered a flat battery and was recharged and sent to Australia as part of the product launch. The journalist had the vehicles for about a week but after a few days in he noticed lots of electrical faults and gremlins but instead of taking it back to the dealer, he continued to drive it, all the time building a hatchet article to destroy the vehicle's credibility. Suddenly the vehicle caught fire and fortunately, he got out and watched it burn to the ground. By now, he was ready to go to town on Ford and released his article.... you could imagine the blow back when the cause of the fire was revealed as loose battery terminals, a vehicle burned to the ground because simple safety checks and return to the dealer wasn't done... I remember that article, and I remember thinking at the time it seemed like he was looking for anything he could find to go after Ford and that he was stupid for not taking it to a dealer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted October 28, 2017 Share Posted October 28, 2017 (edited) I remember that article, and I remember thinking at the time it seemed like he was looking for anything he could find to go after Ford and that he was stupid for not taking it to a dealer. He had an agenda that was so bent on proving the vehicle was defective that it nearly cost him his life. Fortunately, all was revealed and now all that know the story are reviled by his inaction. Edited October 28, 2017 by jpd80 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fordmantpw Posted October 29, 2017 Share Posted October 29, 2017 3 reports. Yes, 3. Out of 841,000. That is .00036%. Yeah it sucks if you are one of those 3, but dammit how perfect does a car have to be? Geez! Seriously, how can you put a more stringent process in place when a statistically insignificant number of failures are taking place? And we have no insight into what caused these failures. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fordtech1 Posted October 29, 2017 Share Posted October 29, 2017 (edited) 3 reports. Yes, 3. Out of 841,000. That is .00036%. Yeah it sucks if you are one of those 3, but dammit how perfect does a car have to be? Geez! Seriously, how can you put a more stringent process in place when a statistically insignificant number of failures are taking place? And we have no insight into what caused these failures. Agreed it's a super small amount of failures so far. However, you haven't heard about any come loose on F-SERIES and they sold more of them. Last recall I remember like this was the 00-02 focus loose steering wheel bolt. It will probably turn into a recall and one more stab at Fords quality. Even though the failure rate will be small. So to answer your question. When it comes to safety items it needs to be perfect if you are a domestic manufacturer. Otherwise the media posts it like it's the next 9/11. Side note, I wonder if Toyota and Honda still do the "service bulletins" for their recalls to hide them. Edited October 29, 2017 by fordtech1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted October 29, 2017 Share Posted October 29, 2017 Can anyone tell us if the steering wheel is attached at the plant? or does it come from the supplier already attached to steering column assembly? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fuzzymoomoo Posted October 29, 2017 Share Posted October 29, 2017 Can anyone tell us if the steering wheel is attached at the plant? or does it come from the supplier already attached to steering column assembly? attached at the plant Again, it's 3 out of hundreds of thousands 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grbeck Posted October 30, 2017 Share Posted October 30, 2017 I don't believe that a manufacturer can cover a safety issue by telling customers that it needs to perform a "service" adjustment on a vehicle. Recalls are ordered after NHTSA conducts an investigation that was prompted by customer complaints. If the agency finds that there was an actual defect that affects the vehicle's safety, then it will order a recall. When that happens, a manufacturer has to recall the vehicle...it can't tell the customer that is a "service" adjustment or item. It has to send a letter to the customer explaining that the vehicle has been recalled, why it has been recalled, and the defect that will be repaired. The "service" adjustments tend to cover problems that aren't safety issues, like the defective transmissions used in V-6 Hondas and Acuras in the early 2000s. You took your vehicle to the dealer because the transmission was acting strangely, and, amazingly enough, you got a whole new transmission, free of charge. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted October 30, 2017 Share Posted October 30, 2017 I don't believe that a manufacturer can cover a safety issue by telling customers that it needs to perform a "service" adjustment on a vehicle. Recalls are ordered after NHTSA conducts an investigation that was prompted by customer complaints. If the agency finds that there was an actual defect that affects the vehicle's safety, then it will order a recall. When that happens, a manufacturer has to recall the vehicle...it can't tell the customer that is a "service" adjustment or item. It has to send a letter to the customer explaining that the vehicle has been recalled, why it has been recalled, and the defect that will be repaired. The "service" adjustments tend to cover problems that aren't safety issues, like the defective transmissions used in V-6 Hondas and Acuras in the early 2000s. You took your vehicle to the dealer because the transmission was acting strangely, and, amazingly enough, you got a whole new transmission, free of charge. Correct. They weren't hiding safety recalls, although they probably attempted to handle issues via a service bulletin before an actual Recall was issued in hopes of avoiding the recall. But they can't hide an actual recall since that comes from the NHTSA. What they can do and what you alluded to is they were (are?) very good at fixing problems during service visits sometimes before the customer knew about the problem or complained about it. To me that's just good customer service. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fordtech1 Posted October 30, 2017 Share Posted October 30, 2017 https://www.voanews.com/a/toyota-agrees-to-12-billion-us-fine-for-hiding-car-malfunctions/1874522.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theoldwizard Posted October 30, 2017 Share Posted October 30, 2017 It really amazes me that stupid stuff keeps happening at Ford. It's not like a steering wheel hasn't been put on a car before. What ever changed? It's a big freak'n lock style nut that shouldn't ever come loose. What about the door latch issue on the F150 ? That latch/cable and release design has been used on every single Ford for 10, 15 (?) years. Who "cost thrifted" it ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fordmantpw Posted October 30, 2017 Share Posted October 30, 2017 Agreed it's a super small amount of failures so far. However, you haven't heard about any come loose on F-SERIES and they sold more of them. Last recall I remember like this was the 00-02 focus loose steering wheel bolt. It will probably turn into a recall and one more stab at Fords quality. Even though the failure rate will be small. So to answer your question. When it comes to safety items it needs to be perfect if you are a domestic manufacturer. Otherwise the media posts it like it's the next 9/11. Side note, I wonder if Toyota and Honda still do the "service bulletins" for their recalls to hide them. I get that, and it's just like the media to blow everything out of proportion and cause a shit storm where one doesn't exist. Vehicles are made by humans. Humans aren't perfect. Therefore, vehicles won't be perfect. 99.9996% is pretty darn close if you ask me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tbone Posted October 30, 2017 Share Posted October 30, 2017 Correct. They weren't hiding safety recalls, although they probably attempted to handle issues via a service bulletin before an actual Recall was issued in hopes of avoiding the recall. But they can't hide an actual recall since that comes from the NHTSA. What they can do and what you alluded to is they were (are?) very good at fixing problems during service visits sometimes before the customer knew about the problem or complained about it. To me that's just good customer service. I agree with you that it is good customer service. Ford has known about the EPAS issue for a long time, and as a recipient of this problem it would have been nice had they had you come in to replace it before it failed. However, if you did that, you are going to replace a bunch of parts that havent failed which would be quite expensive. Im not sure what the best solution would be outside of designing a better part. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theDuff Posted November 1, 2017 Share Posted November 1, 2017 3 reports. Yes, 3. Out of 841,000. That is .00036%. Yeah it sucks if you are one of those 3, but dammit how perfect does a car have to be? Geez! Seriously, how can you put a more stringent process in place when a statistically insignificant number of failures are taking place? And we have no insight into what caused these failures. It's way more then 3. There have been 3 complaints to the NHTSA, yes, but that isn't every failure. Our service department has fixed several. I've seen other reports on Ford technician forums. This is a way bigger problem then .00036%. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tbone Posted November 1, 2017 Share Posted November 1, 2017 I agree that Ford should get their act together on this, but there is no way the customer wouldnt notice the steering wheel is loose before it becomes a major problem. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ajcomputer Posted November 7, 2017 Share Posted November 7, 2017 ... but there is no way the customer wouldnt notice the steering wheel is loose before it becomes a major problem. You would be surprised. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tbone Posted November 7, 2017 Share Posted November 7, 2017 You would be surprised. Im sure your right. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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