So Cars Don't Sell?

[akirby]

Maybe just wishful thinking -

 

With the elimination of Focus, Fusion, Taurus and retention of the Mustang, isn't there a much greater chance of Ford exploiting the Mustang platform? Maybe offering a Ford sedan to the line up as well as one or two Lincolns (stretched wb) all based on the Mustang platform?

Not necessarily. It would be possible because it would probably command a higher price and margin it would come down to whether Flat Rock has unused capacity for such a vehicle and whether they have the resources to do it in addition to all of the other new things (autonomous vehicles, electric vehicles, even city management, connected cars, etc.).

[rmc523]

Dont forget not mentioning quality once....

 

I agree that it's astonishing he's been here over a year now and I've not once heard him mention improving quality. That should be an obvious cost cutting objective (reducing warranty repairs and recall costs). But I guess they feel recalls are part of the business, who cares.

[akirby]

I agree that it's astonishing he's been here over a year now and I've not once heard him mention improving quality. That should be an obvious cost cutting objective (reducing warranty repairs and recall costs). But I guess they feel recalls are part of the business, who cares.

This is the most disappointing thing about Ford the last few years. I thought it was a temporary thing driven by the changeover to new platforms for Focus, Escape and Fusion but it sure doesn’t seem like they’re making any significant process changes to address it.

[rmc523]

This is the most disappointing thing about Ford the last few years. I thought it was a temporary thing driven by the changeover to new platforms for Focus, Escape and Fusion but it sure doesn’t seem like they’re making any significant process changes to address it.

 

Is some of that just that they're stuck in contracts, so they've decided to just stick with that for now, and then the next changover will solve that?

[akirby]

Maybe. That would be a much better explanation than they just don’t seem to care.

 

Or as I’ve been saying a lot of it is how the vehicles and parts were engineered so they have to wait for a new platform.

[rmc523]

Maybe. That would be a much better explanation than they just don’t seem to care.

 

Or as I’ve been saying a lot of it is how the vehicles and parts were engineered so they have to wait for a new platform.

 

Wasn't that the excuse for the DCT in Focus? That they were running out the contract/factory?

 

Yeah, that's true too. It could be a combo of both.

[fuzzymoomoo]

Not necessarily. It would be possible because it would probably command a higher price and margin it would come down to whether Flat Rock has unused capacity for such a vehicle and whether they have the resources to do it in addition to all of the other new things (autonomous vehicles, electric vehicles, even city management, connected cars, etc.).

All of those other things you mentioned are what the new building is for. The main plant will have capacity.

[akirby]

Not just plant capacity - all resources including engineering, testing, marketing, etc.

 

Essentially they’re taking the budget that would have gone to a new Fusion and they’re giving that budget to these other programs.

[mustang84isu]

 

 

Exactly- Automakers can up-charge Trucks and CUVs...and people will buy them still.

 

There is no demand for a sedan in the marketplace now. People buy them because they are cheaper or they got to fleets like you said.

 

Until they don't. We are at the tail end of bull market and people have spending freely the last few years, extending financing out to 72 months and beyond to keep monthly payments low. When interest rates rise and that bear cycle rolls around again, and buyers are forced to trim their budgets, Ford will be flat-footed with a bunch of expensive crossovers and people will look elsewhere.

 

Tastes are cyclical and can turn on a dime. What people think is hot today may not be so tomorrow. The crossover is becoming the modern-day minivan for millennials who are starting to have families and empty nesters who are looking for ease of entry / exit. If I had to guess, we are about 5 years out from Peak Crossover before sentiment starts turning negative on the segment. Just right around the time that Ford will have fully phased out its sedan lineup.

 

Instead of staying diversified, Ford is putting all its eggs into one basket just like in the late 1990's. And we all saw how that story ended.

Edited May 1, 2018 by mustang84isu

[rmc523]

 

Until they don't. We are at the tail end of bull market and people have spending freely the last few years, extending financing out to 72 months and beyond to keep monthly payments low. When interest rates rise and that bear cycle rolls around again, and buyers are forced to trim their budgets, Ford will be flat-footed with a bunch of expensive crossovers and people will look elsewhere.

 

Tastes are cyclical and can turn on a dime. What people think is hot today may not be so tomorrow. The crossover is becoming the modern-day minivan for millennials who are starting to have families and empty nesters who are looking for ease of entry / exit. If I had to guess, we are about 5 years out from Peak Crossover before sentiment starts turning negative on the segment. Just right around the time that Ford will have fully phased out its sedan lineup.

 

Instead of staying diversified, Ford is putting all its eggs into one basket just like in the late 1990's. And we all saw how that story ended.

 

I agree with you to an extent.

 

But, I'm willing to give them the benefit of the doubt for a bit until we see some of these white space models they're talking about.

[J-150]

Everyone buys for looks - do you ever buy a vehicle that you think is ugly?

 

As for intended use - my daughter just moved into a new apartment. We loaded up her Escape and our MKX to the gills with stuff that would never fit in a car. How is that not an intended use?

So you taking that SUV off road anytime soon?

[akirby]

So you taking that SUV off road anytime soon?

It’s not a SUV - it’s a crossover. It’s not intended for off road use.

[akirby]

Instead of staying diversified, Ford is putting all its eggs into one basket just like in the late 1990's. And we all saw how that story ended.

Not one basket. Lots of different baskets. Focus Active and Ecosport plus other smaller utes will be available at lower prices/higher fuel economy. They didn’t have those in the 90s.

[MKX1960]

 

I agree that it's astonishing he's been here over a year now and I've not once heard him mention improving quality. That should be an obvious cost cutting objective (reducing warranty repairs and recall costs). But I guess they feel recalls are part of the business, who cares.

That's something I see people ragging on Ford every chance they get. Their name is in the headlines far too often for things that should never happen. With 3 steering wheel complaints, people are still talking about that and say Ford builds nothing but junk, no wonder they're getting of them.

[pictor]

From Reuters today for April 18, new Honda Accord down 19.5%, down 14.4 % for cars in general, brand new Camry, down 5%, -12 % for cars in general., Nissan Passenger car sales down 35%. It not just Ford. Fiat did OK,(+5%) but mostly on the back of rental car sales.

[jpd80]

Just imagining where compact car sales will be in a couple of years, Ford is probably right with cancelling Fusion

but talking about it now is clearly a sword through the heart of sales, probably what Ford wanted as a self fulfilling prophecy.

 

The whole thing feels a little wrong given the strength of sales a few years ago, but with that

Ford saw the new Malibu crash and burn and probably decided, that's not going to be us.

Edited May 1, 2018 by jpd80