Is it time for a new Sport Trac?

[fuzzymoomoo]

14 minutes ago, akirby said:

Focus can still exist if it can be made in the same factory as other utilities so they can adjust production to meet demand for hatchbacks/active models.   Sedans probably won’t make enough profit though.

I'm not sure they want to anymore. I keep hearing from multiple sources the Focus Active BOMBED in focus groups

[silvrsvt]

5 minutes ago, fuzzymoomoo said:

I'm not sure they want to anymore. I keep hearing from multiple sources the Focus Active BOMBED in focus groups

No AWD and it looking like a Focus Station Wagon sure didn't help.

Maybe if they put more cladding on it and add AWD in the next refresh, they can revisit it. 

Though it begs the question-this is the second product in recent times that supposilty bombed focus groups-the other was the CD6 Taurus. Wonder what the deal is outside of changes in the marketplace for products. 

[akirby]

No AWD?  That was pretty stupid.

[AGR]

2 hours ago, silvrsvt said:

Not really if you look at the numbers-  
 

Honda Civic		31,181	-29.8	299,376	345,880	-13.4
Toyota Corolla	21,105	19,287	9.4	278,293	309,227	-10.0
Hyundai Elantra	18,148	19,060	-4.8	185,339	176,860	4.8
Nissan Sentra	12,721	17,565	-27.6	195,479	201,617	-3.0
Kia Forte	9,756	8,363	16.7	94,181	109,674	-14.1
Volkswagen Jetta	9,207	8,362	10.1	80,533	108,574	-25.8
Kia Soul	8,742	8,121	7.6	94,581	108,102	-12.5
Subaru Impreza	5,481	6,684	-18.0	70,520	78,006	-9.6
Ford Fiesta	5,238	3,035	72.6	47,421	42,592	11.3
Nissan Versa	5,122	7,274	-29.6	69,074	99,647	-30.7
Ford Focus	4,481	13,226	-66.1	110,384	147,148	-25.0
Mazda 3	3,974	4,708	-15.6	59,361	69,349	-14.4
Volkswagen Golf	2,488	4,276	-41.8	39,846	64,449	-38.2
Mini Cooper	2,353	2,499	-5.8	24,500	29,169	-16.0
Hyundai Accent	1,957	3,624	-46.0	25,260	53,750	-53.0
Kia Rio	1,671	1,533	9.0	21,367	15,142	41.1
Mitsubishi Mirage	1,522	1,208	26.0	22,568	21,363	5.6
Toyota Yaris	1,436	2,751	-47.8	25,957	42,269	-38.6
Hyundai Veloster	853	781	9.2	9,710	11,903	-18.4
Fiat 500	707	782	-9.6	4,952	12,018	-58.8
Honda Fit	678	2,799	-75.8	34,262	44,213	-22.5
Volkswagen Beetle	548	1,066	-48.6	13,494	14,331	-5.8
Smart ForTwo	100	130	-23.1	1,154	2,905	-60.3
Fiat 500L	47	127	-63.0	1,374	1,553	-11.5
Dodge Dart	5	128	-96.1	387	9,943	-96.1
Honda CR-Z	1	0	0.0	29	0	0.0

Yes really, if you look at the numbers. How many Sport Tracs would they actually sell? And how many wouldn't just buy a Ranger or F150 if no Sport Trac existed.

[AGR]

14 minutes ago, fuzzymoomoo said:

I'm not sure they want to anymore. I keep hearing from multiple sources the Focus Active BOMBED in focus groups

Maybe they should keep it as a car, only have the Active as one trim level...

[silvrsvt]

3 minutes ago, AGR said:

Yes really, if you look at the numbers. How many Sport Tracs would they actually sell? And how many wouldn't just buy a Ranger or F150 if no Sport Trac existed.

What?!

The chart was to show that small car sales are shrinking by a decent amount, along with the rest of the car market.

 

 

[fuzzymoomoo]

21 minutes ago, silvrsvt said:

No AWD and it looking like a Focus Station Wagon sure didn't help.

Maybe if they put more cladding on it and add AWD in the next refresh, they can revisit it. 

Though it begs the question-this is the second product in recent times that supposilty bombed focus groups-the other was the CD6 Taurus. Wonder what the deal is outside of changes in the marketplace for products. 

It was the CD4 China Taurus that bombed 

[fuzzymoomoo]

14 minutes ago, AGR said:

Maybe they should keep it as a car, only have the Active as one trim level...

Nevermind. Reading comprehension not strong for me today...

Edited December 19, 2018 by fuzzymoomoo

[silvrsvt]

17 minutes ago, fuzzymoomoo said:

It was the CD4 China Taurus that bombed 

Oops...typo

 

[bzcat]

2 hours ago, akirby said:

Focus can still exist if it can be made in the same factory as other utilities so they can adjust production to meet demand for hatchbacks/active models.   Sedans probably won’t make enough profit though.

I think that's part of the issue. I'm really not sure why Ford's C1 plants in North America are all single product plants. Honda builds Civic and CR-V on the same line, and Accord and CR-V on the same line (as well as a dedicated CR-V line). So they are much better insulated from demand changes. Is there some sort of UAW clause that prevents Focus and Escape being made in the same plant?

[fuzzymoomoo]

33 minutes ago, bzcat said:

I think that's part of the issue. I'm really not sure why Ford's C1 plants in North America are all single product plants. Honda builds Civic and CR-V on the same line, and Accord and CR-V on the same line (as well as a dedicated CR-V line). So they are much better insulated from demand changes. Is there some sort of UAW clause that prevents Focus and Escape being made in the same plant?

The fact that Louisville has been close to or at capacity since the 2013 Escape launched (it only got worse when the MKC started up) is the biggest factor there. MAP was running at capacity until small car sales nosedived in 2015. 

The situation at Louisville seems to be lightening up for the time being next year (they’re cutting a shift in April) but I personally don't think that will last very long if the new Escape is a hit and MKC/Corsair has a bump in sales with it. 

Even now there's still a lot of interchangeable body parts between the Focus and Escape. MAP Stamping is still making parts for Louisville on top of continuing to build their floor pans. 

Edited December 19, 2018 by fuzzymoomoo

[jpd80]

Amazing that Escape still sell as well as it does being basically evolution of a 10 year old Kuga, Ford really likes to squeeze all the juice out of its products.

[Assimilator]

The market is softening and we will likely see declining market sales next year.  Hackett warned they were drawing down volume and cutting shifts because the new vehicles will be more expensive.  I posted the entire article somewhere in here, but it's an interesting read.  Essentially Ford intends to sell less now and in the future because they want to keep prices up and prepare for the lower volume of the more expensive Escape and Explorer.  

Either way, 2019 is probably going to be a fairly brutal year for sales charts at Ford.  Only Ranger will be here to absorb the declines from all the discontinued, transitioning, and aging products.  

Edited December 20, 2018 by Assimilator

[ExplorerDude]

I agree I would love to see a new Sport Trac! It was and still is by far my most favorite Ford vehicle over the years. It was more SUV than truck with its molded composite bed and extra large power rear window which actually went down. It was the original “active lifestyle” vehicle which Ford is calling the Ranger now, it’s funny since the Sport Trac served that purpose first.

The original Sport Trac was extremely popular and sold about 60,000 units a year. Unfortunately it’s 2007 Gen 2 redesign didn’t do as well as Gen 1 but I also think that was mostly due to rising gas prices and a general decline in SUV and truck sales at the time. 

I remember hearing at the time during its introduction that they chose to call it an Explorer because people were willing to pay more for an Explorer rather than a Ranger at the time. And it helped the Explorer maintain its #1 selling SUV title as well at the time. Back then there were 3 Explorer body styles.

Still I’d love to see a new one but I feel like there would be too much overlap with a F150 SuperCrew and a Ranger SuperCrew. Those two cover those bases very well.

Maybe they’ll call the little C2 pickup the Courier Sport Trac or Maverick Sport Trac. It’ll be a crewcab only as far as I know.

[probowler]

The Sport Trac was an explorer though? At least the entire front end looked exactly like one. I assume there was at least some parts sharing.

[fordmantpw]

19 minutes ago, probowler said:

The Sport Trac was an explorer though? At least the entire front end looked exactly like one. I assume there was at least some parts sharing.

Yes, the name was actually Explorer Sport Trac.  It shared the frame and essentially everything from the front doors forward.  Just an Explorer with a bed.

[akirby]

1 hour ago, fordmantpw said:

Yes, the name was actually Explorer Sport Trac.  It shared the frame and essentially everything from the front doors forward.  Just an Explorer with a bed.

 

And it shared the Explorer independent rear suspension.

[blksn8k2]

I recently sold my house near Akron, OH. I hauled the last part of my stuff out last night. Pulled an enclosed 18 ft trailer loaded with a '68 390 Cougar over 200 miles across I-76 in NE OH and I-80 in western PA. My '07 V8 Sport Trac just topped 163k miles and has been one super tough and reliable little SOB.

[rmc523]

9 hours ago, ExplorerDude said:

I agree I would love to see a new Sport Trac! It was and still is by far my most favorite Ford vehicle over the years. It was more SUV than truck with its molded composite bed and extra large power rear window which actually went down. It was the original “active lifestyle” vehicle which Ford is calling the Ranger now, it’s funny since the Sport Trac served that purpose first.

The original Sport Trac was extremely popular and sold about 60,000 units a year. Unfortunately it’s 2007 Gen 2 redesign didn’t do as well as Gen 1 but I also think that was mostly due to rising gas prices and a general decline in SUV and truck sales at the time. 

I remember hearing at the time during its introduction that they chose to call it an Explorer because people were willing to pay more for an Explorer rather than a Ranger at the time. And it helped the Explorer maintain its #1 selling SUV title as well at the time. Back then there were 3 Explorer body styles.

Still I’d love to see a new one but I feel like there would be too much overlap with a F150 SuperCrew and a Ranger SuperCrew. Those two cover those bases very well.

Maybe they’ll call the little C2 pickup the Courier Sport Trac or Maverick Sport Trac. It’ll be a crewcab only as far as I know.

A truck version of the Maverick could look cool!  Don't know if that's what this thing will ultimately be, but I like the sound of that.

---

I can't find better pictures of it, but they looked good with the Edge Sport's 22's

[atomcat68]

On ‎12‎/‎20‎/‎2018 at 8:33 AM, akirby said:

 

And it shared the Explorer independent rear suspension.

But not the first generation. The first generation Sport Trac and last of the two door Explorer/Mazda Navajo was based on the live axle Explorer and the four door transitioned to an independent suspension. So in essence at that time they were producing Explorers from tow generations at the same time. Sport Trac did switch when it was redesigned.

[jpd80]

On 12/20/2018 at 5:58 AM, fuzzymoomoo said:

The fact that Louisville has been close to or at capacity since the 2013 Escape launched (it only got worse when the MKC started up) is the biggest factor there. MAP was running at capacity until small car sales nosedived in 2015. 

The situation at Louisville seems to be lightening up for the time being next year (they’re cutting a shift in April) but I personally don't think that will last very long if the new Escape is a hit and MKC/Corsair has a bump in sales with it. 

Even now there's still a lot of interchangeable body parts between the Focus and Escape. MAP Stamping is still making parts for Louisville on top of continuing to build their floor pans. 

Ford is slowing down Escape production and sales by reducing incentives and letting sales settle where they will, I don't think compacts make anywhere near as much money as some think....we are so far from the days of Super Segment when Ford would push sales of Fiesta, Focus Escape and Fusion. Ford is showing its true colors now that F Series is on fire, the new Large SUVs and Ranger are here and the new RWD Explorer/Aviator arrives in 2019. any products away from those are much lower priority.

Edited December 21, 2018 by jpd80

[Deanh]

we couldn't give away sport Tracs when they were on the lot...2 reasons...they were bloody expensive at the time , and the bed was tiny....the concept Adrenalin looked stellar, then they sucked the life out of it...and it didn't improve sales either...the Sport Trac was like the answer to the question no one asked…. 

[Gurgeh]

6 minutes ago, jpd80 said:

Ford is slowing down Escape production and sales by reducing incentives and letting sales settle where they will, I don't think compacts make anywhere near as much money as some think....we are so far from the days of Super Segment when Ford would push sales of Fiesta, Focus Escape and Fusion. Ford is showing its true colors now that F Series is on fire, the new Large SUVs and Ranger are here and the new RWD Explorer/Aviator arrives in 2019. any products away from those are much lower priority.

With Job1 for Escape/Corsair coming so soon it makes sense for them to not shake heaven and earth to move compact crossover metal. If people hold off for the fall, Ford will get more profits from the new models, and maybe just maybe some will give a look at the refreshed Edge or even the new Explorer which will be arriving even sooner. 

[jpd80]

2 minutes ago, Gurgeh said:

With Job1 for Escape/Corsair coming so soon it makes sense for them to not shake heaven and earth to move compact crossover metal. If people hold off for the fall, Ford will get more profits from the new models, and maybe just maybe some will give a look at the refreshed Edge or even the new Explorer which will be arriving even sooner. 

At this point, I don't think it really matters, the last refresh on Edge was modest and I think buyers are just over it now, lack of incentives just hurts dealers.

[Deanh]

1 hour ago, jpd80 said:

At this point, I don't think it really matters, the last refresh on Edge was modest and I think buyers are just over it now, lack of incentives just hurts dealers.

FWIW both our ST Edges sold before they hit the lots....