akirby Posted September 20, 2019 Share Posted September 20, 2019 1 hour ago, tbone said: Glad to hear everything worked out for your son, and I too am thankful for the advancements in safety. Regarding the headlights, the headlights in my 2016 Fusion are average at best, however they are only the halogens. I have not reviewed their criteria for headlights to pass complete judgement on it, but I know there are Fusions with better headlight tech. I’m curious to know how much weight they are giving the headlights, because the headlights are not the deciding factor in the occupant’s survivability in a crash. They're counting accident avoidance as a safety feature. I understand there are differences in headlights but I have yet to experience headlights on a new vehicle that would be considered unsafe under any circumstance including my current F150 Halogens which are supposed to be the worst headlights on the face of the earth. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted September 20, 2019 Share Posted September 20, 2019 3 hours ago, rmc523 said: A model not being IIHS++++++++ or whatever new designation they come up with doesn't mean the existing model or previous model isn't safe. Just means it doesn't fit their moved goalposts. And most of these models seem to not get the highest rating because of headlights and pass everything else. I feel just as safe in a 2009 vehicle as I do in a 2019 vehicle from a crash protection perspective. I think the odds of having an accident where one vehicle is survivable and the other isn't are so small that they're immeasurable. Below a certain speed both survive. Above a certain speed neither survive. Same with other conditions - angle, type of vehicle, etc. Too many variables to predict with any certainty based on 2 or 3 lab tests. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rperez817 Posted September 20, 2019 Author Share Posted September 20, 2019 20 minutes ago, akirby said: current F150 Halogens which are supposed to be the worst headlights on the face of the earth. F-150 halogen headlamps are bad, but the worst performing headlamps yet tested by IIHS were the halogens on 2016 BMW F30 320i and 328i sedan. Those BMW headlamps illuminated 5 lux straight ahead on the drivers side only 128 feet ahead of the vehicle. That means the vehicle couldn't be traveling at more than 35 mph and still give the driver enough time to stop and avoid hitting a pedestrian, bicyclist or obstacle. https://www.iihs.org/ratings/vehicle/BMW/3-series-4-door-sedan/2016#headlights Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted September 20, 2019 Share Posted September 20, 2019 12 minutes ago, rperez817 said: F-150 halogen headlamps are bad, but the worst performing headlamps yet tested by IIHS were the halogens on 2016 BMW F30 320i and 328i sedan. Those BMW headlamps illuminated 5 lux straight ahead on the drivers side only 128 feet ahead of the vehicle. That means the vehicle couldn't be traveling at more than 35 mph and still give the driver enough time to stop and avoid hitting a pedestrian, bicyclist or obstacle. https://www.iihs.org/ratings/vehicle/BMW/3-series-4-door-sedan/2016#headlights Which ignores street lighting, lighting from oncoming vehicles, reflective clothing, etc. as well as the ability to still make an evasive maneuver even if there is not enough time to come to a complete stop. Also - who says 5 Lux is the limit? A full moon is only 1 lux, so 5 is 5 times as bright as a full moon. I think I could see something 150 feet away in less than 5 lux. Just because IIHS says it doesn't mean it's accurate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
02MustangGT Posted September 20, 2019 Share Posted September 20, 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, akirby said: They're counting accident avoidance as a safety feature. I understand there are differences in headlights but I have yet to experience headlights on a new vehicle that would be considered unsafe under any circumstance including my current F150 Halogens which are supposed to be the worst headlights on the face of the earth. No. The halogens on the 09-14 F150 are the worst headlights on the face of the earth. I installed HID’s in the fogs and am considering replacing the halogen headlights with LED’s. Then it will be considered unsafe for oncoming traffic lol. My Fusion Sport LED’s are great (at least from a driver’s perspective). Edit: now that I think about it, my 2002 Mustang GT headlights are the worst. But that car is old and I don’t drive it at night anymore Edited September 20, 2019 by 02MustangGT Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rperez817 Posted September 20, 2019 Author Share Posted September 20, 2019 (edited) 2 hours ago, akirby said: Also - who says 5 Lux is the limit? A full moon is only 1 lux, so 5 is 5 times as bright as a full moon. I think I could see something 150 feet away in less than 5 lux. Just because IIHS says it doesn't mean it's accurate. 5 lux as a minimum value is based on recommended practices for roadway lighting published by Illuminating Engineering Society of North America and American Association of State Highway and Transportation Officials. The Lighting Research Center at Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute has extensive bibliographies for this and other topics on the subject of transportation lighting and safety. Sample. https://www.lrc.rpi.edu/programs/transportation/TLA/pdf/TLA-2004-01.pdf You can e-mail rrader@iihs.org if you have any issues with the accuracy of info provided by IIHS. Or have questions or concerns about the methodologies used for their testing and awards. Edited September 20, 2019 by rperez817 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted September 20, 2019 Share Posted September 20, 2019 18 minutes ago, rperez817 said: 5 lux as a minimum value is based on recommended practices for roadway lighting published by Illuminating Engineering Society of North America and American Association of State Highway and Transportation Officials. The Lighting Research Center at Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute has extensive bibliographies for this and other topics on the subject of transportation lighting and safety. Sample. https://www.lrc.rpi.edu/programs/transportation/TLA/pdf/TLA-2004-01.pdf You can e-mail rrader@iihs.org if you have any issues with the accuracy of info provided by IIHS. Or have questions or concerns about the methodologies used for their testing and awards. Not optimal doesn’t equal unsafe. It’s not optimal for me to read by candlelight but I can still do it. You really need to start thinking for yourself and stop taking everything you read at face value. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rperez817 Posted September 20, 2019 Author Share Posted September 20, 2019 1 hour ago, akirby said: Not optimal doesn’t equal unsafe. It’s not optimal for me to read by candlelight but I can still do it. You really need to start thinking for yourself and stop taking everything you read at face value. Do you work in the field of photometrics? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted September 21, 2019 Share Posted September 21, 2019 1 hour ago, rperez817 said: Do you work in the field of photometrics? No. Show me where a photometric expert claims that you can’t see someone entering the road ahead at night at less than 5 Lux. The issue isn’t with the requirement or whether some lights are worse than others. The issue is whether failing the IIHS standard makes it unsafe because that is exactly what they’re implying. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blwnsmoke Posted September 23, 2019 Share Posted September 23, 2019 On 9/20/2019 at 9:02 PM, akirby said: No. Show me where a photometric expert claims that you can’t see someone entering the road ahead at night at less than 5 Lux. The issue isn’t with the requirement or whether some lights are worse than others. The issue is whether failing the IIHS standard makes it unsafe because that is exactly what they’re implying. Standby for another google search and link. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bbf2530 Posted September 23, 2019 Share Posted September 23, 2019 On 9/20/2019 at 6:28 PM, akirby said: Not optimal doesn’t equal unsafe. It’s not optimal for me to read by candlelight but I can still do it. You really need to start thinking for yourself and stop taking everything you read at face value. Not one of your better analogies Allen. You were a little off your game on that one. ?? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rperez817 Posted September 23, 2019 Author Share Posted September 23, 2019 On 9/20/2019 at 9:02 PM, akirby said: No. Show me where a photometric expert claims that you can’t see someone entering the road ahead at night at less than 5 Lux. The issue isn’t with the requirement or whether some lights are worse than others. The issue is whether failing the IIHS standard makes it unsafe because that is exactly what they’re implying. Thanks for confirming that you have absolutely no understanding of either photometrics or IIHS' TOP SAFETY PICK program. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted September 23, 2019 Share Posted September 23, 2019 15 minutes ago, rperez817 said: Thanks for confirming that you have absolutely no understanding of either photometrics or IIHS' TOP SAFETY PICK program. I bow to the great googler and poster of links. I am not worthy. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmc523 Posted September 23, 2019 Share Posted September 23, 2019 3 hours ago, rperez817 said: Thanks for confirming that you have absolutely no understanding of either photometrics or IIHS' TOP SAFETY PICK program. lol, and you do? 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blwnsmoke Posted September 23, 2019 Share Posted September 23, 2019 27 minutes ago, rmc523 said: lol, and you do? Yes, google says so. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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