Ford Mustang Mach E World Premiere Nov 17 9PM EST

[jpd80]

1 minute ago, snooter said:

Whats that mustang doin on front end of a chebby camaro?....

 

Ford is workin both sides of the street now...

[fuzzymoomoo]

14 minutes ago, jpd80 said:

Ford is workin both sides of the street now...

Don't feed the troll

[Gurgeh]

Credit Suisse says Tesla is running out of time as the major electric car maker – shares to dive 40%

 

"Credit Suisse on Thursday noted that Tesla has nearly an 80% share of the U.S. market for electric vehicles but the firm expects that the automaker's "unique position" with its Model 3 will face a serious challenge from Ford next year...

 

"For all the competition entering the market we are still awaiting the EV that will be a true competitive threat to Model 3...

 

"Yet to the extent Tesla continues to struggle with the basic 'blocking and tackling' of the auto business (i.e., manufacturing, delivery logistics, service), it risks not capitalizing on this opportunity," Levy said...

 

He believes Tesla will soon face a key test as "the only game in town," as Ford is expected to announce the Mach-E on Sunday, a line of a Mustang-inspired electric SUVs...

 

"Ford's new BEV should provide a more compelling alternative at the Model 3 price range than the other comps, especially given the performance focus," Levy said.

 

https://www.cnbc.com/2019/11/14/tesla-skeptic-model-3-window-of-opportunity-but-ford-ev-coming-soon.html

[Assimilator]

Well, I would caution doom and gloom for Tesla, it hasn't worked before.  Tesla is still much more than just the car, it's a pretty unique experience top to bottom that makes it very appealing.  The tech in a Tesla is still very different than Ford, especially the software and autonomous tech.  Not to mention the charging infrastructure and service experience.   Ford is still old school compared to Tesla, although the Mach E is a nice effort.  I don't really think it's going to be a threat to Tesla, but it should convince more non-Tesla customers. 

 

Culturally these are VERY different companies, Ford is responding to Tesla with a vehicle that is pretending not to be an EV. There is something a little gross and clumsy about it to me and why I'm not really sold on it yet.  The fake vroom vroom noises are one of those things I really dislike, alongside the dubiousness of the Mustang co-branding. 

Edited November 15, 2019 by Assimilator

[T-dubz]

so does that big ass screen come standard? The interior looks ok, but they just straight up copied Tesla. The instrument panel screen looks a bit odd too.maybe it’s because of its shape, or the fact that it doesn’t have the hood covering it like most IP’s do.

 

i like the exterior although the front looks more fusion than mustang. I wish there was a version that had less performance and more range. The California Route 1 trim (terrible name) seems to be that but it’s more expensive. If they made a select trim with 300 mile range and 0-60 around 7 to 8 seconds with a price of $45-46k, I’d be all over it.

some of the comments on the Mach e forum said it doesn’t come with leather or ventilated seats on any trim. I find that hard to believe and if it’s true, I’d say that’s a big mistake.
 

 

[Assimilator]

The battery size is the big expense so that's what you're paying for.  I would probably select AWD Premium which gets 270 miles of range.  The GT is just too low if you live in Michigan, 230 is probably 200 in Winter.  Right now I'm planning on making a reservation on Sunday.   

Edited November 15, 2019 by Assimilator

[AGR]

1 hour ago, Assimilator said:

Well, I would caution doom and gloom for Tesla, it hasn't worked before.  Tesla is still much more than just the car, it's a pretty unique experience top to bottom that makes it very appealing.  The tech in a Tesla is still very different than Ford, especially the software and autonomous tech.  Not to mention the charging infrastructure and service experience.   Ford is still old school compared to Tesla, although the Mach E is a nice effort.  I don't really think it's going to be a threat to Tesla, but it should convince more non-Tesla customers. 

 

Culturally these are VERY different companies, Ford is responding to Tesla with a vehicle that is pretending not to be an EV. There is something a little gross and clumsy about it to me and why I'm not really sold on it yet.  The fake vroom vroom noises are one of those things I really dislike, alongside the dubiousness of the Mustang co-branding. 

Agreed. And Ford aimed for the (soon to be) old Supercharger charging rates. 47 miles in 10 minutes is 3× slower than the Supercharger V3 (75 miles/5 min meaning 150 miles/10 min).

[Bellanca]

Yeah, not really feeling it. 

[Bellanca]

Maybe it’ll look better in Live Photos but to me it has that X6 body style which is a terrible thing. 

Edited November 15, 2019 by Bellanca

[atomcat68]

well, cat's out of the bag anyway.  

 

Edit: Changed my mind. It's not a good thing to post it so deleted. Just check out the other link.

Edited November 15, 2019 by atomcat68

[silvrsvt]

https://www.motorauthority.com/news/1126031_this-is-the-2021-ford-mustang-mach-e-with-up-to-300-miles-of-range-0-60-in-3-seconds-43-895-base-price

[Gurgeh]

2 hours ago, silvrsvt said:

https://www.motorauthority.com/news/1126031_this-is-the-2021-ford-mustang-mach-e-with-up-to-300-miles-of-range-0-60-in-3-seconds-43-895-base-price

 

"The 2021 Ford Mach-E electric crossover SUV will have up to 300 miles of driving range, sprint from 0 to 60 mph in mid 3-second range, and have all-wheel drive—although not all in the same car."

 

There's the rub.

 

For what it's worth, I think the exterior styling is superb. The interior, not so much. I loath the trend, with Tesla at the extreme (and now apparently the Mach-E as well), of running everything off of a huge tablet screen with hardly any physical controls. But then, Ford is aiming this at Tesla's Model 3 and Y...

 

BTW, I think the CNBC article I posted earlier with the Credit Swisse quotes was indeed overly alarmist (or optimistic, depending on your point of view) about the Mustang Mach-E threatening to do in Tesla. The Credit Swisse analyst quoted is a long-time skeptic of Tesla's current stock price. The Mach-E can hardly be deemed a Tesla killer, but it is competitive, has some buzz, and will hit the same "affordable" price range of the 3 and Y. Tesla still needs to figure out how to make money and losing even a portion of its market share wouldn't help.

 

One last point of negativity. Another thing I hate, and too many other automakers are doing the same thing, is adding a fake vroooom vroooom audio track to their otherwise increasingly quiet vehicles. It reminds me of a kid making raspberry noises with his tongue sticking out while playing with his Hot Wheels car in the sand box. I get that a BEV needs a little motion noise for safety's sake, but still...

Edited November 15, 2019 by Gurgeh

[silvrsvt]

6 minutes ago, Gurgeh said:

For what it's worth, I think the exterior styling is superb. The interior, not so much. I loath the trend, with Tesla at the extreme (and now apparently the Mach-E as well), of running everything off of a huge tablet screen with hardly any physical controls. But then, Ford is aiming this at Tesla's Model 3 and Y...

 

Yeah I'm not a huge fan of the minimalist trend in EVs-it looks "cheap" to me. I think only the Porsche Tycan is the only one that gets it (as far as I can see) right-even though they have a analog clock in it-but that also doubles as a lap timer and other things.

 

The exterior is very well done-it looks like a Mustang, if it was an EV and a CUV  

For what Tesla offers (and what people think are strengths, just because they are different then other manufactures) is one of the reasons why they'll never really have wide acceptance in the market place-its aimed at high end buyers who like gadgets. Ford is going a different route with their first BEV...lets see how it goes. Its a better route then just going down the compliance car route they where expected to though. 

[novanglus]

9 hours ago, Gurgeh said:

Credit Suisse says Tesla is running out of time as the major electric car maker – shares to dive 40%

 

"Credit Suisse on Thursday noted that Tesla has nearly an 80% share of the U.S. market for electric vehicles but the firm expects that the automaker's "unique position" with its Model 3 will face a serious challenge from Ford next year...

 

"For all the competition entering the market we are still awaiting the EV that will be a true competitive threat to Model 3...

 

"Yet to the extent Tesla continues to struggle with the basic 'blocking and tackling' of the auto business (i.e., manufacturing, delivery logistics, service), it risks not capitalizing on this opportunity," Levy said...

 

He believes Tesla will soon face a key test as "the only game in town," as Ford is expected to announce the Mach-E on Sunday, a line of a Mustang-inspired electric SUVs...

 

"Ford's new BEV should provide a more compelling alternative at the Model 3 price range than the other comps, especially given the performance focus," Levy said.

 

https://www.cnbc.com/2019/11/14/tesla-skeptic-model-3-window-of-opportunity-but-ford-ev-coming-soon.html

...written by a TSLAQ short, no doubt.  If anything, the Mach E shows how solid Tesla’s lead is.  It is about Y sized.  Less range, less performance, costs more, charges slower...

 

The Y will be shipping months before the Mach does, maybe by half a year.  And a lot of guys, me included, who own 3s, when choosing between the 2 for the wifey, are going to take into account the livability and eco-system.  Do I want to be in the Supercharger network or EA?  Do I want a company that sees the purchase as an entry point and continues to improve my vehicle post purchase or one that sees it as an end product to be shipped out?  Do they see it as a smart phone or a laser printer?

 

Those questions haven’t been answered yet.  I look forward to watching the reveal and hope there are some hints as to how Ford is addressing those issues (or if they’re even aware of them).

 

So, it’s obvious the Credit Suisse dude isnt aware of the market.  He just thinks you put numbers on websites and you’re done.

[Assimilator]

I actually think the Mach E exposes some of the backwards thinking of Ford when it comes to EVs.  It's a copy-cat that tries NOT to resemble an EV, right down to the long hood and vroom vroom Mustang noises.  I think it could be ridiculed as out of touch and it's one of many things that leaves me unimpressed with Ford's first attempt. The specs are almost there, I don't know about the rest. I would still prefer a Model Y personally, the design is integral and honest with the form factor and the interior space benefits from it. 

 

I actually like the interior design quite a bit, especially for a Ford. I think the Tesla interior looks better however.  

 

The Mustang does have a few things going for it that I wish Tesla had, such as Wireless CarPlay and Satellite Radio. 

Edited November 15, 2019 by Assimilator

[Roland]

8 hours ago, atomcat68 said:

Also, I don't think there are many Mustang owners that will stop buying the real Mustang because the electric Suv also has the name. It would not stop me.

 

SUVs are not pony cars.  This taints the Mustang brand.   Seeing electric mom vans complete with plastic cladding running around looking like a fat Elvis version of the Mustang is going to be tough to stomach.  It's a stain that you can't wash off.  It damages the appeal of the vehicle that it's mocking.  It's like meeting an attractive woman and then seeing her parents and noticing that she shares features with her fat, ugly dad.  There's not enough eye bleach to unsee that.

 

As much as I try not to be brand conscious when I'm making purchase decisions I can't deny that it exists and has an impact.  When I bought my Mustang the Mustang was an icon and Ford was a positive based on decades of experience with their cars.  Now Ford is a truck company that sees no future in cars and Mustang is a muddled brand with no real meaning that Ford can stamp on anything that they consider "exciting."

 

My last purchase decision was a near thing.  Since then the competition has improved or at least not gotten worse while Ford has become a bizarro world parody of every bad marketing decision they've ever made.  There's little doubt that my purchase decision would go another way today.  So that's one.  And I seriously doubt that it's the only.

[Anthony]

I am not feeling the backend.  It looks like they squished the Mustang backend into a stripe on a massive tush.

 

 

 

It may be an unpopular opinion, but I'm really not feeling the entire design after seeing the production photos.  Granted, the images they use on Ford's website tend to always be the worst, so I'll wait patiently for Sunday to see some nicer imagery.  But, it looks a bit ungainly from certain angles, especially the rear.

 

 

[NLPRacing]

3 minutes ago, Anthony said:

I am not feeling the backend.  It looks like they squished the Mustang backend into a stripe on a massive tush.

 

 

 

It may be an unpopular opinion, but I'm really not feeling the entire design after seeing the production photos.  Granted, the images they use on Ford's website tend to always be the worst, so I'll wait patiently for Sunday to see some nicer imagery.  But, it looks a bit ungainly from certain angles, especially the rear.

 

 

 

I agree, I was hoping for something more like the Mercedes GLC Coupe. This looks a little narrow. I wonder how the front & rear track width compares to the current Mustang.

 

[coupe3w]

To me it's just another over priced CUV with an iconic name. Not a fan.

[Assimilator]

I should point out that the version in the leaked page is not the GT model, I believe it's the Premium or California model.

 

The GT gets a unique fascia design with a radiating grille surround pattern with bigger/wider 20" wheels which I'm sure costs them a ton on range.  It helps it look more like a Mustang than this car which looks like a Ford SUV. 

Edited November 15, 2019 by Assimilator

[akirby]

32 minutes ago, Roland said:

 

SUVs are not pony cars.  This taints the Mustang brand.  

 

People said EXACTLY the same thing about Porsche which at one time was synonymous with 2 door sports cars.   But then they made a Panamera which is nothing more than a 4 door 911 regardless of the name.  Then they made (gasp!) SUVs!   Did any of the diminish the 911?  Of course not.  Because those vehicles perform like a Porsche.  And mach-e performs like a mustang - even better in some cases.

 

Mustang coupe isn't "tainted" because another version has 4 doors.  At least not for 99.999% of potential buyers.

[akirby]

55 minutes ago, novanglus said:

...written by a TSLAQ short, no doubt.  If anything, the Mach E shows how solid Tesla’s lead is.  It is about Y sized.  Less range, less performance, costs more, charges slower...

 

The Y will be shipping months before the Mach does, maybe by half a year.  And a lot of guys, me included, who own 3s, when choosing between the 2 for the wifey, are going to take into account the livability and eco-system.  Do I want to be in the Supercharger network or EA?  Do I want a company that sees the purchase as an entry point and continues to improve my vehicle post purchase or one that sees it as an end product to be shipped out?  Do they see it as a smart phone or a laser printer?

 

Those questions haven’t been answered yet.  I look forward to watching the reveal and hope there are some hints as to how Ford is addressing those issues (or if they’re even aware of them).

 

So, it’s obvious the Credit Suisse dude isnt aware of the market.  He just thinks you put numbers on websites and you’re done.

 

This isn't necessarily going after Tesla buyers - at least not the Tesla-philes.   This is an alternative for folks who want a BEV but not necessarily a Tesla.

The one thing that Mach E can probably do that Tesla can't is turn a profit.

[coupe3w]

19 minutes ago, akirby said:

 

People said EXACTLY the same thing about Porsche which at one time was synonymous with 2 door sports cars.   But then they made a Panamera which is nothing more than a 4 door 911 regardless of the name.  Then they made (gasp!) SUVs!   Did any of the diminish the 911?  Of course not.  Because those vehicles perform like a Porsche.  And mach-e performs like a mustang - even better in some cases.

 

Mustang coupe isn't "tainted" because another version has 4 doors.  At least not for 99.999% of potential buyers.

 

Porsche did it so it's okay. Join in the success!

2018 sales:

911 9,647

Panamera 8,042

Edited November 15, 2019 by coupe3w

[fordmantpw]

You know when iPhones first came out, they were the cool thing, and arguably the best around for years.  But, there were people who wouldn't buy an Apple product because Apple.

 

You know when Teslas first came out, they were the cool thing, and arguably the best around for years.  But, there were people who wouldn't buy a Tesla product because Tesla.

 

Now, I'm not saying this is better or worse than a Tesla, but Tesla buyers get that 'snob' factor, and many people won't buy a Tesla for that reason.  Bam, Ford sells out of the Mach-E!

 

Personally, I think it looks great (though I will wait for better pics of the interior to judge for sure).  I would love to have one, and it would be a perfect fit for my driving, though I doubt I can talk the wife into replacing her Escape with one, and I don't have the funds to buy this as a second vehicle to replace the Flex.

 

 

[akirby]

11 minutes ago, coupe3w said:

 

Porsche did it so it's okay. Join in the success!

2018 sales:

911 9,647

Panamera 8,042

 

Of the 246,375 cars produced in the 2017 financial year, 32,197 were 911 models, 25,114 were Boxster and Cayman cars, 63,913 were Cayennes, 27,942 were Panameras and 97,202 were Macans.[47]