Deanh Posted October 3, 2019 Author Share Posted October 3, 2019 2 minutes ago, novanglus said: ...you’re not really comparing like products, though. My M3P is probably truly on average good for around 240-250mi in mixed driving on $7.50 in electricity. That is about 3 gallons of gas nowadays. Find me a car that can do 0-60 in 3.2s and get the gas cost equivalent of 80mpg. Even if you halved the range (which would never happen where a I live; doesn’t get nearly that cold), you’d still be up by 2x on the game for a similar performance vehicle (figuring 20mpg for a serious AWD performance sedan). Youre not going to compete with EV in operating cost. correct me if Im wrong...but Im pretty sure a lot of maintenance savings are made up with more expensive Insurance premiums...I know teslas are quite expensive to insure....( and fires and ignorance towards what Autopilot is and isn't capable of, may be part of the reason ) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted October 3, 2019 Share Posted October 3, 2019 39 minutes ago, Deanh said: Mark ...or should I say Mach, my words...there WILL be incentives plan customers will be eligible for / receive that regular customers wont. Care to wager? On Mach-E for the first year? You’re dreaming. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted October 3, 2019 Author Share Posted October 3, 2019 2 minutes ago, akirby said: On Mach-E for the first year? You’re dreaming. then bets on....on the numbers Im hearing that will be produced there will be some form of re-imbursement to X, A Z D plan customers...can almost guarantee it...well re-visit this when they start hitting lots... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harley Lover Posted October 3, 2019 Share Posted October 3, 2019 1 hour ago, Deanh said: then bets on....on the numbers Im hearing that will be produced there will be some form of re-imbursement to X, A Z D plan customers...can almost guarantee it...well re-visit this when they start hitting lots... What's the wager? No talk without backing it up! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ice-capades Posted October 3, 2019 Share Posted October 3, 2019 Too many messages in this thread to reply to individually so I'll try to address them in one reply. I'm more than surprised that the first year's production of the Mach E is only 40,000 units. This is a Mustang "inspired" BEV that will be a stand out once it's on the road, instantly recognizable as a Ford product and a Tesla competitor at a more attractive price point. Perhaps Ford is being overly conservative with it's projected first year volume but I think the planned production volume will increase quickly once they see the interest and reservations placed after the unveiling, etc. Forget this "MSRP is Invoice" talk. There is no Invoice price. MSRP is the ONLY price. Period. Dealers will be paid a commission. It's a commission, maybe similar to A/X/D Plan sales but it's a commission, not a "Spiff" which implies that it's an incentive. Based on what I've been told, the expected average commission paid to Dealers will negate any need for MSRP+ pricing. I doubt that there will be "Plan" pricing available for the Mach E the first year. This will be a limited production vehicle and there will be little need to offer "Plan" pricing until production and sales volume can absorb or justify it. A big factor will be the reaction to this being a "Mustang Inspired" BEV. Imagine a 4-Door Mustang BEV that competes with Tesla at a more attractive price point, is instantly recognizable as a Mustang styled vehicle that can be serviced at more than 3,000 Ford dealerships. 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted October 4, 2019 Share Posted October 4, 2019 1 hour ago, ice-capades said: Forget this "MSRP is Invoice" talk. There is no Invoice price. MSRP is the ONLY price. Period. Dealers will be paid a commission. It's a commission, maybe similar to A/X/D Plan sales but it's a commission, not a "Spiff" which implies that it's an incentive. Well that was the point - the dealer is charged MSRP and sells to the buyer for MSRP and the profit comes from the commission. Thus dealer invoice and MSRP are the same. I’ve always heard the plan commissions referred to as spiff checks so I’m not sure why there is a difference, but if commission is more accurate that’s fine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trader 10 Posted October 4, 2019 Share Posted October 4, 2019 3 hours ago, novanglus said: Youre not going to compete with EV in operating cost. Only if you ignore the higher purchase price of EV’s vs. ICE. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twintornados Posted October 4, 2019 Share Posted October 4, 2019 10 hours ago, Trader 10 said: Only if you ignore the higher purchase price of EV’s vs. ICE. The average EV shopper will not be concerned of the price gap between EV vs ICE...they will be shopping EV vs EV. Now, when you get into the "mainstream" of the market where a shopper such as myself would consider going EV over ICE, maybe the higher purchase price would be a stumbling block, but a good presentation will likely overcome that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted October 4, 2019 Author Share Posted October 4, 2019 16 hours ago, Harley Lover said: What's the wager? No talk without backing it up! I don't know what akirbys got on me , but Ill release the shots of him driving a Ferrari on track....its actually a Yugo painted red with a prancing horse emblem silicone to the hood.....lol.... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HotRunrGuy Posted October 4, 2019 Share Posted October 4, 2019 3 minutes ago, Deanh said: I don't know what akirbys got on me , but Ill release the shots of him driving a Ferrari on track....its actually a Yugo painted red with a prancing horse emblem silicone to the hood.....lol.... Years ago I worked with a kid that bought a red Opel GT, put a Ferrari emblem on the nose, and always called it his "Ferropel" HRG 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blazerdude20 Posted October 4, 2019 Share Posted October 4, 2019 On 10/3/2019 at 9:04 AM, Deanh said: that's at the Dealer and on site...Honda dealers CANNOT advertise...ie newspaper etc for less than invoice. What dealers do on site is of their own making. Missed the invoice part of that. Regardless I think it’s a good model to follow. Dealers will likely bitch, but it helps to keep certain dealers from caving the market for everyone else. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted October 4, 2019 Share Posted October 4, 2019 43 minutes ago, Deanh said: I don't know what akirbys got on me , but Ill release the shots of him driving a Ferrari on track....its actually a Yugo painted red with a prancing horse emblem silicone to the hood.....lol.... And a VW painted like a Porsche......... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted October 4, 2019 Author Share Posted October 4, 2019 21 minutes ago, akirby said: And a VW painted like a Porsche......... we used to have quite a few Mercedes Sl trade ins where the 300SL badge had become 500SL......hilarious.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted October 4, 2019 Share Posted October 4, 2019 24 minutes ago, Deanh said: we used to have quite a few Mercedes Sl trade ins where the 300SL badge had become 500SL......hilarious.... I've seen a bunch of regular BMWs with M badges. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K270 Posted October 4, 2019 Share Posted October 4, 2019 There was a guy that worked for a Circuit City nearby. He had a 2001 or 2002 V6 Mustang. He spent the money to make it look like a Cobra. I was laughing as the transition happened because it wasn't done all at once. I think the front bumper was first. Then the badging. It did look somewhat decent when it was done. But I've always wondered, why would someone go through the trouble? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harley Lover Posted October 4, 2019 Share Posted October 4, 2019 6 minutes ago, K270 said: There was a guy that worked for a Circuit City nearby. He had a 2001 or 2002 V6 Mustang. He spent the money to make it look like a Cobra. I was laughing as the transition happened because it wasn't done all at once. I think the front bumper was first. Then the badging. It did look somewhat decent when it was done. But I've always wondered, why would someone go through the trouble? It's known as being an enthusiast. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
probowler Posted October 5, 2019 Share Posted October 5, 2019 As long as he didn't use the cobra badging, more power to him. The cobra bodykit was freaking nice! But to put a cobra badge on a V6 is just ridiculous. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harley Lover Posted October 5, 2019 Share Posted October 5, 2019 11 hours ago, probowler said: As long as he didn't use the cobra badging, more power to him. The cobra bodykit was freaking nice! But to put a cobra badge on a V6 is just ridiculous. Ford didn't seem to mind bastardizing the Cobra name (as long as it would move units): Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sullynd Posted October 5, 2019 Share Posted October 5, 2019 On 10/3/2019 at 5:56 PM, ice-capades said: Forget this "MSRP is Invoice" talk. There is no Invoice price. MSRP is the ONLY price. Period. Dealers will be paid a commission. It's a commission, maybe similar to A/X/D Plan sales but it's a commission, not a "Spiff" which implies that it's an incentive. Based on what I've been told, the expected average commission paid to Dealers will negate any need for MSRP+ pricing. is there a reason this sales model wouldn’t work for other Ford models, or Lincolns? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoonerLS Posted October 5, 2019 Share Posted October 5, 2019 21 hours ago, akirby said: I've seen a bunch of regular BMWs with M badges. The M badges don't mean as much since BMW started offering it as a "package" on non-M vehicles. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trader 10 Posted October 5, 2019 Share Posted October 5, 2019 3 hours ago, sullynd said: is there a reason this sales model wouldn’t work for other Ford models, or Lincolns? It didn’t for Saturn. I don’t think it would work unless the competition went that way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
probowler Posted October 5, 2019 Share Posted October 5, 2019 4 hours ago, Harley Lover said: Ford didn't seem to mind bastardizing the Cobra name (as long as it would move units): Well Australia isn't a real country, so by extension neither is Ford Australia Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anthony Posted October 5, 2019 Share Posted October 5, 2019 1 hour ago, probowler said: Well Australia isn't a real country, so by extension neither is Ford Australia What does a Mustang II Cobra II have to do with Australia? (PS: I had one but not with all the stickers by the time it got to me!) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
novanglus Posted October 5, 2019 Share Posted October 5, 2019 On 10/3/2019 at 5:00 PM, Deanh said: correct me if Im wrong...but Im pretty sure a lot of maintenance savings are made up with more expensive Insurance premiums...I know teslas are quite expensive to insure....( and fires and ignorance towards what Autopilot is and isn't capable of, may be part of the reason ) My wife’s CT6 PHEV is $529 for 6mo, my M3P is $420 for 6mo for the same coverage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
novanglus Posted October 5, 2019 Share Posted October 5, 2019 On 10/3/2019 at 8:49 PM, Trader 10 said: Only if you ignore the higher purchase price of EV’s vs. ICE. Ok. Point me to an AWD mid-sized ICE sedan than runs 3.2s to 60 and its pricing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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