deflep1 Posted November 8, 2019 Share Posted November 8, 2019 https://www.freep.com/story/money/cars/ford/2019/11/08/uaw-ford-contract-agreement-raises/2525639001/ This should help get more yes votes. There were a lot of people voting NO because of this error in the language. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ididntdoit Posted November 8, 2019 Share Posted November 8, 2019 I wonder if they know they interviewed a leader of one of CAP's roving gangs. Or maybe he's their source ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deflep1 Posted November 8, 2019 Author Share Posted November 8, 2019 7 minutes ago, Ididntdoit said: I wonder if they know they interviewed a leader of one of CAP's roving gangs. Or maybe he's their source ? Not sure about that, but the union realized the contract could be voted down because of that specific provision. In progression weren't getting a 4% lump sum bonus until they maxed out at Legacy pay, because they were still getting raises every year. Workers with a seniority date before the ratification date were getting penalized by waiting too long for their 3% raise to kick in along with their 52 week raise. This was caught at Flat Rock's meeting and our chairman Larry Stewart said the highlights and tentative agreement didn't match correctly on this provision and needed to be changed. Other locals also caught it and notified the national bargaining committee, who talked to Ford yesterday. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ididntdoit Posted November 8, 2019 Share Posted November 8, 2019 because of a typo, nothing more nothing less. But we can play democrats and twist into a conspiracy if ya like. but freepress talking about CAP's "roving gangs" intimidating people in one article then interviews a leader of one in this article it's freaking comical Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fuzzymoomoo Posted November 8, 2019 Share Posted November 8, 2019 14 minutes ago, Ididntdoit said: because of a typo, nothing more nothing less. But we can play democrats and twist into a conspiracy if ya like. but freepress talking about CAP's "roving gangs" intimidating people in one article then interviews a leader of one in this article it's freaking comical Freep is a joke. They still stand by declaring Hillary the winner in Michigan minutes after the polls closed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cecilmeyer Posted November 9, 2019 Share Posted November 9, 2019 1 hour ago, Ididntdoit said: I wonder if they know they interviewed a leader of one of CAP's roving gangs. Or maybe he's their source ? Who are you referring to when talking about CAPs roving gangs? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigDeal Posted November 9, 2019 Share Posted November 9, 2019 2 hours ago, deflep1 said: Not sure about that, but the union realized the contract could be voted down because of that specific provision. In progression weren't getting a 4% lump sum bonus until they maxed out at Legacy pay, because they were still getting raises every year. Workers with a seniority date before the ratification date were getting penalized by waiting too long for their 3% raise to kick in along with their 52 week raise. This was caught at Flat Rock's meeting and our chairman Larry Stewart said the highlights and tentative agreement didn't match correctly on this provision and needed to be changed. Other locals also caught it and notified the national bargaining committee, who talked to Ford yesterday. Where does it say in progression are getting the first 4% lump sum now? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fuzzymoomoo Posted November 9, 2019 Share Posted November 9, 2019 1 minute ago, BigDeal said: Where does it say in progression are getting the first 4% lump sum now? We only get it once we get to top pay, so if you're 2013 seniority or lower you get screwed out of the first one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ididntdoit Posted November 9, 2019 Share Posted November 9, 2019 49 minutes ago, cecilmeyer said: Who are you referring to when talking about CAPs roving gangs? the union cliques blue shirts red shirts election time, really nothing different then any other plant with large numbers, just Chicago's version of it. 53 minutes ago, fuzzymoomoo said: We only get it once we get to top pay, so if you're 2013 seniority or lower you get screwed out of the first one. how do you get screwed out of something you're not entitled to yet? imagine sitting at the same rate for 2 contracts. Be happy there is a raise waiting for you after your first year at top rate I was at 20 years in before I seen my first 3%. I'll give you my 4% for an immediate release with STEP, like I want to be gone by thanksgiving with check in the bank. I know you can make it happen Fuzzy, I'm sure you know a guy that knows a guy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ontopya Posted November 9, 2019 Share Posted November 9, 2019 3 hours ago, Ididntdoit said: the union cliques blue shirts red shirts election time, really nothing different then any other plant with large numbers, just Chicago's version of it. how do you get screwed out of something you're not entitled to yet? imagine sitting at the same rate for 2 contracts. Be happy there is a raise waiting for you after your first year at top rate I was at 20 years in before I seen my first 3%. I'll give you my 4% for an immediate release with STEP, like I want to be gone by thanksgiving with check in the bank. I know you can make it happen Fuzzy, I'm sure you know a guy that knows a guy. Here’s what you’ll don’t understand...the hourly rate you sat at for two contracts was an obscene amount compared to the average outside of your bubble. $27 or more in 1999-2006 would be equal to what in 2019? I seriously want to see if you can give me an accurate answer before I tell you. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ididntdoit Posted November 9, 2019 Share Posted November 9, 2019 1 minute ago, Ontopya said: Here’s what you’ll don’t understand.. you start off with bad grammar and want to play math games with me? in 24 yrs I have never made an obscene amount, I've never worked inside nor outside of a bubble. my $27 in 2005 is $14.65 in 2019, now imagine you had these bonuses, COLA and holidays for your first 8-12 years and then have them taken away and not given a raise for 8 years. And then watch this guy today with 7 years cry because he's not getting that 3-4% for another year even though you waited 8 for it. I'm sorry if I ran out of sympathy after 2015. But you want to know who did make an obscene amount? 10 convicted IUAW members. Go play math games with them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fuzzymoomoo Posted November 9, 2019 Share Posted November 9, 2019 Congratulations, you fell for the division screwed was probably the wrong choice of word. Unfair is probably more applicable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ontopya Posted November 9, 2019 Share Posted November 9, 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, Ididntdoit said: you start off with bad grammar and want to play math games with me? in 24 yrs I have never made an obscene amount, I've never worked inside nor outside of a bubble. my $27 in 2005 is $14.65 in 2019, now imagine you had these bonuses, COLA and holidays for your first 8-12 years and then have them taken away and not given a raise for 8 years. And then watch this guy today with 7 years cry because he's not getting that 3-4% for another year even though you waited 8 for it. I'm sorry if I ran out of sympathy after 2015. But you want to know who did make an obscene amount? 10 convicted IUAW members. Go play math games with them. I couldn’t get past the first sentence. You criticized me for bad grammar but started your rant with a lower case “y.” However, keep in mind $14.65....that’s less than minimum wage in some places in this country. Take the damn buyout and get out so we can show you what a “union” is about. Edited November 9, 2019 by Ontopya 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Decker Posted November 9, 2019 Share Posted November 9, 2019 (edited) Hmmm the Drama continues..... Lumps? Good or Bad? LIB freezes every time a lump kicks in. That is it, nothing else, no big drama unless you realize those obscene amounts that some compare us to the average outside world should truly be looked at as just a progression of our hourly rates. Obscene is in the eye`s of the beholders. Yes $27 an hour is the pot at the end of the rainbow for those outside of our bubble. Hell there are people in the outside world the graduate and don`t see $27 an hour. As for the decisions that need to be make, take the STEP, Retirement Incentive or stay are all life changing decisions. Over the years I`ve seen the drama increase during these decision making opportunities. Basically it all comes down to fear of the unknown. Or the should I or shouldn`t I.... Then the drama is disguised as the "I" need someone to tell me what to do drama. That drama in it`s self is also typical here at CAP, there`s a large number of members that need (why? is the million dollar question) someone to blame if the shit turns sour from their decisions... Dam it Decker no one said they would take all those taxes out my check or they gave my old lady my WHOLE check!!! People just vote what will fit your needs, think this shit out. $60K is about $42K after Ford gets done. $3K a month after taxes get done is about $2200 a month for 24 months... <--- no bridge benefit till you do retire and if you get to 62 in that 24 month of stay at home and get paid time "no" bridge ever, period. Then there`s the other ingredient, sign up, go ahead and get the paperwork done that puts in place your 26% cut from SS every month, for life. The number of retiree`s I listened to when the check showed up is high and is still growing higher.... I don`t get the "why didn`t you tell me" as much lately. 62.7% YES - 32.3% - NO ----- Keep it comin annnnd Deposit My Check CAP will be the only "RED" line on the tally sheet, CAP is a messssss Thanks FRAP Edited November 9, 2019 by Decker Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ontopya Posted November 9, 2019 Share Posted November 9, 2019 7 hours ago, Ididntdoit said: you start off with bad grammar and want to play math games with me? in 24 yrs I have never made an obscene amount, I've never worked inside nor outside of a bubble. my $27 in 2005 is $14.65 in 2019, now imagine you had these bonuses, COLA and holidays for your first 8-12 years and then have them taken away and not given a raise for 8 years. And then watch this guy today with 7 years cry because he's not getting that 3-4% for another year even though you waited 8 for it. I'm sorry if I ran out of sympathy after 2015. But you want to know who did make an obscene amount? 10 convicted IUAW members. Go play math games with them. Your math is also wrong $27/hour in 1999 is equal to $41.61 today. Remember that when you hear guys bitch about not getting a 4% lump sum bonus while you are. Honestly if you had any money management skills you shouldn’t need a $1000 put in your TESPHE because your TESPHE should already be loaded. That $1000 could’ve been used to give your brothers and sisters a 4% lump sum also. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ididntdoit Posted November 9, 2019 Share Posted November 9, 2019 4 hours ago, Ontopya said: Your math is also wrong $27/hour in 1999 is equal to $41.61 today. Remember that when you hear guys bitch about not getting a 4% lump sum bonus while you are. Honestly if you had any money management skills you shouldn’t need a $1000 put in your TESPHE because your TESPHE should already be loaded. That $1000 could’ve been used to give your brothers and sisters a 4% lump sum also. No my math is spot on, I live in Chicago. Cost of living here is screwed up, making 27$ hr here is like making 6$ in Arkansas. I understand where you're coming from with your Obama common core math, and I'm sorry that happened to you. I hope you find a mentor to lead you out of your misguided direction. Please don't vote without parental supervision. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fatso Posted November 9, 2019 Share Posted November 9, 2019 (edited) 4 hours ago, Ididntdoit said: No my math is spot on, I live in Chicago. Cost of living here is screwed up, making 27$ hr here is like making 6$ in Arkansas. I understand where you're coming from with your Obama common core math, and I'm sorry that happened to you. I hope you find a mentor to lead you out of your misguided direction. Please don't vote without parental supervision. Detroit Lions 27 Chicago Bears 23 I like that math! Wanna know how crappy your Ford pension is?Figure you get $53 a month for every year worked. 30 years times $53 a month = $1600 a month approx.= $19,200 a year.Let me emphasize that is after showing up for 30 years,reliably in a factory,manufacturing, environment.The retirees having not received am increase in their LIB ,have been paying for the last 3 contracts.Just give me my signing bonus,,,,,PLEASE and if you dont like the job,take $60,000 of "free money" and find another job or stay home.Unless you are trades of course and then,,,,,want some O.T.? Edited November 9, 2019 by Fatso 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bucko Posted November 10, 2019 Share Posted November 10, 2019 The pension may be crappy but at least it's there, let alone you could retire at 62. The age of retirement isn't going down for the in progression worker, only going up. Crappy guaranteed pension is better than having to work till you're 67 with the hope social security will still be there! I know there may be division between us but do you think life gets cheaper as the yrs go by? Does the gas and electric bill shrink? Food? Should the next generation expect lower pay? No..we really shouldn't be fighting each other on this anymore, we are one remember? Lol ok..but seriously we need to take the stance of getting everything we can out of this company while we can, the company makes sure they squeeze every bit of profit out of us that they can. I'm tired of this division 5, 10, 20, 30yrs etc... We all deserve more !!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bucko Posted November 10, 2019 Share Posted November 10, 2019 (edited) On 11/8/2019 at 5:00 PM, deflep1 said: Not sure about that, but the union realized the contract could be voted down because of that specific provision. In progression weren't getting a 4% lump sum bonus until they maxed out at Legacy pay, because they were still getting raises every year. Workers with a seniority date before the ratification date were getting penalized by waiting too long for their 3% raise to kick in along with their 52 week raise. This was caught at Flat Rock's meeting and our chairman Larry Stewart said the highlights and tentative agreement didn't match correctly on this provision and needed to be changed. Other locals also caught it and notified the national bargaining committee, who talked to Ford yesterday. What does "our" chairman Larry Stoolwart look like anyway? Never met the guy only see his pic on the occasional leaflet. Never see him in the plant..His kids drive cars everyday right? Anyway according to this agreement a month's difference in seniority could mean you get a lump bonus and the guy with a month less does not. Edited November 10, 2019 by Bucko Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fatso Posted November 10, 2019 Share Posted November 10, 2019 (edited) 6 hours ago, Bucko said: The pension may be crappy but at least it's there, let alone you could retire at 62. The age of retirement isn't going down for the in progression worker, only going up. Crappy guaranteed pension is better than having to work till you're 67 with the hope social security will still be there! I know there may be division between us but do you think life gets cheaper as the yrs go by? Does the gas and electric bill shrink? Food? Should the next generation expect lower pay? No..we really shouldn't be fighting each other on this anymore, we are one remember? Lol ok..but seriously we need to take the stance of getting everything we can out of this company while we can, the company makes sure they squeeze every bit of profit out of us that they can. I'm tired of this division 5, 10, 20, 30yrs etc... We all deserve more !!! "Crappy pension is better than no pension" that is the best we can do?Well obviously YES it is.The company won the pension ,issue battle, in previous contracts and yes,now we are divided on the subject based on seniority.I doubt if many younger workers are going to strike for an increase in pension benefits that they dont even get.I can see a day coming when the company will refuse to fund VEBA.That means work till your 65 and then go on Medicare.I dont see it changing so keep contributing to your individual retirement accounts.One day you will be glad you did.I give up,,,when do I get my signing bonus? Edited November 10, 2019 by Fatso Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bucko Posted November 10, 2019 Share Posted November 10, 2019 It really is a shame that there has been no lib increase for you guys, I totally agree. Personally I don't like the idea of the iuaw getting all this new money for new "joint programs" and the expansion of current ones. We all know the uaw apparatus can't be trusted with the money that currently funds these programs and more company money going to them just seems wrong. These programs look great on paper, but so does communism until you see it in action. Truth is, more programs = union officials family and friends get new no show appointments. This is money that would be better spent on the workforce, instead the union bargained it for themselves. Millions that could have went towards retirement funds or retirees, or maybe even a Christmas bonus. Opioid awareness? I say shit can the dopeheads and give the money to us! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ontopya Posted November 10, 2019 Share Posted November 10, 2019 20 hours ago, Ididntdoit said: No my math is spot on, I live in Chicago. Cost of living here is screwed up, making 27$ hr here is like making 6$ in Arkansas. I understand where you're coming from with your Obama common core math, and I'm sorry that happened to you. I hope you find a mentor to lead you out of your misguided direction. Please don't vote without parental supervision. Do us all a favor. Take the 60k and move to Arkansas. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ididntdoit Posted November 10, 2019 Share Posted November 10, 2019 21 minutes ago, Ontopya said: Do us all a favor. Take the 60k and move to Arkansas. so I got your YES vote then? gotta ratify for me to go. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fatso Posted November 11, 2019 Share Posted November 11, 2019 (edited) 13 hours ago, Bucko said: It really is a shame that there has been no lib increase for you guys, I totally agree. Personally I don't like the idea of the iuaw getting all this new money for new "joint programs" and the expansion of current ones. We all know the uaw apparatus can't be trusted with the money that currently funds these programs and more company money going to them just seems wrong. These programs look great on paper, but so does communism until you see it in action. Truth is, more programs = union officials family and friends get new no show appointments. This is money that would be better spent on the workforce, instead the union bargained it for themselves. Millions that could have went towards retirement funds or retirees, or maybe even a Christmas bonus. Opioid awareness? I say shit can the dopeheads and give the money to us! Right On.I see the company propaganda about the opioid crisis as being a disease?So,getting high and feeling no pain is not desirable or a mental weakness it is a "disease"?Hey I got that disease too.Only I dont like the consequences of facing reality when I come down.Just like homeless people are BUMS and criminals,opioid addicts are ultimately responsible for themselves.I grew up in the 70`s.You name the drug and I probably did it.Coddling a drug addict or a BUM is no solution.Compassion along with "tough love" is the answer.Face reality and own up to your own problems.Look at what you are doing.How does your behavior affect others?If I can do it,anyone can do it.NO FEAR Edited November 11, 2019 by Fatso Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grandmaster B Posted November 11, 2019 Share Posted November 11, 2019 2 hours ago, Fatso said: Right On.I see the company propaganda about the opioid crisis as being a disease?So,getting high and feeling no pain is not desirable or a mental weakness it is a "disease"?Hey I got that disease too.Only I dont like the consequences of facing reality when I come down.Just like homeless people are BUMS and criminals,opioid addicts are ultimately responsible for themselves.I grew up in the 70`s.You name the drug and I probably did it.Coddling a drug addict or a BUM is no solution.Compassion along with "tough love" is the answer.Face reality and own up to your own problems.Look at what you are doing.How does your behavior affect others?If I can do it,anyone can do it.NO FEAR Fatso, Bucko, the same person? Sterling has lost 3 kids in the last 2 years to the opioid epidemic so go FUCK yourself you two MORONS! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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