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My 2020 Escape SE First Impression


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12 hours ago, rperez817 said:

 

 The "lipstick on a pig" approach has the potential to make those models a little more appealing to both professional reviewers and to consumers who don't already own Fords.

 

Short term gains, long term losses.

 

Ford has tried that approach before.  The result was the DPS6, faulty door handles, the 2013 Escape having 15 recalls, and most recently, the major Explorer and Aviator issues.

 

The lipstick on a pig approach will only serve to reduce the number of people buying Fords.  The goal is to get people to buy multiple vehicles.  Not one vehicle that will leave a bad taste in their mouth and force them to look elsewhere.  

 

1 hour ago, probowler said:

Toyota may be reliable, but they are not attractive nor high performers. 

 

If we're not concerned with creating some crazy Edge RS GT SUPER ECO MEGA BOOST, 

 

Then surely they could at least build something reliable and sexy looking? 

 

While I respect Toyotas approach and their success, i dont think Ford could successfully copy that. Better to try something different to separate and elevate FMC. Which I why I want them to focus on appearance +reliability 

 

I think Toyota and Honda should be emulated with things that people cannot see.  Things behind the body panels, behind the dash and trim panels.  Ford can do anything they want with styling.  You can use any font or colors for the dash and infotainment, you can have any sort of great styling, all that is just eye candy.  But you have to get the foundation right.  Any manufacturer is capable of a good looking design and a high quality vehicle (Telluride for example)

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3 hours ago, sho94_2000 said:

The lipstick on a pig approach will only serve to reduce the number of people buying Fords.  The goal is to get people to buy multiple vehicles.  Not one vehicle that will leave a bad taste in their mouth and force them to look elsewhere.  

 

Good points sho94_2000. It is true that Ford's market share in the U.S. has declined in the past decade. The worst case scenario is that long term losses you mentioned cause Ford to go out of business.

 

But I think the short term lipstick on a pig approach for 2020 Escape and Explorer may work effectively for these reasons.

 

1.) 2020 Escape and 2020 Explorer (except maybe the highest trims) have neither good looking design nor high quality. The eye candy from a simple, quick, and inexpensive design refresh may just be enough to get a few people who are on the fence about getting a 2020 Escape or Explorer to jump to the other side and actually buy one. Or maybe a 2021 model, if the  design refresh doesn't come until the new model year.

2.) Ford's owner loyalty rate is still relatively high. Though the number is probably declining, there are still many people who will buy a Ford product or service simply because it's a Ford (I am one of them).

3.) The automotive industry is currently undergoing a revolution. All electric, all autonomous, plus mobility services will define the industry's future. By the middle of the new decade, Ford can start a completely new chapter with more offerings in these areas.

4.) Jim Hackett's "design thinking" isn't fully in place at Ford right now. It will be several more years before it spreads throughout all functions at the company. By then, vehicles like Escape and Explorer may be redesigned with better design and quality.

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43 minutes ago, rperez817 said:

But I think the short term lipstick on a pig approach for 2020 Escape and Explorer may work effectively for these reasons.

 

Lipstick on a pig does not describe Escape or Explorer at all.

 

44 minutes ago, rperez817 said:

1.) 2020 Escape and 2020 Explorer (except maybe the highest trims) have neither good looking design nor high quality.

 

That's your opinion and that's fine but it's not shared by everyone else as evidenced by reasonably good sales even with higher prices and low rebates.

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1 hour ago, rperez817 said:

1.) 2020 Escape and 2020 Explorer (except maybe the highest trims) have neither good looking design nor high quality. The eye candy from a simple, quick, and inexpensive design refresh may just be enough to get a few people who are on the fence about getting a 2020 Escape or Explorer to jump to the other side and actually buy one.

 

Actually I don't think you can use those words to describe both the Explorer and Escape.

 

The Explorer, while boring and quite similar to the last generation, is actually a good looking SUV.  It's got a more broad shoulder look and the switch to a proper drive layout has very much helped the side profile.  The rear is the weak point but nobody is choosing something else because of a liftgate.

 

The Escape, to me, just looks like an awful styling mess.  And the couple that with the poor interior quality and it will need more than lipstick to help it out.  The Explorer, while also a mess in terms of quality seems to be doing a lot better.  Hopefully having to destroy vehicles that cannot be fixed is now behind us but the little nagging issues like a leaking trans cooler may get the better of Ford.

 

I don't see what "lipstick" Ford could add to the Explorer to help it.  I don't think it really needs anything (aside from a V8 ?). 

 

Ford got the styling and eye candy right with the Explorer and Aviator.  But the stuff they used was low quality.

 

So far, The Escape seems to be doing much better in terms of quality (only one recall for the new Escape which is shocking when looking at the last two "all new" Escapes) but lacks in eye candy where it counts most (interior materials, gauge cluster, styling).

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Just because some of you don't like Escape styling doesn't mean it's a failure.  It should be appealing to both former Focus buyers as well as Escape and buyers of other brands especially Rav4 and CRV (which has been equally bland).   And we have baby bronco coming as an alternative.   Interior quality is an issue but is it really going to keep people from buying it if they like the styling and price?  It's not terrible - just not best in class.

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22 minutes ago, akirby said:

 .........Interior quality is an issue but is it really going to keep people from buying it if they like the styling and price?  It's not terrible - just not best in class.

 

Yesterday being New Years, we stopped by our local Ford dealer to look at some of the vehicles they had in stock (and without being harassed by sales people).  The doors to the Escapes were locked, so we could only look through the side glass of a few SEL and Titanium models, but I honesty don't see what the commotion is about the interior.  Looks modern and contemporary to me.  I still need to sit in one and go for a test drive, but we both came away with a favorable impression.  

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I like the Explorer the more I see it, the design is all about proportions and the design does a pretty good job accentuating them with a wider and lower stance in the rear, longer and aggressive profile, and a wide and flat hood.  It's definitely a car that looks better in person.  I'm still not a fan of the fascia and the unibrow headlights.

 

I saw a ton of Escapes on the road over the Holiday and the SE is especially bland. I think I've really narrowed it down to two things.  The sheetmetal has this outdated featureless design combined with a fascia that lacks presence.  I personally don't think any utility should have a grille that sits below the headlights, only Porsche gets away with that.  Once you put it on a cheaper utility it looks too bland and weak, especially when this car doesn't have much design confidence elsewhere (like a Porsche).  

 

I don't really like the alternative Escape/Kuga fascias from Europe or China either, so for me I would really like to see a complete rework of that front-end with very different headlights.

 

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1 minute ago, mackinaw said:

 

Yesterday being New Years, we stopped by our local Ford dealer to look at some of the vehicles they had in stock (and without being harassed by sales people).  The doors to the Escapes were locked, so we could only look through the side glass of a few SEL and Titanium models, but I honesty don't see what the commotion is about the interior.  Looks modern and contemporary to me.  I still need to sit in one and go for a test drive, but we both came away with a favorable impression.  

 

I think it's mainly just reviewers who make a living nit picking differences and negatards who rejoice in pointing out anything that's the least bit negative.

 

As bad as the Explorer launch and early problems are, sales are doing ok and within 6 months nobody will remember any of it.  It's a minor blip.   It shouldn't happen but it's not the huge deal some make it out to be (provided the problems don't continue).

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5 minutes ago, mackinaw said:

 

Yesterday being New Years, we stopped by our local Ford dealer to look at some of the vehicles they had in stock (and without being harassed by sales people).  The doors to the Escapes were locked, so we could only look through the side glass of a few SEL and Titanium models, but I honesty don't see what the commotion is about the interior.  Looks modern and contemporary to me.  I still need to sit in one and go for a test drive, but we both came away with a favorable impression.  

 

 

Well the challenge is that key competitors in that segment are noticeably more upscale and a few have more distinctive styling (CrossTrex comes to mind).  The interior to me in many new Ford's is really basic, functional, boring and I hate their center display between the speedo/rpm gauge. Just layout and fonts look/feel cheap. The funny thing, is everything  I ding Ford for I feel completely opposite with regards to Lincoln. Almost feels like Ford is losing out at the conference table when sitting next to the Lincoln folks. 

 

 I would tell you to stop by a Kia or Subaru dealer but if you are living in Mackinaw then the closest dealer for those might be in Gaylord? 

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5 minutes ago, kyle said:

Well the challenge is that key competitors in that segment are noticeably more upscale

 

In all trims or just the lower ones?

 

The question is whether that has an impact on sales or not - and we won't really know that until the 2019s are gone and 2020 inventory is stable and they've adjusted rebates accordingly - probably around June or July.

 

My personal opinion is exterior styling, price and features make a much bigger impact on the buying decision than minor differences in interior quality.

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10 minutes ago, kyle said:

 I would tell you to stop by a Kia or Subaru dealer but if you are living in Mackinaw then the closest dealer for those might be in Gaylord? 

 

We live near Johannesburg. 

 

Two years ago, we drove around Lake Superior in a new Subaru Outback.  I was not impressed by the interior or driving dynamics.  As for Kia, No.

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7 minutes ago, akirby said:

 

In all trims or just the lower ones?

 

The question is whether that has an impact on sales or not - and we won't really know that until the 2019s are gone and 2020 inventory is stable and they've adjusted rebates accordingly - probably around June or July.

 

My personal opinion is exterior styling, price and features make a much bigger impact on the buying decision than minor differences in interior quality.

 

Not sure what you are asking me?  Sales may not suffer, but they may not come as easy as they have in the past and that will be reflected in product mix/rebates/fleet sales. 

 

And you are mostly correct, exterior styling gets someone in the door minor cheapness in a vehicle usually is not a deal breaker, but everyone today has a much nicer interior than what was acceptable 2-3 years ago. Well, maybe not Honda, but i'm sure they will up their game as some of their vehicles are updated. 

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