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'19 Year End Sale Totals


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4 minutes ago, akirby said:

I understand the desire for higher ATPs and lower incentives with lower volume, but what I don’t understand is why they cheap out on the interior.  It’s counter intuitive.  Maybe they’re hedging their bets in case they have to lower prices later or maybe they’re just hoping buyers won’t care.  

 

Maybe the Ford designers are under a mandate to keep enough product differentiation from their corporate cousins, so the L-guys don't get all butt-hurt?

 

HRG

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5 minutes ago, HotRunrGuy said:

 

Maybe the Ford designers are under a mandate to keep enough product differentiation from their corporate cousins, so the L-guys don't get all butt-hurt?

 

HRG

I did hear that the 2020 Escape was originally a bit tougher and beefier from the lead designer but he was told to “tone it down” and make it more car like.

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11 minutes ago, akirby said:

I understand the desire for higher ATPs and lower incentives with lower volume, but what I don’t understand is why they cheap out on the interior.  It’s counter intuitive.  Maybe they’re hedging their bets in case they have to lower prices later or maybe they’re just hoping buyers won’t care.  

 

Maybe they are trying to find that line-its not like the Chinese Escape doesn't have a nicer interior if needed. I wonder how much they where losing their shirts with the last gen model. The materials overall where decent-at least in my wife's 2017. 

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11 minutes ago, HotRunrGuy said:

 

Maybe the Ford designers are under a mandate to keep enough product differentiation from their corporate cousins, so the L-guys don't get all butt-hurt?


They don’t have to go that far to have differentiation.  The Lincoln interiors are top notch.

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6 minutes ago, ExplorerDude said:

I did hear that the 2020 Escape was originally a bit tougher and beefier from the lead designer but he was told to “tone it down” and make it more car like.


I think they’re targeting the Focus buyers which makes sense to a degree but Focus was also a lot cheaper.

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27 minutes ago, akirby said:

I understand the desire for higher ATPs and lower incentives with lower volume, but what I don’t understand is why they cheap out on the interior.  It’s counter intuitive.  Maybe they’re hedging their bets in case they have to lower prices later or maybe they’re just hoping buyers won’t care.  

 

They need to relearn one lesson taught by the young Lee Iacocca, who understood that money had to be spent where customers could see and feel the results.

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10 minutes ago, akirby said:


I think they’re targeting the Focus buyers which makes sense to a degree but Focus was also a lot cheaper.

 

The cheapest 2020 Escape I've seen at a dealer is about $29,000. One can buy a decent Honda Civic or Toyota Corolla for a lot less than that.

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6 minutes ago, grbeck said:

 

The cheapest 2020 Escape I've seen at a dealer is about $29,000. One can buy a decent Honda Civic or Toyota Corolla for a lot less than that.

 

But also a completely different segment. The Ecosport is the replacement for the Focus/Fiesta when it comes to pricing. For better or worse. 

 

Both the sales of the Civic and Corolla where flat last year. 

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39 minutes ago, akirby said:

I understand the desire for higher ATPs and lower incentives with lower volume, but what I don’t understand is why they cheap out on the interior.  It’s counter intuitive.  Maybe they’re hedging their bets in case they have to lower prices later or maybe they’re just hoping buyers won’t care.  

 

This is my thinking exactly.  You can't cheap out on the interior and expect people to pay more.

 

1 minute ago, silvrsvt said:

 

But also a completely different segment. The Ecosport is the replacement for the Focus/Fiesta when it comes to pricing. For better or worse. 

 

Both the sales of the Civic and Corolla where flat last year. 

 

I think the Puma would do well here.  Sounds like we'll get something else, though.

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9 minutes ago, silvrsvt said:

 

But also a completely different segment. The Ecosport is the replacement for the Focus/Fiesta when it comes to pricing. For better or worse. 

 

Both the sales of the Civic and Corolla where flat last year. 

 

I was responding to the claim that the new Escape is "targeting" Focus owners, or those who would have been interested in a Focus. Not likely to achieve that goal at those prices.

 

And in this market, a passenger car holding steady in sales is somewhat of an achievement.

Edited by grbeck
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34 minutes ago, grbeck said:

 

The cheapest 2020 Escape I've seen at a dealer is about $29,000. One can buy a decent Honda Civic or Toyota Corolla for a lot less than that.

 

I think with a $2K rebate they'll start around $22K.   But I was talking more about styling and size.  It will obviously be more expensive than a Focus.

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2 minutes ago, akirby said:

 

I think with a $2K rebate they'll start around $22K.   But I was talking more about styling and size.  It will obviously be more expensive than a Focus.

 

FWIW, there are published prices out there with much higher discounts than $2k:  https://www.koons.com/new/Ford/2020-Ford-Escape-for-sale-baltimore-washington-dc-d78a1b8b0a0e0adf2f14270a79df7a03.htm

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1 hour ago, silvrsvt said:

 

Maybe they are trying to find that line-its not like the Chinese Escape doesn't have a nicer interior if needed. I wonder how much they where losing their shirts with the last gen model. The materials overall where decent-at least in my wife's 2017. 

 

Compact CUV is the most important segment in the market. If Ford was really losing money on Escape, they probably shouldn't be a car company.

 

Maybe they wouldn't need to de-content and discount and squeeze the margin if their product was fresh like Honda and Toyota. It's really unfathomable that Ford left Escape on the market virtually unchanged for 7, almost 8 years. 

 

But I think I'm preaching to the choir  ?

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22 minutes ago, akirby said:

 

I think with a $2K rebate they'll start around $22K.   But I was talking more about styling and size.  It will obviously be more expensive than a Focus.


The cheapest escape (S model) should probably be around $20k. It starts at about $25k now. The titanium should start at 29k. It’s currently at 33,550. Rav4 and crv both start out at around 25k for their cheapest models too but you seem to get more for your money with those. The escape S doesn’t even come standard with a touchscreen.

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19 minutes ago, Harley Lover said:

 

FWIW, there are published prices out there with much higher discounts than $2k:  https://www.koons.com/new/Ford/2020-Ford-Escape-for-sale-baltimore-washington-dc-d78a1b8b0a0e0adf2f14270a79df7a03.htm

 

At the bottom of the page:

WOW prices include all applicable rebates and incentives. Additional rebates and incentives, such as Military or College Graduate programs, may apply to those who qualify. WOW pricing may not be compatible with special factory financing. WOW prices are valid based on manufacturer incentive program time periods, which vary by make. See dealer for details.

 

So basically they are taking all rebates and using them to deduct it from the pricing...so they are basically lying to you.

 

From the Ford page, using the ZIP from Sterling Ford

https://www.ford.com/suvs-crossovers/escape/pricing-and-incentives/?gnav=vhpnav

 

escape.thumb.PNG.2b69f0eddfd1759342b0db6ae3841018.PNG

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1 hour ago, silvrsvt said:

 

But also a completely different segment. The Ecosport is the replacement for the Focus/Fiesta when it comes to pricing. For better or worse. 

 

Both the sales of the Civic and Corolla where flat last year. 

Agree with this too...

 

Escape is in the Fusion replacement market, not Focus replacement. Just like CR-V is priced in the Accord range and much more than Civic.

 

The problem of course is Ford didn't have a competent Focus replacement for those owners to go somewhere like Honda HR-V.  Ecosport is too small and a little too rugged (that's charitable way of saying cheap) as a Focus replacement. And more importantly, entry level buyers are not considering Ford if it doesn't have something comparable to Toyota CH-R or Honda HR-V or Hyundai Kona.

 

This really highlighted the problem with product development under Mark Fields... they didn't nail where the market was moving to. Things like bring out C-Max instead of continuing Escape hybrid. Or not working on a proper Fusion CUV (the European B-segment CUV, not the midsize sedan) replacement when the segment was just about to bust wide open. 

Edited by bzcat
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1 minute ago, silvrsvt said:

 

At the bottom of the page:

WOW prices include all applicable rebates and incentives. Additional rebates and incentives, such as Military or College Graduate programs, may apply to those who qualify. WOW pricing may not be compatible with special factory financing. WOW prices are valid based on manufacturer incentive program time periods, which vary by make. See dealer for details.

 

So basically they are taking all rebates and using them to deduct it from the pricing...so they are basically lying to you.


Thats not how I read that.  They’re saying that includes all normal rebates and incentives and discounts but you may ALSO qualify for military or college grad rebates.  Hard to tell for sure though without seeing the detailed price.

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6 minutes ago, akirby said:


Thats not how I read that.  They’re saying that includes all normal rebates and incentives and discounts but you may ALSO qualify for military or college grad rebates.  Hard to tell for sure though without seeing the detailed price.

 

i went to the Ford site and they are only offering $500 cash back with financing at 84 months. There is a big blackhole of at least $2500-3K that they aren't telling you about, if they give you $1000 from the dealer and $500 from Ford.

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3 minutes ago, silvrsvt said:

 

i went to the Ford site and they are only offering $500 cash back with financing at 84 months. There is a big blackhole of at least $2500-3K that they aren't telling you about, if they give you $1000 from the dealer and $500 from Ford.

 

It's $1500 on SE and higher models plus there may be an additional $1K trade in assistance plus regional incentives.

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36 minutes ago, silvrsvt said:

 

i went to the Ford site and they are only offering $500 cash back with financing at 84 months. There is a big blackhole of at least $2500-3K that they aren't telling you about, if they give you $1000 from the dealer and $500 from Ford.

 

Agreed. Using zip code 20164, that Escape #24924 A/Z Plans out at $27, 357, including destination & $1000 in incentives.

 

 

AZ 24924-2.JPG

AZ 24924.JPG

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