dusty6185 Posted January 8, 2020 Share Posted January 8, 2020 I need to pick me up a ranger! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YT90SC Posted January 8, 2020 Share Posted January 8, 2020 1 hour ago, twintornados said: Go back as see my correction to my comment...and, I would love to see the list. Thanks. The list is so long because of Ford's insistence on the new "OTUP" (One Time Use Parts) policy. The majority of the parts they call OTUP are NOT one time use and if it were customer pay, I would certainly not make the customer bear the costs. They put random nuts or bolts in the OTUP hoping to have a tech miss it and then deny the claim. The OTUP call outs vary, year to year and across lines (even with the EXACT same components) and are thrown out entirely by TSB repairs. To top it all off, they like to do things like "discard LOWER sway bar end link nuts" which happens to have a different part number than the upper. The upper is easier and thus less time consuming to get to for about 99% of repairs. But again, a reason to deny the claim. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted January 8, 2020 Share Posted January 8, 2020 57 minutes ago, 92merc said: I should add, with AWD and Toyota, it's a 2.5 only. And Honda is a 1.5 turbo only. Only in Chevy and Ford do you get a choice. And with the Chevy 2.0 turbo, it's 24 combined, 22 city, 28 highway. Ford is 26/23/31. So considerably better than Chevy. And for me, it's 2.0 EB or go home. Ford has a history of lying/overstating fuel economy.... 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sho94_2000 Posted January 8, 2020 Share Posted January 8, 2020 1 hour ago, YT90SC said: The list is so long because of Ford's insistence on the new "OTUP" (One Time Use Parts) policy. The majority of the parts they call OTUP are NOT one time use and if it were customer pay, I would certainly not make the customer bear the costs. They put random nuts or bolts in the OTUP hoping to have a tech miss it and then deny the claim. The OTUP call outs vary, year to year and across lines (even with the EXACT same components) and are thrown out entirely by TSB repairs. To top it all off, they like to do things like "discard LOWER sway bar end link nuts" which happens to have a different part number than the upper. The upper is easier and thus less time consuming to get to for about 99% of repairs. But again, a reason to deny the claim. Wow, that's shady. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snooter Posted January 8, 2020 Share Posted January 8, 2020 (edited) 1 hour ago, jpd80 said: Ford has a history of lying/overstating fuel economy.... ....there are complaints from f150 Owners of the 2.7/3.5 EB returning no where near mpg spec...i had great mpg on my former fiesta though (45mpg if tailwing)... Edited January 8, 2020 by snooter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted January 9, 2020 Share Posted January 9, 2020 7 minutes ago, snooter said: ....there are complaints from f150 Owners of the 2.7/3.5 EB returning no where near mpg spec...i had great mpg on my former fiesta though (45mpg if tailwing)... It's hit and miss, some get great fuel economy while others struggle and I think that's because until recently, Ford was using an incorrect roll down coefficient to factor road load into dyno lab tests. Not a hanging offense but it sure wrecked Ford's hybrid sales after they were revised downwards. I am concerned that Ford continues to downsize EB engines, the more this is done in heavier vehicles, the more chance there is for the engines to boost on part throttle loads like undulating roads, especially on cruise control...some have mentioned recently that active cruise control can be a problem too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trader 10 Posted January 9, 2020 Share Posted January 9, 2020 4 hours ago, akirby said: NVH is a minor issue IMO. The bigger issue is that the Rav4 has a larger (2.5L NA) engine with better NVH but also MORE power and BETTER fuel economy. What's the point of using a smaller 3 cylinder turbo if it can't beat a 2.5L NA on power or fuel economy? Ford has the solution in the 2.5 engine that is the base motor in the current Fusion and LG Escape. It’s still a great engine even though it has not been updated since it was introduced in the 2010 Fusion and Escape. It seems crazy that Ford doesn’t upgrade it as it should be capable of 200 hp and significantly improved mileage. It would be a great base motor for the Escape, Baby Bronco, and NG Fusion (whatever that turns out to be). 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T-dubz Posted January 9, 2020 Share Posted January 9, 2020 My wife is getting 17.9 mpg in her ‘20 explorer with the 2.3L. It’s rated at 21 city, 28 highway, 24 combined. We’ve only ever owned ford’s and we never get close to the mpg. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YT90SC Posted January 9, 2020 Share Posted January 9, 2020 51 minutes ago, snooter said: ....there are complaints from f150 Owners of the 2.7/3.5 EB returning no where near mpg spec...i had great mpg on my former fiesta though (45mpg if tailwing)... There are SO many factors for real world fuel numbers vs EPA estimates. Most people will only put the cheapest fuel in that they can get. That means that the octane level is usually low and it has Ethanol in it. Remember most estimates are done with good gas of appropriate octane. Ecoboost and Hybrids are affected the worst by fuel choices. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snooter Posted January 9, 2020 Share Posted January 9, 2020 Well jp that brings up the argument wether the f150 is really a "truck" at this point or simply a "truck in name only"....there is no question the f150 is geared towards city/suburban market....any capability and you have to look at the f250....when the epa got a foot in the door on the 1/2 tons all manufacturers had no choice but to start dumping larger base engines and adding turbos to boost power when you are hauling the 3 kids, the wife, the dog (gear) while pulling a small trailer, boat, to the camping lake...CAFE is root cause of the issue...there is now an ever heavier push on ford to continue dumping smaller engines in models across the lineup (hence I3 in escape) since they have completly left small car lineup....the trend on which u speak (heavier vehicles) shows no sign if letting up going forward Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fuzzymoomoo Posted January 9, 2020 Share Posted January 9, 2020 9 minutes ago, Trader 10 said: Ford has the solution in the 2.5 engine that is the base motor in the current Fusion and LG Escape. It’s still a great engine even though it has not been updated since it was introduced in the 2010 Fusion and Escape. It seems crazy that Ford doesn’t upgrade it as it should be capable of 200 hp and significantly improved mileage. It would be a great base motor for the Escape, Baby Bronco, and NG Fusion (whatever that turns out to be). I thought that engine was on its way out the door. It would make a nice base engine for another Larger C-sized vehicle though. It's a shame. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trader 10 Posted January 9, 2020 Share Posted January 9, 2020 11 minutes ago, fuzzymoomoo said: I thought that engine was on its way out the door. It would make a nice base engine for another Larger C-sized vehicle though. It's a shame. It looks like it will die when the 2020 Fusion ends production. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MY93SHO Posted January 9, 2020 Share Posted January 9, 2020 1 hour ago, YT90SC said: There are SO many factors for real world fuel numbers vs EPA estimates. Most people will only put the cheapest fuel in that they can get. That means that the octane level is usually low and it has Ethanol in it. Remember most estimates are done with good gas of appropriate octane. Ecoboost and Hybrids are affected the worst by fuel choices. driving style weather fuel, I get 2 mpg less on 10% ethanol than with premium. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted January 9, 2020 Share Posted January 9, 2020 (edited) 1 hour ago, Trader 10 said: It looks like it will die when the 2020 Fusion ends production. Being switched to 2.5 Hybrid package, of course that particular engine is different but you know what I mean What about the 2.3 DI EB,, perhaps as a NA with 8AT? Edited January 9, 2020 by jpd80 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trader 10 Posted January 9, 2020 Share Posted January 9, 2020 47 minutes ago, jpd80 said: Being switched to 2.5 Hybrid package, of course that particular engine is different but you know what I mean What about the 2.3 DI EB,, perhaps as a NA with 8AT? That would seem to make a lot of sense. Should be more powerful than the 1.5 I3 with much better NVH. No reason that fuel economy couldn’t be at least as good as the Toyota 2.5 I-4. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoonerLS Posted January 9, 2020 Share Posted January 9, 2020 1 hour ago, MY93SHO said: driving style My dad used to get 2-3mpg better than my mom did in their Freestyle, all due to their different driving styles. According to the EPA, my truck's average fuel economy is 17MPG. At almost 125K miles, running a 5Star tune, and with a toolbox full of tools and junk and stuff in the bed, I'm averaging closer to 18MPG. Maybe I should complain about those inaccurate EPA numbers? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted January 9, 2020 Share Posted January 9, 2020 4 hours ago, snooter said: ....there are complaints from f150 Owners of the 2.7/3.5 EB returning no where near mpg spec. My 3.5LEB F150 regularly exceeds the EPA ratings. My 22 mile commute to work on back roads at 45-50 mph yields 26 mpg. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted January 9, 2020 Share Posted January 9, 2020 3 hours ago, T-dubz said: My wife is getting 17.9 mpg in her ‘20 explorer with the 2.3L. It’s rated at 21 city, 28 highway, 24 combined. We’ve only ever owned ford’s and we never get close to the mpg. Short trips? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fuzzymoomoo Posted January 9, 2020 Share Posted January 9, 2020 I find it easier to get advertised MPG out of the Ford EcoBoost engines than I do the NA engines, though I'm much closer with the Flex than I am the Fusion for whatever reason. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T-dubz Posted January 9, 2020 Share Posted January 9, 2020 8 hours ago, akirby said: Short trips? Mainly highway. On a 30 min commute, probably 20 min is highway. The speed limits here are 80-85 mph on the highway so that might have something to do with it. I’m guessing the boost is always on at that speed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted January 9, 2020 Share Posted January 9, 2020 9 hours ago, fuzzymoomoo said: I find it easier to get advertised MPG out of the Ford EcoBoost engines than I do the NA engines, though I'm much closer with the Flex than I am the Fusion for whatever reason. The current EBs are much better than the first or second gen. Those had cooling issues which forced them to run rich. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted January 9, 2020 Share Posted January 9, 2020 44 minutes ago, T-dubz said: The speed limits here are 80-85 mph on the highway so that might have something to do with it. I’m guessing the boost is always on at that speed. Bingo. Above 60 mph the wind resistance goes up exponentially with speed. Set cruise to 65, hit the reset and watch the mpg for a few miles. Then do the same at 85. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HotRunrGuy Posted January 9, 2020 Share Posted January 9, 2020 14 minutes ago, akirby said: The current EBs are much better than the first or second gen. Those had cooling issues which forced them to run rich. Akirby, what do you define as "current"? HRG Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted January 9, 2020 Share Posted January 9, 2020 9 minutes ago, HotRunrGuy said: Akirby, what do you define as "current"? HRG The ones currently available. E.g. the 3rd gen 3.5LEB was introduced for the F150 2018 model year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HotRunrGuy Posted January 9, 2020 Share Posted January 9, 2020 6 minutes ago, akirby said: The ones currently available. E.g. the 3rd gen 3.5LEB was introduced for the F150 2018 model year. Thank you for the clarification. We can re-visit this conversation in 2022, after the "much better" 2020's have some time & mileage on them. HRG 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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