Honda Pilot vs. Ford Explorer: All-New 3-Row SUV Takes on a Segment Stalwart

[rperez817]

Comparison test from Motor Trend, published Feb. 25, 2020. https://www.motortrend.com/cars/honda/pilot/2020/2019-honda-pilot-vs-2020-ford-explorer-comparison/

 

"

To sum things up, Ford had plenty of time to overtake the top-quality Pilot by building a better Explorer. But as is, it feels only half-finished, with questionable build quality and quality control issues hurting its chances against the SUV stalwart that is the Pilot. The Explorer will need some serious improvements to match the old Honda. But let's not forget, this is the company that was the first to abandon the car in the North American market to focus on SUVs. Even so, the new Explorer is a swing and a miss from Ford, while the Pilot, remains a stand-up double."

[snooter]

Intetior again crushing ford...the review would have been worse had MT compared to mazda, hyunday or kia....the pilot is just boring which really is saying something as ford seems hell bent on wanting to be the winner with what its current design architexture being "most boring with crappiest interior is our goal" philosophy..who ever is sourcing fords leather interior needs fired but they have probably been told to purchase the subpar leather interior skins...ford leather skins are known to be problematic for multiple years now...

 

 

[probowler]

Yikes... I really liked the last gen pilot, very sharp looking. The new one looks like a lifted minivan owned by the your friendly local crack dealer.

[.I.]

The Explorer nightmare continues....   This car needs a redone....ASAP. The interior is a mess in its design and materials/quality, and must be completly redone.The exterior needs a new grille, more in line with others Ford models (new Escape/Kuga, european Puma...). And the Chicago plant, where this car is assembled, needs a big shake out... with new managers and an strict quality protocol.

The completly new and modern RWD Explorer cant take on the old Honda Pilot... this is a big failure, a great mistake from Ford.

Edited February 26, 2020 by falconlover 1

[jpd80]

Honda Pilot sales actually dropped in January to 7,765 which is down from 8,556 in January 2019.

It might be a great effort but apparently, it takes more than that to get sales in through the door.....

[jcartwright99]

A few questions. Is build quality still an issue right now with the Explorer? Is it poorly built and engineered? If not, the debacle that was called a launch is still being well publicized and used for a cause for concern. Are consumers really getting bent out of shape about interior materials on the XLT or is this the press going overboard, wanting a Telluride interior? I want to understand if this is a real or perceived issue. 

 

Now, it's been 6 months. Heads have rolled. If they are still producing crap in Chicago, just fire everyone. It sounds harsh, sure. It just sounds like Chicago has larger systemic issues that Ford doesn't seem to be seeing at other plants. I would love to see a root cause analysis. I would imagine it would be filled with one bad choice compounded by another. 

 

 

[pictor]

2 hours ago, jpd80 said:

Honda Pilot sales actually dropped in January to 7,765 which is down from 8,556 in January 2019.

It might be a great effort but apparently, it takes more than that to get sales in through the door.....

Do we know how many explorers sales occurred in the same period?

[silvrsvt]

1 hour ago, jcartwright99 said:

A few questions. Is build quality still an issue right now with the Explorer? Is it poorly built and engineered? If not, the debacle that was called a launch is still being well publicized and used for a cause for concern. Are consumers really getting bent out of shape about interior materials on the XLT or is this the press going overboard, wanting a Telluride interior? I want to understand if this is a real or perceived issue. 

 

I think alot of it is just pilling on of rumors and things that happened months ago. 

 

Just look at the press as it stands today-its all about trying attract viewers to a website or whatever- scandalous/incendiary headlines get that. 

 

Plus MT is pissed that Ford isn't cutting them a check for advertising either. 

[HotRunrGuy]

30 minutes ago, pictor said:

Do we know how many explorers sales occurred in the same period?

 

That's a good question. I don't remember seeing @rmc523's breakdown chart for January.  Maybe we'll have to wait for the quarterly results?

 

HRG

[rperez817]

45 minutes ago, silvrsvt said:

Plus MT is pissed that Ford isn't cutting them a check for advertising either. 

 

No sir. Ford advertises in Motor Trend and affiliated publications.

 

What pisses off a lot of professional reviewers at Motor Trend and elsewhere, as well as regular people, is that Ford completely blew the opportunity to make the 2020 Explorer a quality product. Instead, what Ford gave us is an overpriced, half baked design assembled at a troubled plant. A product so bad that it lost a comparison test against a Honda that first came out 5 years ago, as well as against newer competitors like Kia Telluride and Hyundai Palisade.

Edited February 26, 2020 by rperez817

[PREMiERdrum]

2 hours ago, jcartwright99 said:

A few questions. Is build quality still an issue right now with the Explorer? Is it poorly built and engineered? If not, the debacle that was called a launch is still being well publicized and used for a cause for concern.

 

The production issues have been largely resolved for quite a while now, but the (forced) high-profile storyline about the model changeover extravaganza, barges on the river, Commando-style swap are still too rich for auto rags to ignore. 

 

From my own butt-in-seat time, interior materials range from slightly above average to very nice... depending on where you're touching. While the Telluride has an arguably nicer overall interior package, I'd wager many would find Explorer's cabin much nicer than the Pilot'sin a blind test. 

 

From what I've heard, they still plan to sell 200,000 Explorers this CY and don't think they'll have to dip below their planned margin to do it. 

 

I have heard a slight acceleration of the first planned MCE, which would address many of the remaining complaints about the front clip and a few interior touchpoints. Unconfirmed, but likely. 

[Trailhiker]

A great design can hide the quality of materials, but a poor design brings unwanted attention to them. Followed up by poor assembly (squeaky parts, wind noise) and now you have not only a visual issue, but an audible one as well.

[Trailhiker]

6 minutes ago, PREMiERdrum said:

 While the Telluride has an arguably nicer overall interior package, I'd wager many would find Explorer's cabin much nicer than the Pilot'sin a blind test. 

 

Blindfolded?

[jasonj80]

They have already done some running fixes on materials, and there will be some more for 2021; fit and finish is very much tighten up now with current production units. There is also a running change for IIHS improvements but I'm not sure exactly when that enters production.

Part of this is that Ford keeps giving loaded 202A XLT's in the press fleet rather than giving Limited for reviews. The smart thing to do is an across the board price cut of about $2500 for XLT and Limited models for 2021. 2wd Limited should be about 47K and 4wd at 49K; 4WD XLT 202A at 44.5K and 2WD at 42.5K. It is basically what they cost now with rebates but when you do the compare online at competitors lists they list base price and it makes the Explorer considerable more expensive.

Also for A/Z Plan Ford has a 0 Down $299 for 4WD XLT so the deals are starting to get out there on them. 

Edited February 26, 2020 by jasonj80

[grbeck]

4 hours ago, jpd80 said:

Honda Pilot sales actually dropped in January to 7,765 which is down from 8,556 in January 2019.

It might be a great effort but apparently, it takes more than that to get sales in through the door.....

 

The Passport is likely siphoning off sales from the Pilot.

The Pilot is a very good execution of a conventional vehicle for this segment. The Explorer, at this point, is a lackluster execution of an ambitious vehicle. The basics are there...Ford needs to get to work on the details.

Edited February 26, 2020 by grbeck

[akirby]

Someone on another forum just bought a XLT.  I asked him about interior quality and he said it was good.  He was very happy.

 

I think it's clear they put all their effort into Aviator and are now playing catch up with Explorer.   I expect sales are/will stay in the 15K range.

[Black Label]

I know I'm a newbie here. Maybe I won't be welcome any longer, but an observation....

 

I came here because I have owned a '90 Escort, '98 Mustang, '08 Expedition, and have a '20 Navigator arriving soon. Thought I would join a forum or two with like minded folks. I get that there may be things from time to time we would like to see from Ford or any other manufacturers. But, I notice a lot of long time posters seem to just complain about the quality, etc., of Ford. However, the same crap quality seems to still prevail. 

 

Why are some people still here complaining and lauding Honda et al? To be fair, there are also many positive people as well. 

 

I expect to get flamed. Just an observation. 

[probowler]

2 minutes ago, Black Label said:

I know I'm a newbie here. Maybe I won't be welcome any longer, but an observation....

 

I came here because I have owned a '90 Escort, '98 Mustang, '08 Expedition, and have a '20 Navigator arriving soon. Thought I would join a forum or two with like minded folks. I get that there may be things from time to time we would like to see from Ford or any other manufacturers. But, I notice a lot of long time posters seem to just complain about the quality, etc., of Ford. However, the same crap quality seems to still prevail. 

 

Why are some people still here complaining and lauding Honda et al? To be fair, there are also many positive people as well. 

 

I expect to get flamed. Just an observation. 

We all wonder the same thing... 

[sho94_2000]

4 hours ago, jcartwright99 said:

A few questions. Is build quality still an issue right now with the Explorer? Is it poorly built and engineered? If not, the debacle that was called a launch is still being well publicized and used for a cause for concern. Are consumers really getting bent out of shape about interior materials on the XLT or is this the press going overboard, wanting a Telluride interior? I want to understand if this is a real or perceived issue. 

 

Now, it's been 6 months. Heads have rolled. If they are still producing crap in Chicago, just fire everyone. It sounds harsh, sure. It just sounds like Chicago has larger systemic issues that Ford doesn't seem to be seeing at other plants. I would love to see a root cause analysis. I would imagine it would be filled with one bad choice compounded by another. 

 

 

I think the issues are very much still present.  Ford addressed the issues that required the vehicles to be fixed immediately after being built (issues dealers could not fix) but the issues dealers can fix Ford just turfed to them.  A sheriffs office in my area had nine of their new Explorer orders cancelled by Ford because they could not be fixed.  The Explorers were destroyed.  
 

As good as the Kia and Hyundai interiors are, this is more about how bad the Explorer is to everything else.  And I have a feeling Ford will do the same thing with the Explorer as they did the DPS6....be aware there is an issue but completely ignore it publicly.  Buy hey, profit margin right?
 

 

[jcartwright99]

16 minutes ago, Black Label said:

I know I'm a newbie here. Maybe I won't be welcome any longer, but an observation....

 

I came here because I have owned a '90 Escort, '98 Mustang, '08 Expedition, and have a '20 Navigator arriving soon. Thought I would join a forum or two with like minded folks. I get that there may be things from time to time we would like to see from Ford or any other manufacturers. But, I notice a lot of long time posters seem to just complain about the quality, etc., of Ford. However, the same crap quality seems to still prevail. 

 

Why are some people still here complaining and lauding Honda et al? To be fair, there are also many positive people as well. 

 

I expect to get flamed. Just an observation. 

 

First, welcome to the forums. This place can be a very good source of information on past, current and future Ford products.You might even get some well timed humor here.

 

Second, there are a certain few who I won't name (I can think 3 off the top of my head) who always always always post negativity. Not sure why but they do. I think you can ignore them so where you don't see their posts but I've never tried it.

 

Again, welcome and enjoy. No flame suit needed.

[Black Label]

2 minutes ago, jcartwright99 said:

 

First, welcome to the forums. This place can be a very good source of information on past, current and future Ford products.You might even get some well timed humor here.

 

Second, there are a certain few who I won't name (I can think 3 off the top of my head) who always always always post negativity. Not sure why but they do. I think you can ignore them so where you don't see their posts but I've never tried it.

 

Again, welcome and enjoy. No flame suit needed.

Thanks, glad to be here. For clarification, I would say I have seen mostly positive things and have learned some things, as you stated. 

 

I think from what I have seen here and on a Lincoln forum, there may just be trolls who love GM, and others who are trying to sway Ford people. I guess this maybe happens on other forums for GM and others. 

[jpd80]

1 hour ago, grbeck said:

 

The Passport is likely siphoning off sales from the Pilot.

The Pilot is a very good execution of a conventional vehicle for this segment. The Explorer, at this point, is a lackluster execution of an ambitious vehicle. The basics are there...Ford needs to get to work on the details.

And as we’ve already heard on another thread, there’s already a quick revision planned for the XLT interior inside two months, so ford is responding a lot quicker than some anticipated. In spite of quality issues, there’s still a lot of good will and support from buyers, so regardless of Pilot/ Passport success that may not directly impact on Explorer’s sales.

Edited February 26, 2020 by jpd80

[rmc523]

8 hours ago, falconlover 1 said:

The Explorer nightmare continues....   This car needs a redone....ASAP. The interior is a mess in its design and materials/quality, and must be completly redone.The exterior needs a new grille, more in line with others Ford models (new Escape/Kuga, european Puma...). And the Chicago plant, where this car is assembled, needs a big shake out... with new managers and an strict quality protocol.

The completly new and modern RWD Explorer cant take on the old Honda Pilot... this is a big failure, a great mistake from Ford.

 

It's really not as bad as these magazines have made it out to be.

 

4 hours ago, jcartwright99 said:

A few questions. Is build quality still an issue right now with the Explorer? Is it poorly built and engineered? If not, the debacle that was called a launch is still being well publicized and used for a cause for concern. Are consumers really getting bent out of shape about interior materials on the XLT or is this the press going overboard, wanting a Telluride interior? I want to understand if this is a real or perceived issue. 

 

Now, it's been 6 months. Heads have rolled. If they are still producing crap in Chicago, just fire everyone. It sounds harsh, sure. It just sounds like Chicago has larger systemic issues that Ford doesn't seem to be seeing at other plants. I would love to see a root cause analysis. I would imagine it would be filled with one bad choice compounded by another. 

 

 

 

I wonder if this is a leftover press car from early on?

 

2 hours ago, Trailhiker said:

Blindfolded?

 

No, he's saying essentially take the badge off and then see what the results would be.

[jasonj80]

33 minutes ago, sho94_2000 said:

I think the issues are very much still present.  Ford addressed the issues that required the vehicles to be fixed immediately after being built (issues dealers could not fix) but the issues dealers can fix Ford just turfed to them.  A sheriffs office in my area had nine of their new Explorer orders cancelled by Ford because they could not be fixed.  The Explorers were destroyed.  
 

2020 PI's just started entering service. Ford in the meantime had good deals on the pursuit F-150 to make sure they didn't lose sales.  

[jpd80]

There are still lingering issues but some of the commentary is critical of the interior regardless of quality issues,

Ford is not reporting monthly sales so it's difficult to pick up month by month changes, improvements or setbacks..

All we know is that Q4 2019 Explorer sales were down 9,000 sales compared Q4 2018 when incentives applied.

 

A lot of the initial criticism of the 2020 Explorer was to do with the Telluride having so much more in a lower priced

vehicle and from there on the press and internet experts just piled on when quality issues persisted, so easy to keep

doing that long after launch quality issues abate. We'll get to June and some  people will stil be l living back in Q3 2019

 

Edited February 26, 2020 by jpd80