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GM Details EV plan - Cadillac, GMC, Chevy, and Buick EV models on the way


rmc523

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1 hour ago, akirby said:

 

They said $100/kwh and they're making it in house via a joint venture with LG Chem in Lordstown.

 

If you're going to troll, at least get the facts right.

I have no idea what early in the platform's life means but it is just vaporware until the plant is built and according to the report from 12/2019 it could be 2023, however until then, they will be paying $200 a kWh for the battery if they can get them from LG. 

https://www.ft.com/content/59b03d00-5d6a-11ea-b0ab-339c2307bcd4

" CEO Mary Barra told attendees at the announcement that Ultium batteries will be able to breach the much-anticipated $100/kWh barrier "early in the platform's life," which would be a significant achievement. Some think that Tesla is also closing in on that magic number, although others in the industry are far less confident of seeing costs fall that much in the next few years."

"The joint venture is certainly a coup for GM in the effort to build affordable, mass-market EVs. The South Korean company said earlier on Thursday that it would invest $916 million in its US subsidiary by 2023 to set up the joint venture with GM, according to a Reuters report."

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8 hours ago, akirby said:

 

They're not in a good position yet.  And we don't know how well they will execute on all those plans.   They're too far out in the future.

 

 

GM is not Tesla. Name a product they announced in the last 5 years (or 10 years) that did not make production. Whether GM announces or Ford doesn't is immaterial. Ford does not have the depth or breadth of EV product plan in the near future that GM does. That is not debatable. Nor does Ford have any plan (even rumored) to develop and build its own battery tech.

 

Will all of these products and battery tech be successful for GM? No idea. But to characterize it as smoke and mirrors is disingenuous. This is where GM have invested their money; $20 billion is NOT smoke and mirrors.

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2 hours ago, mlhm5 said:

I have no idea what early in the platform's life means but it is just vaporware until the plant is built and according to the report from 12/2019 it could be 2023, however until then, they will be paying $200 a kWh for the battery if they can get them from LG. 

 

Read the news I quoted earlier in the thread. It's 2020, not 2019:

"The GMC Hummer EV, expected to go into production in fall 2021, will be the first vehicle to use the new battery technology, GM said."

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23 minutes ago, Harley Lover said:

 

GM is not Tesla. Name a product they announced in the last 5 years (or 10 years) that did not make production. Whether GM announces or Ford doesn't is immaterial. Ford does not have the depth or breadth of EV product plan in the near future that GM does. That is not debatable. Nor does Ford have any plan (even rumored) to develop and build its own battery tech.

 

Will all of these products and battery tech be successful for GM? No idea. But to characterize it as smoke and mirrors is disingenuous. This is where GM have invested their money; $20 billion is NOT smoke and mirrors.


It’s smoke and mirrors today because most of today’s announcement is just a plan most of which s 5 yrs out.  And I would say the same thing about Ford if they did it.

 

You don’t know what Ford has planned because they don’t reveal details 5 years out.  It may be more, may be less.  But given what we know about and their partnerships with Rivian and VW I doubt they’ll be behind.

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4 hours ago, mackinaw said:

Ford pushing PHEV's make more sense to me. 

 

PHEV only make sense for regulatory compliance (stricter fuel economy standards) in the short term. Beyond that, hybrids including PHEV are a dead end technology. More and more governments around the world are planning to ban the sale of new ICE vehicles within the next 15-20 years, including hybrids and PHEV.

 

One thing that GM is doing correctly with their electrification strategy is going all in with BEV, and not wasting any resources developing or manufacturing hybrid and PHEV.

Edited by rperez817
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59 minutes ago, rperez817 said:

 

PHEV only make sense for regulatory compliance (stricter fuel economy standards) in the short term. Beyond that, hybrids including PHEV are a dead end technology. More and more governments around the world are planning to ban the sale of new ICE vehicles within the next 15-20 years, including hybrids and PHEV.

 

One thing that GM is doing correctly with their electrification strategy is going all in with BEV, and not wasting any resources developing or manufacturing hybrid and PHEV.


I would agree if there was any chance the US bans ICE vehicles, but that is not going to happen.  And you are severely overestimating the number of buyers who want BEVs right now.  It will change over time but phevs are the perfect Interim solution.

 

What happens if phevs outsell BEVs two to one?  Whose strategy will be better?

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1 hour ago, rperez817 said:

One thing that GM is doing correctly with their electrification strategy is going all in with BEV, and not wasting any resources developing or manufacturing hybrid and PHEV.

 

GM is gambling that people will buy BEV's.  A big gamble.  Nobody knows how fast Americans will embrace BEV's.  You sure don't.  To me, a more measured approach to electrification, meaning hybrids and PHEV's mixed with BEV and pure ICE vehicles, is a better plan in the short term. 

 

There's absolutely no way in the world a BEV makes sense for me, where I live.  Not now.  Maybe in ten years when a better infrastructure is in place.  In the meantime, that PHEV Escape sure looks tempting.  

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13 hours ago, rperez817 said:

 

PHEV only make sense for regulatory compliance (stricter fuel economy standards) in the short term. Beyond that, hybrids including PHEV are a dead end technology. More and more governments around the world are planning to ban the sale of new ICE vehicles within the next 15-20 years, including hybrids and PHEV.

 

One thing that GM is doing correctly with their electrification strategy is going all in with BEV, and not wasting any resources developing or manufacturing hybrid and PHEV.

 

How does it make any sense to skip a "generation" and ramrod BEVs into the market that doesn't demand them? 

 

What your basically saying is GM stopping any ICE development within the next 2-3 years when the market won't most likely be ready to embrace for another 10-15 or so years? Given that people are holding on to cars longer then ever before, the amount of product being replace is going to shrink. 

 

Until someone can make a profit off selling a 30K BEV before any sort of incentives that can least go 300-400 miles, we have a long way to go. 

 

Ford has PHEV and Hybrid tech ready now and is still working on BEVs. At least they have a bridge to work with long term. 

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15 hours ago, Harley Lover said:

 

Read the news I quoted earlier in the thread. It's 2020, not 2019:

"The GMC Hummer EV, expected to go into production in fall 2021, will be the first vehicle to use the new battery technology, GM said."

expected is the keyword in that sentence.

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35 minutes ago, fordmantpw said:

 

LOL!! And Tesla's Cybertruck is changing the world TODAY!

GM crushed the EV1, discontinued the Volt, and lost $9K on every Bolt sold. Now they are going to spend $20 billion chasing Tesla using the same failed GM strategy. We build the frame, chassis, motors and assemble and buy everything else from 3rd party suppliers including software and chips and electronics. We will have an EV in every product line. Fail! Pick a segment and dominate it. Tesla gave you the roadmap.

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2 hours ago, blwnsmoke said:

Up to 400 miles on 200kWh battery. Basically 1/2 the range Tesla has now in 5 years.
$8 billion in profit so they will sink close to 100% of profits into EV’s, with sunk costs, stranded assets ICE at least to 2025 with no stumbles?

 It gets exhausting listening to legacy car companies talking about what they’re going to do a few years from now. Whatever it takes to get investors to stay onboard, IMO. It is as if they feel they’re being dragged into the future against their will.  What GM presented this week was nothing more than a promise that one day they will have more compliance products using 2012 specs to choose from, but nothing earth-shaking and exciting.

Edited by mlhm5
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1 hour ago, mlhm5 said:

Up to 400 miles on 200kWh battery. Basically 1/2 the range Tesla has now in 5 years.
$8 billion in profit so they will sink close to 100% of profits into EV’s, with sunk costs, stranded assets ICE at least to 2025 with no stumbles?

 It gets exhausting listening to legacy car companies talking about what they’re going to do a few years from now. Whatever it takes to get investors to stay onboard, IMO. It is as if they feel they’re being dragged into the future against their will.  What GM presented this week was nothing more than a promise that one day they will have more compliance products using 2012 specs to choose from, but nothing earth-shaking and exciting.

 

^^^^^^ is what gets exhausting.

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1 hour ago, blwnsmoke said:

 

^^^^^^ is what gets exhausting.

The Tesla fanboys can get exhausting, but more tiresome to me are those with Tesla Derangement Syndrome. A big chunk of the members here seem to be infected with TDS. 

Edited by AGR
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1 hour ago, AGR said:

The Tesla fanboys can get exhausting, but more tiresome to me are those with Tesla Derangement Syndrome. A big chunk of the members here seem to be infected with TDS. 

 

You mean not drinking the Koolaid?

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1 hour ago, akirby said:


If you call the truth tiresome, so be it.  

The truth is found in that wide gulf between the prevailing views held here and those of the Tesla fanboy forums.  Or how the GM presentation was almost universally praised by the automotive press, many of whom don't normally give GM such praise, but was trashed here.

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1 hour ago, MY93SHO said:

 

You mean not drinking the Koolaid?

 

Or drink the Hateraid? People who live in glass houses...  There's gallons and gallons of Ford Kool-Aid consumed here on a daily basis.

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4 minutes ago, AGR said:

The truth is found in that wide gulf between the prevailing views held here and those of the Tesla fanboy forums.  Or how the GM presentation was almost universally praised by the automotive press, many of whom don't normally give GM such praise, but was trashed here.

 

The problem is what GM announced is what they announced 20 years ago, just with better batteries. GM doesn't have a good track of getting things "right".  And when they actually do that's when they kill it.

 

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3 minutes ago, AGR said:

 

Or drink the Hateraid? People who live in glass houses...  There's gallons and gallons of Ford Kool-Aid consumed here on a daily basis.

 

You're on a Ford site. Don't like what you see? Leave. Plenty of Tesla sites out there. Go on YouTube, plenty of people licking Elons taint so they can get the first X, Y , model for some clicks.

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4 minutes ago, AGR said:

the GM presentation was almost universally praised by the automotive press, many of whom don't normally give GM such praise

 

GM deserves that praise. While specific technologies, processes, and products GM mentioned in its EV Day event can be debated, the fact that an incumbent automaker is making this kind of commitment to BEV is a big deal. Of course, GM has to follow through on their promise. If they don't, GM's survival is at risk.  

 

All of the incumbent automakers should follow GM's "EV Day" example.

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