2021 Ford Equator for China

[fuzzymoomoo]

46 minutes ago, akirby said:

Different platforms, different suppliers.

Flex/MKT were different platforms too, what’s your point?

[Oac98]

1 hour ago, fuzzymoomoo said:

Yeah I found that odd too, especially since they had already announced it for Flat Rock a year prior. 

Exactly. I wonder if their plans will change yet again. I hope ford doesn’t come at us with some deal like what happened at flat rock where they’re still in somewhat of a new product outside of the mustang limbo. When does Continental production end??

[fuzzymoomoo]

46 minutes ago, Oacjay98 said:

Exactly. I wonder if their plans will change yet again. I hope ford doesn’t come at us with some deal like what happened at flat rock where they’re still in somewhat of a new product outside of the mustang limbo. When does Continental production end??

I want to say end of October but I could be mistaken

[jpd80]

1 hour ago, fuzzymoomoo said:

Flex/MKT were different platforms too, what’s your point?

The build sequence and offline assembly stations and supplier park

  may be different enough to separate the BEVs from their ICE cousins.

 

It's a big cost to make a new assembly facility for BEVs, either they are that different

or there's some troubling news coming for OAC, could Ford announce another change of plans?

Edited September 18, 2020 by jpd80

[Oac98]

48 minutes ago, fuzzymoomoo said:

I want to say end of October but I could be mistaken

Do you think flat rock will get new product? I hope they get something else. Maybe a Lincoln variant of mustang on a totally different top hat or something else. Ford after all is pumping lots into their hometown of Michigan. AS THEY SHOULD!  MAP and especially Dearborn don’t have to worry about job security. If ford wanted to they could consolidate Flat Rock into Dearborn If they wanted to and build mustang there again If shit ever hit the fan and if they didn’t shut Oakville down. I’m just talking about a worse case scenario. I personally don’t think anything is closing in the near future. I’m just glad  they cancelled SLP I’m Mexico or else we certainly would’ve been fucked lol 

Edited September 18, 2020 by Oacjay98

[jpd80]

9 hours ago, CurtisH said:

We currently have a 2011 Edge.  Plan to replace it next year with another Edge.  We wouldn’t consider a 3 row Edge.  Don’t want something that big. The Escape is a little bit too small.  The Edge fits just right for us. 

You do realise that the Chinese 3-row Edge has the same wheelbase as the 2-row but with a different back

that's a mere four inches longer, it shouldn't be a deal breaker to make both or just the 3-row.

 

We should also consider that the mid-sized BEV utilities will most likely cover one of these

but which one, sporty 2-door or more versatile 3-row?

[CurtisH]

1 hour ago, jpd80 said:

You do realise that the Chinese 3-row Edge has the same wheelbase as the 2-row but with a different back

that's a mere four inches longer, it shouldn't be a deal breaker to make both or just the 3-row.

 

We should also consider that the mid-sized BEV utilities will most likely cover one of these

but which one, sporty 2-door or more versatile 3-row?

I’ve seen specs showing it considerably longer than that.  Even if it is the length you mentioned, the pics I’ve seen of it aren’t appealing.  

[akirby]

4 hours ago, fuzzymoomoo said:

Flex/MKT were different platforms too, what’s your point?

I was thinking more batteries vs ICE and a much different supply chain.  Not saying it can’t be done but it’s probably easier to collocate the EVs and give OAP Fusion or something similar.

[jpd80]

1 hour ago, CurtisH said:

I’ve seen specs showing it considerably longer than that.  Even if it is the length you mentioned, the pics I’ve seen of it aren’t appealing.  

It's just a different back on the current Edge and it is only four inches longer.

I'm not saying get rid of the 2-row Edge, just that there's a bigger market for

3-row utilities, so why not build both at OAC?

 

The other point is that Ford's  new BEV utilities may be covering the sporty Edge

but we just don't know any details yet. Ford is being like this to put pressure on

UNIFOR to sign a new agreement before they tell all about their real plan.

 

[Oac98]

24 minutes ago, jpd80 said:

It's just a different back on the current Edge and it is only four inches longer.

I'm not saying get rid of the 2-row Edge, just that there's a bigger market for

3-row utilities, so why not build both at OAC?

 

The other point is that Ford's  new BEV utilities may be covering the sporty Edge

but we just don't know any details yet. Ford is being like this to put pressure on

UNIFOR to sign a new agreement before they tell all about their real plan.

 

Agreed. They will not show their hand until after contract for us to get any info 

[CurtisH]

18 minutes ago, jpd80 said:

It's just a different back on the current Edge and it is only four inches longer.

I'm not saying get rid of the 2-row Edge, just that there's a bigger market for

3-row utilities, so why not build both at OAC?

 

The other point is that Ford's  new BEV utilities may be covering the sporty Edge

but we just don't know any details yet. Ford is being like this to put pressure on

UNIFOR to sign a new agreement before they tell all about their real plan.

 

Just looked up pics of the 3 row Edge.  I don’t care for the profile.  I’m sure my wife wouldn’t care for it either.  As long as a 2 row Edge is available, I’m good. 
 

A BEV isn’t a consideration.  The Edge is our travel vehicle.  I am not interested in planning our travel around available charging stations.  In another 10-12 years, that probably won’t be an issue.  

[jpd80]

We don't know what Ford is planning to do but I'm sure that Ford is aware of current

Edge owners preferences and that will play a big part in any decisions going forward.

 

If I was in the market, I'd consider a MME over an Edge Sport but I wonder how many

others actually in the market  would actually be thinking that way.

[CurtisH]

54 minutes ago, jpd80 said:

We don't know what Ford is planning to do but I'm sure that Ford is aware of current

Edge owners preferences and that will play a big part in any decisions going forward.

 

If I was in the market, I'd consider a MME over an Edge Sport but I wonder how many

others actually in the market  would actually be thinking that way.

I like the MME, but it’s a BEV.  

[spudz64]

15 hours ago, fuzzymoomoo said:

I want to say end of October but I could be mistaken

Continental ends production at the end of Jan 2021.

[ice-capades]

1 hour ago, spudz64 said:

Continental ends production at the end of Jan 2021.

 

Per the FDNB (Fleet Distribution News Bulletin) the 2020MY Lincoln Continental balances out on 10/30/2020.

[T-dubz]

12 hours ago, jpd80 said:

We don't know what Ford is planning to do but I'm sure that Ford is aware of current

Edge owners preferences and that will play a big part in any decisions going forward.

 

If I was in the market, I'd consider a MME over an Edge Sport but I wonder how many

others actually in the market  would actually be thinking that way.

 

For the money, I’d probably take the MME too, but you’d probably have to go with the select to stay similar in price to the ST, and it doesn’t come with the extended range battery.

I think the Mach e looks better than Tesla, but $46k pre tax savings gets you a model 3 with the extended range (322 mi) battery or $50k for the model y. To get the same range in the MME you have to spend $55k pre tax savings. I’d probably go with a Tesla the way things are currently set up. If prices and range were similar, I’d choose MME any day over Tesla.

[jpd80]

7 hours ago, T-dubz said:

 

For the money, I’d probably take the MME too, but you’d probably have to go with the select to stay similar in price to the ST, and it doesn’t come with the extended range battery.

I think the Mach e looks better than Tesla, but $46k pre tax savings gets you a model 3 with the extended range (322 mi) battery or $50k for the model y. To get the same range in the MME you have to spend $55k pre tax savings. I’d probably go with a Tesla the way things are currently set up. If prices and range were similar, I’d choose MME any day over Tesla.

IMO,  the reason why Ford is pricing MME that way is exactly because of the Mustang branding.

If this was just about matching Tesla model for model, the prices would be more aligned.

Once we're last the first twelve months of initial sales surge, I think we'll see prices ease.

 

It would be my hope to see a new C2 Edge bring hybrid and PHEV versions as points of

differentiation with the likes of MME and Ford's mid sized BEVs. I am aware that this

may seem like acting against the BEVs  but many buyers are not ready to give up on

ICE completely. It would be a good way to offer electrification benefits to a wider

audience.

Edited September 19, 2020 by jpd80

[T-dubz]

I agree, I’d much prefer a hybrid at this point in time. Once solid state batteries (or whatever the next advancement in batteries is) are mainstream, I’ll probably jump in.

[jpd80]

20 minutes ago, T-dubz said:

I agree, I’d much prefer a hybrid at this point in time. Once solid state batteries (or whatever the next advancement in batteries is) are mainstream, I’ll probably jump in.

Precisely, battery tech for hybrids is now mature enough to be easily affordable,

glad to see that the light bulb is going on as a power added as well as increased FE.

 

Isn't it ironic that advances in battery tech also benefit ICE hybrids and PHEVs that

make them viable alternatives to BEVs and why Ford needs to work all the angles,

I think this is where GM's electrification  is missing a huge slice of the market.

Edited September 19, 2020 by jpd80

[silvrsvt]

22 hours ago, jpd80 said:

If I was in the market, I'd consider a MME over an Edge Sport but I wonder how many

others actually in the market  would actually be thinking that way.

 

The MME is actually smaller then the Edge and even the Mustang (186 vs 189 vs 188)...its also narrower (74 vs 75.9 and 75.4)

I'm assuming interior packing is different since its a BEV, but the Edge is slightly bigger. 

[silvrsvt]

9 hours ago, T-dubz said:

I think the Mach e looks better than Tesla, but $46k pre tax savings gets you a model 3 with the extended range (322 mi) battery or $50k for the model y. To get the same range in the MME you have to spend $55k pre tax savings. I’d probably go with a Tesla the way things are currently set up. If prices and range were similar, I’d choose MME any day over Tesla.

 

But the Model 3 isn't a direct equivalent to the MME-you'd have to move up to the Tesla Y to have an apples to apples comparison and I don't think Tesla has any more tax credits either going forward because of the amount they built. 

[jasonj80]

With the tax credits the MME is slightly cheaper than the Model Y. MME gets the full $7500 where the Tesla won’t have any.

[jpd80]

3 hours ago, silvrsvt said:

 

The MME is actually smaller then the Edge and even the Mustang (186 vs 189 vs 188)...its also narrower (74 vs 75.9 and 75.4)

I'm assuming interior packing is different since its a BEV, but the Edge is slightly bigger. 

Correct, MME shows its C2  compact utility roots,  it lacks the hip/shoulder room of  a mid sized Utility.

Ford just kicked out the wheelbase, reducing front overhang and widened the track to near that of 

 

So I'm wondering if the MME shows us the Ford BEV strategy vs existing ICE utilities,

I think it's safe to assume that the wheelbase will be longer, short front overhang

and maybe wider track, Edge sized but Explorer wheelbase and track?

Time will tell.....

 

Edited September 20, 2020 by jpd80

[bzcat]

On 9/19/2020 at 5:09 PM, silvrsvt said:

 

The MME is actually smaller then the Edge and even the Mustang (186 vs 189 vs 188)...its also narrower (74 vs 75.9 and 75.4)

I'm assuming interior packing is different since its a BEV, but the Edge is slightly bigger. 

 

But I think it will be more roomy than Edge inside because it is a BEV.

 

Also, the upcoming MME based midsize BEV will probably be a square back (since MME is a fastback), which will add more interior volume - meaning it will likely surpass Edge even if the exterior dimension are kept the same. 

 

I think Ford didn't really have a plan to replace ICE Edge in North America after the CD6 proposal was axed. I suspect they planed to sell Mondeo Active in North America as the new Edge since they are both 5 seat CUV. But the outcry from dealer about losing the Fusion nameplate forced Ford to promise it will keep the name so now they are stuck trying to figure out what to do.

 

 

Edited September 21, 2020 by bzcat

[rmc523]

5 hours ago, bzcat said:

 

But I think it will be more roomy than Edge inside because it is a BEV.

 

Also, the upcoming MME based midsize BEV will probably be a square back (since MME is a fastback), which will add more interior volume - meaning it will likely surpass Edge even if the exterior dimension are kept the same. 

 

I think Ford didn't really have a plan to replace ICE Edge in North America after the CD6 proposal was axed. I suspect they planed to sell Mondeo Active in North America as the new Edge since they are both 5 seat CUV. But the outcry from dealer about losing the Fusion nameplate forced Ford to promise it will keep the name so now they are stuck trying to figure out what to do.

 

 

 

Sure they did - a C2 Edge.

 

I don't think it'll be square back.