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Next Generation Edge/Nautilus in doubt


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9 minutes ago, dlghtjr90 said:

 

I mean, that is exactly what Edge/Nautilius are supposed to be.. perhaps the Bronco will match the style better?

 

If Ford brought the Everest over, that would be the direct equivalent to a GC.

The Edge/Nautilus are soft roaders that aren't expected to see off road use.

The Bronco is a different duck-its rough equivalent to a Wrangler, even though the foor door Bronco will be roughly the same size as GC.

Maybe if Ford did a non-removable top version of the Bronco to go after the GC, that would be the best overall solution? Though I wonder how they could keep the separation between all the product and it would basically be a Everest with a new tophat. 

 

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12 minutes ago, dlghtjr90 said:

I'm guessing there is a good chance that some of the future battery vehicles will try to take design cues from GC to create something visually different from the existing Ford lineup.


Why would a Ford BEV want to look like a Grand Cherokee?

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3 minutes ago, akirby said:


Why would a Ford BEV want to look like a Grand Cherokee?

 

Considering most BEV's will be jelly-bean shaped for maximum aero efficiency, perhaps this is a chance to differentiate from the competition. It seems Ford got an SUV for every size, and with introductions of BEV SUV's that will have similar dimension to one of the existing lineups, the best thing it can do is perhaps have a different design.

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In terms of segment placement, Edge =/= Grand Cherokee. 

 

Edge carved out a niche when it launched and really hasn't ceded anything since. The toy car proportions and not-as-wide-as-it-seems stance offers a very different feel than a GC and the rest of the segment. 

 

Before it was scrapped, the CD6 Edge was at risk of losing all of that to become a 4/5th scale Explorer. As exciting as the prospect was, it wasn't working in execution. 

 

From what I can tell, the new project (which was actually a shelved project they blew the dust off of) is hallmarking those attributes. When (if?) it makes it to market, expect it to be very true to the 2007 and 2015 models, and less so the 2011 and 2019 facelifts. 

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10 minutes ago, PREMiERdrum said:

 

From what I can tell, the new project (which was actually a shelved project they blew the dust off of) is hallmarking those attributes. When (if?) it makes it to market, expect it to be very true to the 2007 and 2015 models, and less so the 2011 and 2019 facelifts. 

 

I would like the return of the 3 bar design. Maybe that is one of the ones they issued a patent for.

Is it possible the Edge and Fusion Active will be developed closely, sharing many parts and offering a similar vehicle with a different stance?

I could see the Nautilus switching to the Mach E platform to be Lincoln's first electric vehicle, and not sharing anything with the Edge.

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1 hour ago, silvrsvt said:

 

If Ford brought the Everest over, that would be the direct equivalent to a GC.

The Edge/Nautilus are soft roaders that aren't expected to see off road use.

The Bronco is a different duck-its rough equivalent to a Wrangler, even though the foor door Bronco will be roughly the same size as GC.

Maybe if Ford did a non-removable top version of the Bronco to go after the GC, that would be the best overall solution? Though I wonder how they could keep the separation between all the product and it would basically be a Everest with a new tophat. 

 


I’ve said this before, but I’d love a bronco without a removable top. I’d be fine with the Everest too. I’d buy this right now if it were available. It will probably look even better if/when it gets the new ranger face on it. Also, that blue would look awesome on the bronco.everest1.jpg?width=820

Edited by T-dubz
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Could Ford move the Nautilus to RWD-based CD6 for FRAP considering the new Mustang is supposed to ride on the same platform?

And then have Oakville build C2-based Edge and Fusion Active?

Or is the Fusion active going to be an import from Europe?

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11 hours ago, oacnewbie said:

Could Ford move the Nautilus to RWD-based CD6 for FRAP considering the new Mustang is supposed to ride on the same platform?

And then have Oakville build C2-based Edge and Fusion Active?

Or is the Fusion active going to be an import from Europe?

 

Given the economics of the Mustang and current events, I don't see it moving off the S197 platform anytime soon. Only major issue I can see is fitting a battery pack in it for the Hybrid version. If Ford has that figured out, they can keep it on the current platform til the end of the decade if they need to...then maybe merge the Mach E and Mustang as BEVs

It also wouldn't make much sense to move the Nautilus only to CD6...they sell under 50K of them a year and the economics of having a short CD6 wouldn't make sense. 

The Fusion Active has been pegged for production at Hermosillo, but its a bit of an outlyer, since it will be building the Transit Connect, Bronco Sport and Maverick. 

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4 hours ago, silvrsvt said:

 

Given the economics of the Mustang and current events, I don't see it moving off the S197 platform anytime soon. Only major issue I can see is fitting a battery pack in it for the Hybrid version. If Ford has that figured out, they can keep it on the current platform til the end of the decade if they need to...then maybe merge the Mach E and Mustang as BEVs

It also wouldn't make much sense to move the Nautilus only to CD6...they sell under 50K of them a year and the economics of having a short CD6 wouldn't make sense. 

The Fusion Active has been pegged for production at Hermosillo, but its a bit of an outlyer, since it will be building the Transit Connect, Bronco Sport and Maverick. 

Mustang is on S550 but I get your drift......

The update was supposed to make Mustang more modular as part of adding hybrid batteries.

Edited by jpd80
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On 6/18/2020 at 5:41 AM, PREMiERdrum said:

In terms of segment placement, Edge =/= Grand Cherokee. 

 

Edge carved out a niche when it launched and really hasn't ceded anything since. The toy car proportions and not-as-wide-as-it-seems stance offers a very different feel than a GC and the rest of the segment. 

 

Before it was scrapped, the CD6 Edge was at risk of losing all of that to become a 4/5th scale Explorer. As exciting as the prospect was, it wasn't working in execution. 

 

From what I can tell, the new project (which was actually a shelved project they blew the dust off of) is hallmarking those attributes. When (if?) it makes it to market, expect it to be very true to the 2007 and 2015 models, and less so the 2011 and 2019 facelifts. 

 

GC and Edge is very much in the same segment. I know plenty of people that cross shop the two as well as Highlander or Sorento. Most CUV buyers aren't aware (or care) about FWD or RWD. I even know someone who traded in his first gen Edge for a 4Runner because he like the rugged offroad look which Edge lacked. These SUVs are all the same size and function largely the same and sells for similar prices. 

 

I can see why CD6 Edge was scrapped... it probably ended up looking like a stubby Explorer whereas Edge (the US model anyway) was always positioned as a sporty almost coupe like SUV with a fastback shape. It will be curious to see if the Chinese market Edge stays on C2 or moves to CD6... or even shrink in size. Ford just launched locally assembled Explorer in China. The only engine choice is 2.3 EB vs. Edge which is available with 2.7 EB V6... both are 7 seat SUV so very interesting product and segment decision in China.

 

Some photos of Chinese Explorer:

https://www.autohome.com.cn/news/202006/1005144.html#pvareaid=3454480

 

https://www.autohome.com.cn/advice/202006/1005179.html#pvareaid=3454484

 

 

 

Edited by bzcat
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23 minutes ago, bzcat said:

 

GC and Edge is very much in the same segment. I know plenty of people that cross shop the two as well as Highlander or Sorento. Most CUV buyers aren't aware (or care) about FWD or RWD. I even know someone who traded in his first gen Edge for a 4Runner because he like the rugged offroad look which Edge lacked. These SUVs are all the same size and function largely the same and sells for similar prices. 

 

I can see why CD6 Edge was scrapped... it probably ended up looking like a stubby Explorer whereas Edge (the US model anyway) was always positioned as a sporty almost coupe like SUV with a fastback shape. It will be curious to see if the Chinese market Edge stays on C2 or moves to CD6... or even shrink in size. Ford just launched locally assembled Explorer in China. The only engine choice is 2.3 EB vs. Edge which is available with 2.7 EB V6... both are 7 seat SUV so very interesting product and segment decision in China.

 

https://www.autohome.com.cn/news/202006/1005144.html#pvareaid=3454480

 

 


I always thought that the Edge target market was suburbanites / empty nesters who preferred style/comfort/tech over ruggedness/off-road worthiness

 

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28 minutes ago, oacnewbie said:


I always thought that the Edge target market was suburbanites / empty nesters who preferred style/comfort/tech over ruggedness/off-road worthiness

 

 

And retired oldsters. Probably the number one Ford seller in central Florida after F-Series. Nautilus also big seller in these parts. Lincoln dealers have better lease rates than Ford dealers. Lots of Ford retirees down here and they love the Edge/Nautilus. Hope Ford doesn't screw that up and let them die on the vine like the Flex which slow well here too. Now they can let the Ecosport die on the vine. Only nice thing you can say about it is that it's cute and fits in a small garage. Ford dealers around here are still trying to sell 2018's.

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2 hours ago, silvrsvt said:

 

yeah I forgot about the IRS that was added back in to the platform that changed the name :)

 

The same but different

 

 

I believe the front suspension was substantially revamped too.  I remember an article saying that the IRS worked so well that they had to significantly update the front suspension so it worked as well as the IRS. 
 

The hard points were mostly (maybe completely) unchanged. 

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I could have been better with my wording. 

 

From a marketing perspective, there isn't much overlap between the targeted audience for GC and Edge. While there will naturally be some cross shopping in the marketplace, they are aimed at and marketed towards very different consumers. 

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7 hours ago, bzcat said:

 

GC and Edge is very much in the same segment. I know plenty of people that cross shop the two as well as Highlander or Sorento. Most CUV buyers aren't aware (or care) about FWD or RWD. I even know someone who traded in his first gen Edge for a 4Runner because he like the rugged offroad look which Edge lacked. These SUVs are all the same size and function largely the same and sells for similar prices. 

 

I can see why CD6 Edge was scrapped... it probably ended up looking like a stubby Explorer whereas Edge (the US model anyway) was always positioned as a sporty almost coupe like SUV with a fastback shape. It will be curious to see if the Chinese market Edge stays on C2 or moves to CD6... or even shrink in size. Ford just launched locally assembled Explorer in China. The only engine choice is 2.3 EB vs. Edge which is available with 2.7 EB V6... both are 7 seat SUV so very interesting product and segment decision in China.

 

Some photos of Chinese Explorer:

https://www.autohome.com.cn/news/202006/1005144.html#pvareaid=3454480

 

https://www.autohome.com.cn/advice/202006/1005179.html#pvareaid=3454484

If you think Range Rover line up, the CD6 Edge was going to look a bit like the Velar,

which may have also been a contributing reason.  In any case, applying C2 advances

to the Edge was always going to be more cost effective and maximise weight  loss.

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On 6/18/2020 at 8:41 AM, PREMiERdrum said:

In terms of segment placement, Edge =/= Grand Cherokee. 

 

Edge carved out a niche when it launched and really hasn't ceded anything since. The toy car proportions and not-as-wide-as-it-seems stance offers a very different feel than a GC and the rest of the segment. 

 

Before it was scrapped, the CD6 Edge was at risk of losing all of that to become a 4/5th scale Explorer. As exciting as the prospect was, it wasn't working in execution. 

 

From what I can tell, the new project (which was actually a shelved project they blew the dust off of) is hallmarking those attributes. When (if?) it makes it to market, expect it to be very true to the 2007 and 2015 models, and less so the 2011 and 2019 facelifts. 


Did Ford change model codes when they cancelled the CD6 project?
AFAIK the Edge/Nautilus had model codes of CDX706/707

The AFS Blogger claims that the model code cancelled was CDX777

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There are multiple programs to replace Edge because each region had different requirements. This is part of the confusion. We don't know which one got cancelled or rolled into another program. I am skeptical that Ford will abandon the segment in the US that it has strong volumes. That goes in opposite direction of Farley's principle of culling the segment where Ford is not a strong/top 3 competitor. Edge is a top 3 competitor and by all account, a pretty strong entry in the midsize utility segment. 

 

 

 

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