Unifor contract update

[fuzzymoomoo]

14 minutes ago, Oacjay98 said:

80 percent Unifor contract ratified! 

Wow you guys voted already? It was a week before we started voting. 

[Oac98]

17 minutes ago, fuzzymoomoo said:

Wow you guys voted already? It was a week before we started voting. 

Everything was done online on Sunday, we had a zoom meeting online. Voting deadline was 10:59 am today.  They laid out the details with a video presentation for everyone then specific locals did their own videos. Question and answer session on zoom, we typed in questions then they answered what they could and chose to by way of video.

[T-dubz]

3 vehicles that only sell 20k each? I am assuming these would be a trim of an already existing model. Hardly seems worth it to make a completely new vehicle unless you are charging hundreds of thousands for it.

[Oac98]

26 minutes ago, T-dubz said:

3 vehicles that only sell 20k each? I am assuming these would be a trim of an already existing model. Hardly seems worth it to make a completely new vehicle unless you are charging hundreds of thousands for it.

This plan is still vague I feel the same way you do! 

[bzcat]

2026 is so far away everything is subject to change...

 

The only thing that I think we can take away from the contract is that Ford is planning to sell EVs in multiple sizes after 2025.

 

 

[Oac98]

18 minutes ago, bzcat said:

2026 is so far away everything is subject to change...

 

The only thing that I think we can take away from the contract is that Ford is planning to sell EVs in multiple sizes after 2025.

 

 

Agreed, this is certainly subject to change. We’ve all seen this company move product around that was slated for other locations. 

[Oac98]

14 hours ago, bzcat said:

2026 is so far away everything is subject to change...

 

The only thing that I think we can take away from the contract is that Ford is planning to sell EVs in multiple sizes after 2025.

 

 

Let’s just hope this plan is well thought out and doesn’t flop.

[silvrsvt]

18 hours ago, T-dubz said:

3 vehicles that only sell 20k each? I am assuming these would be a trim of an already existing model. Hardly seems worth it to make a completely new vehicle unless you are charging hundreds of thousands for it.

 

new BEV Ford GT ?

 

[Oac98]

51 minutes ago, silvrsvt said:

 

new BEV Ford GT ?

 

Ford GT is already built up here in Markham, Ontario by Multimatic so if they did an electric version in Oakville that would be cool. GT is hand built though so that’s just fantasizing lol.

[T-dubz]

I can’t even imagine how fast a BEV GT would be. 

[ESP08]

On 9/24/2020 at 6:30 PM, pffan1990 said:

 The 5.0L Coyote is getting really old and pretty much already reached its maximum capabilities. 

 

People were saying the same thing in 2011, it wasn't true then and it isn't true now.  

[J-150]

On 9/28/2020 at 1:16 PM, fuzzymoomoo said:

Wow you guys voted already? It was a week before we started voting. 

 

You need to factor in the exchange rate. Canadians measure a week differently.

[pffan1990]

3 hours ago, ESP08 said:

 

People were saying the same thing in 2011, it wasn't true then and it isn't true now.  

I was talking about the age of the 5.0L V8 which dates back to the old 4.6L Modular well over 20 years now. Perhaps I should have mentioned that in my post. The engine in 5.0L size is good but they did have to enlarge it to 5.2L with some modifications for the Shelby GT350 and supercharged for GT500. The new engine for Windsor, which I now realized is actually 6.8L not the 4.8L as I previously thought, would be good because it is all-new (even if based on 7.3L) and will provide many years of performance capability. Though likely in limited annual volume, however, due to CAFE and gas guzzler tax.

[ESP08]

10 hours ago, pffan1990 said:

I was talking about the age of the 5.0L V8 which dates back to the old 4.6L Modular well over 20 years now. Perhaps I should have mentioned that in my post. The engine in 5.0L size is good but they did have to enlarge it to 5.2L with some modifications for the Shelby GT350 and supercharged for GT500. The new engine for Windsor, which I now realized is actually 6.8L not the 4.8L as I previously thought, would be good because it is all-new (even if based on 7.3L) and will provide many years of performance capability. Though likely in limited annual volume, however, due to CAFE and gas guzzler tax.

 

Despite the age of the basic architecture, the only respect in which the Modular/Coyote lag behind Boss/Godzilla is in bore spacing.   The Modular has proven over and over again to be one of -- if not the -- most physically robust V8 architectures ever mass produced. 

I can think of no other V8 architecture, domestic or not, that has been taken over 3200 HP on OEM cylinder head castings and OEM block castings like the 4.6 4V has.  

I would take a Coyote on a 4.2-4.4 inch bore spacing over any variation of Godzilla for GT500/Raptor any day.  

[silvrsvt]

11 hours ago, pffan1990 said:

I was talking about the age of the 5.0L V8 which dates back to the old 4.6L Modular well over 20 years now. Perhaps I should have mentioned that in my post. The engine in 5.0L size is good but they did have to enlarge it to 5.2L with some modifications for the Shelby GT350 and supercharged for GT500.

 

The reason it was "enlarged" a whole whopping .2 of a liter is because they changed to a Spray Bore process. 

[pffan1990]

7 hours ago, ESP08 said:

 

Despite the age of the basic architecture, the only respect in which the Modular/Coyote lag behind Boss/Godzilla is in bore spacing.   The Modular has proven over and over again to be one of -- if not the -- most physically robust V8 architectures ever mass produced. 

I can think of no other V8 architecture, domestic or not, that has been taken over 3200 HP on OEM cylinder head castings and OEM block castings like the 4.6 4V has.  

I would take a Coyote on a 4.2-4.4 inch bore spacing over any variation of Godzilla for GT500/Raptor any day.  

How many more years do you think the Coyote has left? It's been a good engine indeed.

[ESP08]

2 minutes ago, pffan1990 said:

How many more years do you think the Coyote has left? It's been a good engine indeed.

 

As of right now I honestly think the Coyote can remain relevant until the gasoline engine is largely replaced by EVs.   

The Coyote currently has zero issues competing with and outperforming it's 6.2-6.4 liter domestic competitors.   It makes 460 HP in the Mustang GT, with just a GT350 intake manifold swap it will make 480 HP in the '21 Mach 1.  With minor changes 500+ HP isn't an issue at all.   

The Coyote certainly hasn't been surpassed by similar capacity V8s from competing overseas manufacturers like VW, Toyota, etc.  

 

That may change if GM comes out with a large bore spacing 5.5 liter 4V V8 and makes it widely available, on an architecture with headroom for displacement.  But as of now the Coyote is plenty competitive with headroom to spare.  Have you seen how easy it is to take the 5.2 Predator over 1000 rwhp with minor bolt ons?  There's clearly more in that engine combo than even Dodge's Redeye/Demon mod for mod.  

[fuzzymoomoo]

53 minutes ago, ESP08 said:

 

As of right now I honestly think the Coyote can remain relevant until the gasoline engine is largely replaced by EVs.   

The Coyote currently has zero issues competing with and outperforming it's 6.2-6.4 liter domestic competitors.   It makes 460 HP in the Mustang GT, with just a GT350 intake manifold swap it will make 480 HP in the '21 Mach 1.  With minor changes 500+ HP isn't an issue at all.   

The Coyote certainly hasn't been surpassed by similar capacity V8s from competing overseas manufacturers like VW, Toyota, etc.  

 

That may change if GM comes out with a large bore spacing 5.5 liter 4V V8 and makes it widely available, on an architecture with headroom for displacement.  But as of now the Coyote is plenty competitive with headroom to spare.  Have you seen how easy it is to take the 5.2 Predator over 1000 rwhp with minor bolt ons?  There's clearly more in that engine combo than even Dodge's Redeye/Demon mod for mod.  

Spot on. The Coyote the best engine platform Ford has developed in house, possibly ever. 

[rmc523]

1 minute ago, fuzzymoomoo said:

Spot on. The Coyote the best engine platform Ford has developed in house, possibly ever. 

 

It's a ton of fun haha.

[Oac98]

23 hours ago, J-150 said:

 

You need to factor in the exchange rate. Canadians measure a week differently.

We sure do!! EH

[benbr17624]

On 9/24/2020 at 10:22 PM, CurtisH said:

The 4 door Bronco has a longer wheelbase than the Mustang.  It’s also slightly longer and wider than the Mustang.   The Mustang definitely has a bigger footprint than the 2 door Bronco. 

Absolutely agree. and good its that way!

[silvrsvt]

On 9/28/2020 at 11:48 AM, jasonj80 said:

They are basically going to rebuild the assembly plant; everything will be ripped out and started from scratch. 

 

On 9/28/2020 at 12:09 PM, fuzzymoomoo said:

Right, however they can take a bulldozer and rip everything out very quickly. 
 

Never forget the body shop at Dearborn Truck was gutted, rebuilt and back to production in 6 weeks. 

 

I think the keyword here is it "depends"
 

The Mustang Mach E plant was down for a very long time time also...I want to say the last Fiesta was built in May 2019 and they just started making Mach Es about a year later...well Pre-production models before COVID hit.

 

Maybe they are taking more time to do BEV plants since they don't have the institutional knowledge on how to do it quickly? 

[jpd80]

On 10/1/2020 at 9:30 PM, ESP08 said:

I would take a Coyote on a 4.2-4.4 inch bore spacing over any variation of Godzilla for GT500/Raptor any day.  

But Coyote is not on that wider bore spacing and the 6.8 will be here in just over two years.

 

I think that Ford has already made that decision for you as the special line that makes the

5.2 V8 finishes in the next two years. The Coyote is a great engine but Ford is clearly going

in a different direction with with its apex performance engines.

 

Edited October 4, 2020 by jpd80

[jpd80]

6 hours ago, silvrsvt said:

 

 

I think the keyword here is it "depends"
 

The Mustang Mach E plant was down for a very long time time also...I want to say the last Fiesta was built in May 2019 and they just started making Mach Es about a year later...well Pre-production models before COVID hit.

 

Maybe they are taking more time to do BEV plants since they don't have the institutional knowledge on how to do it quickly? 

Or was it that the Fiesta balance out was planned years in front with suppliers and the plant upgrade was ahead of design completion of Mustang Mach E  The delays to correct MME would have occurred inside that time frame and probably why there's no rush  to

change the plant.

 

Make no mistake MME was a rescue plan for an off course BEV that wasn't going to work in North America or Europe,

It was a project forced into Fields by Bill Ford that was rescued by Hackett and Farley and given the Mustang name.

Bill Ford wanted this, he's been pushing it for years but that doesn't mean it's the best choice for a BEV.

Edited October 4, 2020 by jpd80

[silvrsvt]

1 hour ago, jpd80 said:

Or was it that the Fiesta balance out was planned years in front with suppliers and the plant upgrade was ahead of design completion of Mustang Mach E  The delays to correct MME would have occurred inside that time frame and probably why there's no rush  to

change the plant.

 

Make no mistake MME was a rescue plan for an off course BEV that wasn't going to work in North America or Europe,

It was a project forced into Fields by Bill Ford that was rescued by Hackett and Farley and given the Mustang name.

Bill Ford wanted this, he's been pushing it for years but that doesn't mean it's the best choice for a BEV.

The timeline never changed for the Mustang Mach E though and there was no indication of that happening-I believe that the redesign was done fairly early on in the process that it didn’t impact the launch date, outside of the pandemic.