Jump to content

Ford Q3 2020 Sales Results


Recommended Posts

5 hours ago, FordBuyer said:

Only one thing annoys me...the one touch down, but NOT up power window on a $34,000 vehicle. I'll give Ford a pass on lack of auto dimming mirror and fog lights, but not this. 

 

SEL grade 2020 Escape includes one touch auto up windows. It's weird that Premium Package on SE Sport Hybrid doesn't include that feature, because otherwise the package aligns very closely with SEL standard equipment.

 

Maybe for 2021, Ford will add one touch auto up windows to SE & SE Sport, and/or add an SEL Hybrid version.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 10/3/2020 at 2:45 PM, CKNSLS said:

 

The Koreans have some real viable alternatives as well. I predicted an Escape "fail" the moment I saw it. It is lights years behind on exterior styling alone-not even mentioning interior-to just about all other competitors.


I can now speak from an educated position on the Escape.  I just picked up a 2020 Escape SE for my daughter.  Now that I have driven it around for a while, I will say the 1.5 is significantly better than it has been made out to be here. It is not the quietest motor, but certainly not the loudest I’ve heard. My comparison is against a Mazda CX-5 and the RAV4.  This definitely feels more powerful than those.  I did notice there were a few times when the transmission felt like It was a gear too high, but otherwise the trans has felt smooth.  
 

It would have been nice to have Sync4, but Sync3 is stable and I have no issues with it.  It’s definitely better than the CX5 infotainment system, which uses the dial and was very unpleasant to use.  I don’t feel the RAV4 exceeds Ford's infotainment. either. 
 

I would say the Mazda’s interior materials are better than the Escape, however the driver's seat was more comfortable in the Escape.   The contouring of the seats on the Mazda made the seats feel narrow to me, which I didn’t care for.  The interior is nothing special on the RAV4, and definitely no better.  
 

The style of the vehicle Is subjective.  I’m a truck guy, but regarding this vehicle I’ve always thought it looked like a Porsche Cayenne.  Apparently I’m not the only one, because two kids at her school asked who got the Porsche.  
 

She loves the vehicle inside and out, and her friends seem to like it as well. It was a great value for me because I got a killer deal since it was a service loaner that had 1k miles on it.  

 

I would have posted a couple of pics but the site is giving me errors when I attempt to attach them. 
 

 

  • Like 4
Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 10/4/2020 at 10:49 AM, rperez817 said:

 

Yes sir T-dubz. This can be summed up by saying "if you considering getting a 2020 Ford Escape, stay away from 3-cylinder 1.5L models".

 

Consumer Reports said in its Ford Escape road test review "We would avoid the standard 1.5-liter turbocharged three-cylinder engine just because of its bothersome boominess and vibration. Neither the uplevel 2.0-liter turbocharged four-cylinder nor the hybrid has this issue."


I must me lucky, I have not experienced boominess or vibration from this motor. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

12 hours ago, tbone said:


I can now speak from an educated position on the Escape.  I just picked up a 2020 Escape SE for my daughter.  Now that I have driven it around for a while, I will say the 1.5 is significantly better than it has been made out to be here. It is not the quietest motor, but certainly not the loudest I’ve heard. My comparison is against a Mazda CX-5 and the RAV4.  This definitely feels more powerful than those.  I did notice there were a few times when the transmission felt like It was a gear too high, but otherwise the trans has felt smooth.  
 

It would have been nice to have Sync4, but Sync3 is stable and I have no issues with it.  It’s definitely better than the CX5 infotainment system, which uses the dial and was very unpleasant to use.  I don’t feel the RAV4 exceeds Ford's infotainment. either. 
 

I would say the Mazda’s interior materials are better than the Escape, however the driver's seat was more comfortable in the Escape.   The contouring of the seats on the Mazda made the seats feel narrow to me, which I didn’t care for.  The interior is nothing special on the RAV4, and definitely no better.  
 

The style of the vehicle Is subjective.  I’m a truck guy, but regarding this vehicle I’ve always thought it looked like a Porsche Cayenne.  Apparently I’m not the only one, because two kids at her school asked who got the Porsche.  
 

She loves the vehicle inside and out, and her friends seem to like it as well. It was a great value for me because I got a killer deal since it was a service loaner that had 1k miles on it.  

 

I would have posted a couple of pics but the site is giving me errors when I attempt to attach them. 
 

 

I notice that Ford advertising of the Escape is geared toward young women. So I imagine buyers are skewed more to women than men. However, I see women buying the Sport also because of its smallish cute size like the Ecosport. Apartment/Condo buyers will and are attracted to Crosstrek, Bronco Sport, Trailbazer, Encore, Trax, Ecosport, and the like.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

5 hours ago, FordBuyer said:

I notice that Ford advertising of the Escape is geared toward young women. So I imagine buyers are skewed more to women than men. However, I see women buying the Sport also because of its smallish cute size like the Ecosport. Apartment/Condo buyers will and are attracted to Crosstrek, Bronco Sport, Trailbazer, Encore, Trax, Ecosport, and the like.

I’m left with the feeling that a future Ecosport will be a Mahindra based vehicle and probably dedicated to markets like India and whatever springs from that.

 

Maybe Escape is just struggling against so many compact utility competitors these days, it’s like every manufacturer has at least two or three types to offer buyers. I want to believe that ford is trying to compete but building in USA vs Mexico is an added cost sometimes missed by price sensitive buyers, any perception of value becomes lowest price to most...

Edited by jpd80
Link to comment
Share on other sites

17 minutes ago, jpd80 said:

I’m left with the feeling that a future Ecosport will be a Mahindra based vehicle and probably dedicated to markets like India and whatever springs from that.

 

Maybe Escape is just struggling against so many compact utility competitors these days, it’s like every manufacturer has at least two or three types to offer buyers. I want to believe that ford is trying to compete but building in USA vs Mexico is an added cost sometimes missed by price sensitive buyers, any perception of value becomes lowest price to most...

I would say the CUV market is much more competitive segment than the sedan market. After all, a CUV is basically a raised sedan with a rear hatch. At least Ford differentiated itself with Explorer RWD. Ford is definitely struggling in the small CUV segment and we will see with the compact to midsized segment. Certainly Escape has not gotten off to a good start compared to the RAV4 especially. And now here comes the new Rogue which sells in the 300,000 range. Don't know what to think with the Edge. Hopefully the new interior will help to keep sales up. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, jpd80 said:

I’m left with the feeling that a future Ecosport will be a Mahindra based vehicle and probably dedicated to markets like India and whatever springs from that.

 

From what I get, India is developing BX745 by Mahindra as a replacement for the Ecosport - whereas BX755 is under development by teams of Changan and Ford Brazil to replace the Ecosport in China, South America and Europe (no mention of US). I believe both are based on an extended B2 platform but BX745 might have size constraints and will use Mahindra engines. The larger Indian version of a Compass competitor should, on the other hand, have an underlying Mahindra essence.

That's how I read the situation but I could be totally wrong.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, FordBuyer said:

I would say the CUV market is much more competitive segment than the sedan market. After all, a CUV is basically a raised sedan with a rear hatch. At least Ford differentiated itself with Explorer RWD. Ford is definitely struggling in the small CUV segment and we will see with the compact to midsized segment. Certainly Escape has not gotten off to a good start compared to the RAV4 especially. And now here comes the new Rogue which sells in the 300,000 range. Don't know what to think with the Edge. Hopefully the new interior will help to keep sales up. 

It seems like all new entries in this segment have a more aggressive design or more traditional suv shape. Ford seems to be going against the grain with the escapes design, but of course it also has the bronco sport to fall back on. Ford is either a genius or made a miscalculation in what the market wants. Its too early to tell if ford chose the right path, and I don’t envy the analysts at ford who are trying to interpret all of the data, especially with the wrench named COVID that was thrown at them. I’d guess our first indication would be how drastic a refresh the escape gets in a couple years. If ford keeps it relatively the same with just minor tweaks (think fusion refresh) then they are probably happy. If it’s more extensive then they probably weren’t.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, FordBuyer said:

I would say the CUV market is much more competitive segment than the sedan market. After all, a CUV is basically a raised sedan with a rear hatch. At least Ford differentiated itself with Explorer RWD. Ford is definitely struggling in the small CUV segment and we will see with the compact to midsized segment. Certainly Escape has not gotten off to a good start compared to the RAV4 especially. And now here comes the new Rogue which sells in the 300,000 range. Don't know what to think with the Edge. Hopefully the new interior will help to keep sales up. 

What you need to understand is that strong sales don’t necessarily mean that those compacts are high profit, they’re just recreating the same situation that exists in midsized cars.

Toyota may continue to sell 300k Camry and +400K RAV4 but there’s absolutely no guarantee that it adds more than chump change to the bottom line compared to Ford and GM’s full-size Trucks and utilities. A lot of the other manufacturers are besotted with the pride of gaining market percentage in segments where Ford is trying different things that reduce sales and add profit, sometimes it  works, sometimes it doesn’t. If you look at Ford’s plan, it’s all about capping production and finding a way of increasing profits on the 2.5-2.6 million vehicles it sell in the US every year. Ford has to find a way for those sales volumes to work and the best way is to substitute products with a better chance of making more profit, instead of just pandering to buyers that want lowest price plus a high level of content.

 

i do believe that the profit machinery inside ford has been broken for a few years now and they need to find the way back. Bronco and Bronco Sport may be the start of that.

Edited by jpd80
  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

There is no doubt Toyota is racking it in on RAV4. It's probably their most profitable vehicle right now.

 

RAV4 + Freelander + Harrier/Venza + Lexus NX worldwide is huge volume for the program. When you have sustained volume like that, you have to try very hard to lose money. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, bzcat said:

RAV4 + Freelander + Harrier/Venza + Lexus NX worldwide is huge volume for the program. When you have sustained volume like that, you have to try very hard to lose money. 


Freelander was a Land Rover. 
 

You mean Highlander.
 

Also Lexus RX. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, rmc523 said:

So it's a Rav4 with slightly different taillights and a different front?

 

Pretty much. Wildlander is only offered in China for now. Suzuki has a variant of RAV4 Prime/PHEV that it sells in Europe as the Across, with yet another variation of the front fascia.

 

suzuki-across-7_1600x0.webp

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 10/7/2020 at 5:12 PM, T-dubz said:

It seems like all new entries in this segment have a more aggressive design or more traditional suv shape. Ford seems to be going against the grain with the escapes design, but of course it also has the bronco sport to fall back on. Ford is either a genius or made a miscalculation in what the market wants. Its too early to tell if ford chose the right path, and I don’t envy the analysts at ford who are trying to interpret all of the data, especially with the wrench named COVID that was thrown at them. I’d guess our first indication would be how drastic a refresh the escape gets in a couple years. If ford keeps it relatively the same with just minor tweaks (think fusion refresh) then they are probably happy. If it’s more extensive then they probably weren’t.

The new Escape has design cues from the old "Oval Taurus".  We all know how that went. The bottom line is that just about every other competing CUV looks better.  

 

Nissan is going to sell a bunch of the redesigned Rogue. The RAV-4 will sell well and Hyundai's new Tucson looks promising as well.  

Edited by CKNSLS
  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 hours ago, silvrsvt said:

 

To rental and subprime buyers ?

 

 

You know-a purchase is a unit sold-it doesn't matter what the FICO is.  I find it hard to believe those who buy Fiestas have over 500 credit scores either. Yea-people buy those cars because they gotta have them....BTW-have you looked at resale values-Escapes versus the competition? I haven't but I am curious.

Edited by CKNSLS
Link to comment
Share on other sites

46 minutes ago, CKNSLS said:

 

You know-a purchase is a unit sold-it doesn't matter what the FICO is.  I find it hard to believe those who buy Fiestas have over 500 credit scores either. Yea-people buy those cars because they gotta have them....BTW-have you looked at resale values-Escapes versus the competition? I haven't but I am curious.


It does matter and Nissan admitted that it was a bad business practice and that they were cutting back.  Too many loan defaults and late payments almost put Mitsubishi out of business.

 

The point is it’s easy to inflate sales numbers with rental fleet dumping and high risk loans.  
 

Rav4 and CRV are better examples.

Edited by akirby
Link to comment
Share on other sites

8 hours ago, CKNSLS said:

BTW-have you looked at resale values-Escapes versus the competition? I haven't but I am curious.

 

I don't have the numbers for 2020 models, but here are IntelliChoice 5-year retained value percentages for 2019 Ford Escape and competition (higher numbers are better).

  • 2019 Escape: 45%
  • 2019 Equinox: 48%
  • 2019 CR-V: 52%
  • 2019 Terrain: 48%
  • 2019 Tucson: 48%
  • 2019 Cherokee: 46%
  • 2019 Sportage: 50%
  • 2019 CX-5: 50%
  • 2019 Outlander: 41%
  • 2019 Rogue: 46%
  • 2019 Forester: 56%
  • 2019 RAV4: 54%
  • 2019 Tiguan: 45%
Link to comment
Share on other sites

12 hours ago, silvrsvt said:

subprime buyers ?

 

...don't often buy or lease new vehicles of any brand. When they buy a car, it's almost always a used one.

 

In Q2 2020, fewer than 9% of new car loans in the U.S. were to borrowers categorized as subprime or deep subprime according to Experian. These numbers are for loans from any source. The percentage of subprime or deep subprime new car loans and leases made by automakers' captive finance companies is lower still.

 

image.thumb.png.5ff91c717a8f81f1ab3b29cffa8cfd32.png

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, rperez817 said:

 

I don't have the numbers for 2020 models, but here are IntelliChoice 5-year retained value percentages for 2019 Ford Escape and competition (higher numbers are better).

  • 2019 Escape: 45%
  • 2019 Equinox: 48%
  • 2019 CR-V: 52%
  • 2019 Terrain: 48%
  • 2019 Tucson: 48%
  • 2019 Cherokee: 46%
  • 2019 Sportage: 50%
  • 2019 CX-5: 50%
  • 2019 Outlander: 41%
  • 2019 Rogue: 46%
  • 2019 Forester: 56%
  • 2019 RAV4: 54%
  • 2019 Tiguan: 45%

That's very interesting. I have mentioned on other boards that between some models-trade in/resale differences does not equate to a lot of difference in dollars. The difference between 45% and 48% is not going to break a deal at the time of another vehicle acquisition. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

11 hours ago, CKNSLS said:

 

You know-a purchase is a unit sold-it doesn't matter what the FICO is.  I find it hard to believe those who buy Fiestas have over 500 credit scores either. Yea-people buy those cars because they gotta have them....BTW-have you looked at resale values-Escapes versus the competition? I haven't but I am curious.

 

Those credit challenged customers aren't the only ones that end up buying Fiesta's or other price leading models such as the EcoSport. Those customers can end up in those vehicles because they're new to the market and it makes more sense to buy or lease a new vehicle based on incentives and payments or trying to rebuild their credit. I've seen customers with horrible credit history or problems elsewhere that Ford Credit approved on a new vehicle because their previous payment history with Ford Credit was good. For the entry level buyers starting out it's an opportunity to establish a relationship with them and potential future sales. For the credit challenged customers, it's a situation that Ford Credit looks at on a case by case basis weighing the credit history, money down, equity in the new vehicle, etc.   

  • Thanks 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

×
×
  • Create New...