Ford picks Cologne plant to build new EV in Europe

[bzcat]

The general consensus on autonomous vehicles from urban planners and people involved in transportation is that it will greatly worsen congestion in urban areas because people are selfish - when you remove the biggest determent from driving in urban areas (the need to find parking at your destination), you will encourage a lot more usage. So most urban planners believe regulation will be required to limit their access in favor of vehicles that are fully occupied. Mass transit is still the only logical way to move vast amount of people in urban environment because of physical space constrains. 

[AGR]

9 hours ago, bzcat said:

The general consensus on autonomous vehicles from urban planners and people involved in transportation is that it will greatly worsen congestion in urban areas because people are selfish - when you remove the biggest determent from driving in urban areas (the need to find parking at your destination), you will encourage a lot more usage. So most urban planners believe regulation will be required to limit their access in favor of vehicles that are fully occupied. Mass transit is still the only logical way to move vast amount of people in urban environment because of physical space constrains. 

 

Thanks for expanding on one of my points. 

And I don't think that the work from home thing will be an all the time permanent change for most people.

[akirby]

8 hours ago, AGR said:

And I don't think that the work from home thing will be an all the time permanent change for most people.

 

Oh I beg to differ.  Now that companies (and more importantly executives) have seen that it works for most jobs now thanks to collaboration tools and high speed internet service and (perhaps more importantly) they see that they can shed real estate costs, you're going to see a lot more of it.  At least a few days a week.

[AGR]

10 hours ago, akirby said:

 

Oh I beg to differ.  Now that companies (and more importantly executives) have seen that it works for most jobs now thanks to collaboration tools and high speed internet service and (perhaps more importantly) they see that they can shed real estate costs, you're going to see a lot more of it.  At least a few days a week.

 

Well, our company feels differently. I work in mortgage servicing for one of the big evil banks. Most of the employees in our department are working from home. The higher ups have made it clear that once the pandemic is over, they expect a return to normal operations, with employees coming back to the office. I'm one of the lucky few that have been deemed essential and have been going into the office every day.  I am more than OK with that. Going to the office has been a small bit of normalcy, especially during the almost total shutdowns back in the Spring. Being stuck at home 24/7 with nowhere to go and nothing to do would have been even more miserable.

Don't forget that local governments get a big chunk of their revenues from commercial real estate property taxes. They won't be enthused if companies start reducing office space. Some are even toying with the idea of raising taxes on at home workers.

Edited December 5, 2020 by AGR

[Harley Lover]

12 hours ago, AGR said:

 Some are even toying with the idea of raising taxes on at home workers.

 

Not questioning this at all - do you have any links or extra info on this?

[akirby]

57 minutes ago, Harley Lover said:

 

Not questioning this at all - do you have any links or extra info on this?

I believe businesses already pay taxes based on your primary work location whether it’s at home or an office.

[akirby]

57 minutes ago, Harley Lover said:

 

Not questioning this at all - do you have any links or extra info on this?

I believe businesses already pay taxes based on your primary work location whether it’s at home or an office.

[AGR]

Should you pay higher taxes because you work from home? - CNN

 

States are thinking about an additional tax on at-home workers | khou.com

[akirby]

43 minutes ago, AGR said:

Should you pay higher taxes because you work from home? - CNN

 

States are thinking about an additional tax on at-home workers | khou.com

Ridiculous.

[rperez817]

On 12/3/2020 at 2:34 PM, bzcat said:

The general consensus on autonomous vehicles from urban planners and people involved in transportation is that it will greatly worsen congestion in urban areas because people are selfish - when you remove the biggest determent from driving in urban areas (the need to find parking at your destination), you will encourage a lot more usage. So most urban planners believe regulation will be required to limit their access in favor of vehicles that are fully occupied. Mass transit is still the only logical way to move vast amount of people in urban environment because of physical space constrains. 

 

Automakers will have to work with urban planners to ensure that the ongoing revolution in the automotive industry focused on 100% electric vehicles, 100% autonomous vehicles, and mobility services doesn't worsen congestion. 

 

Ford Europe has done some mobility data analysis work in Cologne, London, and Valencia with what they call "City Engagement". One of their goals is reducing congestion. Don't know how extensively they work with urban planners in Europe, though. https://www.ford-mobility.eu/city-solutions/city-data

[slemke]

28 minutes ago, akirby said:

Ridiculous.

Agreed.  It goes with the proposal some time ago to tax employer subsidized cafeterias as an employee benefit.  Just another attempt at getting more money.

[akirby]

3 minutes ago, rperez817 said:

 the ongoing revolution in the automotive industry my mind focused on 100% electric vehicles, 100% autonomous vehicles

FTFY

[rmc523]

1 hour ago, akirby said:

Ridiculous.

 

They'll find a way to tax you no matter what.

[rperez817]

37 minutes ago, akirby said:

FTFY

?

Fortunately, "my mind" agrees with leaders in the global automotive industry.

[akirby]

1 hour ago, rperez817 said:

?

Fortunately, "my mind" agrees with leaders in the global automotive industry.

You mean these experts?

 

https://www.businessinsider.com/self-driving-cars-fully-autonomous-vehicles-future-prediction-timeline-2019-8

 

Quote

Experts say we're decades from fully autonomous cars. Here's why.

 

[Harley Lover]

4 hours ago, AGR said:

Should you pay higher taxes because you work from home? - CNN

 

States are thinking about an additional tax on at-home workers | khou.com

 

Wow. It's a brave new world <sarcasm>.

[jpd80]

4 hours ago, slemke said:

Agreed.  It goes with the proposal some time ago to tax employer subsidized cafeterias as an employee benefit.  Just another attempt at getting more money.

If you look at the reasons in the article, it’s to subside low paid workers who cannot work from home. That tax idea is an example of European socialism and something that many in Europe would sadly go along with.

 

Working at home may actually be the solution to the UK’s clogged roads, more people stay at home saves money for themselves and others. Rather than increasing taxes for work at home, the government should be encouraging it as a better way to do business.

 

My boss now works from home and rarely comes to the office, he now uses the three hours he previously spent commuting to do more actual work from home. That right there is an example of why AVs can be completely skipped thanks to work from home.

Edited December 5, 2020 by jpd80

[akirby]

5 minutes ago, jpd80 said:

If you look at the reasons in the article, it’s to subside low paid workers who cannot work from home.

 

That tax idea is an example of European socialism and something that many in Europe would sadly go along with.

If the jobs have moved then the workers need to move.  It’s no different than any other market change.  
 

This is akin to people suddenly going to more Chinese restaurants and less Mexican restaurants and the govt taxing the Chinese restaurant patrons and giving it to the Mexican restaurant workers.

[jpd80]

1 hour ago, akirby said:

If the jobs have moved then the workers need to move.  It’s no different than any other market change.  
 

This is akin to people suddenly going to more Chinese restaurants and less Mexican restaurants and the govt taxing the Chinese restaurant patrons and giving it to the Mexican restaurant workers.

Uh huh and imagine that you’re so indoctrinated that you’d go along with that for the good of the economy.

 

 

[AGR]

On 12/5/2020 at 3:03 PM, akirby said:

If the jobs have moved then the workers need to move.  It’s no different than any other market change.  
 

This is akin to people suddenly going to more Chinese restaurants and less Mexican restaurants and the govt taxing the Chinese restaurant patrons and giving it to the Mexican restaurant workers.

 

Your analogy is screwy. In the first place, this is a FORCED changed, not a market change. It was forced by a global pandemic. And many people were FORCED to work from home, even if they didn't necessarily want to do so. I'm pretty confident that once this is over, many things that people were forced to will be cast aside. They will want to go to restaurants, bars, theaters, stadiums/arenas, and just about every other public place. Heck, even shopping malls might make a bit of a comeback. And the vast majority who had to work from home will return to the office.  There will probably be more working from home, but few will want to do it fulltime, or even on a regular basis. I know, you've been doing it for years and you like it, but YOU'RE NOT EVERYONE!

Edited December 6, 2020 by AGR

[akirby]

1 hour ago, AGR said:

 

Your analogy is screwy. In the first place, this is a FORCED changed, not a market change. It was forced by a global pandemic. And many people were FORCED to work from home, even if they didn't necessarily want to do so. I'm pretty confident that once this is over, many things that people were forced to will be cast aside. They will want to go to restaurants, bars, theaters, stadiums/arenas, and just about every other public place. Heck, even shopping malls might make a bit of a comeback. And the vast majority who had to work from home will return to the office.  There will probably be more working from home, but few will want to do it fulltime, or even on a regular basis. I know, you've been doing it for years and you like it, but YOU'RE NOT EVERYONE!

Say I’m working from home but I still go out to my local restaurants for lunch every day.  You want to tax me on top of that?  How is that fair?  If it’s temporary due to the pandemic then give them unemployment or other govt assistance but don’t tax the workers.

 

And more people working from home has nothing to do with liking it.  It will save companies billions in real estate and other costs.  It will be forced for most people at least a few days a week unless you cannot work from home for some reason.

[ice-capades]

For a number of years now the younger demographics have been choosing to live and work in urban settings with many not even bothering to get a driver's license because they felt no need and instead relied on mass transit or other services. Now with Covid-19's impact, real estate prices in the suburbs are setting records due to the increased demand from those looking to relocate in the suburbs. With the experience of so much work being done remotely, companies are in many cases seeing the benefits of staff working remotely on a part or full-time basis and realizing that they can reduce their real estate commitments. I expect that a lot of the changes we're seeing will have a long term impact on how the workplace operates in the future. It'll be interesting to see what the situation is in a few years.  

[jpd80]

It's right that many should be challenging the idea of commuting to a central business district

to sit behind a desk all day and do work and then pile into cars, busses and trains to go home.

How much of that daily travel can be done away with, instead of AVs, skip the whole thing. 

 

Thanks to computers, many can have a better lifestyle and free up our roads to boot.

Edited December 7, 2020 by jpd80

[silvrsvt]

1 hour ago, ice-capades said:

For a number of years now the younger demographics have been choosing to live and work in urban settings with many not even bothering to get a driver's license because they felt no need and instead relied on mass transit or other services. Now with Covid-19's impact, real estate prices in the suburbs are setting records due to the increased demand from those looking to relocate in the suburbs. With the experience of so much work being done remotely, companies are in many cases seeing the benefits of staff working remotely on a part or full-time basis and realizing that they can reduce their real estate commitments. I expect that a lot of the changes we're seeing will have a long term impact on how the workplace operates in the future. It'll be interesting to see what the situation is in a few years.  

I live in those suburbs that are directly affected by the flight out of NYC and surrounding area and the apparent value of my house has gone up $75k according to Zillow in the four and half years I’ve been in my house. It’s nuts, but I’m not moving for at least another 20 years or so. 

I work for the DOD...they where doing babysteps towards teleworking prior to COVID-but it basically kicked the door down and left things wide open for telework now. It makes sense for the DOD-the building I work in is about 50 years old and I’m not sure when the last time it’s been updated-which it desperately needs. 
 

I can do about 90% of my job from home and since March, I’ve put maybe 2000 miles on my car. 
 

long term I think I’ll go back to mixed schedule-come into work for a day or two each week and work remotely the rest of it. 

[rperez817]

15 hours ago, akirby said:

And more people working from home has nothing to do with liking it.  It will save companies billions in real estate and other costs.  It will be forced for most people at least a few days a week unless you cannot work from home for some reason.

 

Employees love working from home/telework, surveys done by HR companies like Robert Half indicate that telework is one of the best recruiting incentives. The main reason that telework benefits businesses is the dramatic improvement in productivity and satisfaction for employees. Related to that is reduction in employee turnover. Real estate cost savings are icing on the cake.

 

Covid-19 actions simply accelerated a trend that has been going on more than 25 years, specifically that telework is the fastest growing "commuting" mode.

Edited December 7, 2020 by rperez817