Automotive News First Shift: Product hits and misses of 2020

[snooter]

The exterior of the escape is decent but leaning bland...the interior is just garbage compared to what else is out there...the idea of believing former ford car buyers would migrate to higher priced, dismal at best lower-end suv's seems to have been fanciful thought by ford marketing....the lower end offerings from ford are 10 steps below the competition and the increased price has placed those offerings squarely in what the hell is ford thinking territory...dam that product just reeks "pontiac"of the 80's..too much garbage-cheap-plastic in the interior was asnine thought

[slemke]

20 hours ago, akirby said:

Oops forgot the pic.

 

 

 

7 hours ago, AGR said:

 

Agreed. Different CUVs for different people. IF I were to buy a compact CUV, I would choose an Escape and wouldn't even consider a Bronco Sport. I'm not a fan of boxy styling. But they did away with the paddle shifters for 2021, ugh.

 

I concur, the Awd bronco sport and escape, particularly the hybrid, target different customers.  In their current forms, I would go with the Bronco Sport.  Make a few tweaks to the Escape (the sport appearance package is a good start) to give it a more aggressive sporty appearance (think Porsche) and my choice would change.  With a few tweaks, I think Ford could have two great choices in the pair.

 

As for a bronco sport hybrid, look at the city Mpg.  They are within 10% for an Awd BS and Fwd Escape.  A hybrid BS could achieve upper 30s city mpg and be a great commuter vehicle for those that prefer the boxy styling and Awd for winter conditions.  I think Ford needs to work on greater availability of escape hybrids first.

 

It will be interesting to see if Ford can produce enough F150 powerboosts to meet demand.  Considering the price difference between it and the escape, the F150 will get batteries first to meet demand.
 

[FordBuyer]

51 minutes ago, slemke said:

 

 

I concur, the Awd bronco sport and escape, particularly the hybrid, target different customers.  In their current forms, I would go with the Bronco Sport.  Make a few tweaks to the Escape (the sport appearance package is a good start) to give it a more aggressive sporty appearance (think Porsche) and my choice would change.  With a few tweaks, I think Ford could have two great choices in the pair.

 

As for a bronco sport hybrid, look at the city Mpg.  They are within 10% for an Awd BS and Fwd Escape.  A hybrid BS could achieve upper 30s city mpg and be a great commuter vehicle for those that prefer the boxy styling and Awd for winter conditions.  I think Ford needs to work on greater availability of escape hybrids first.

 

It will be interesting to see if Ford can produce enough F150 powerboosts to meet demand.  Considering the price difference between it and the escape, the F150 will get batteries first to meet demand.
 

It does seem that Ford has real hit on its hands with new F150 Powerboost, but I was wondering to what the production capabilities are. Hopefully they are greater than 25,000/year or so. But looking at Ford's track record on hybrid production, I don't see how it could be much more. 

[MadManMoon]

I'm biased, because I own one, but I think the complaints about the Escape's interior are exaggerated.  It also helps that I have a 2007 Shelby GT500 - talk about garbage interior!  The hard plastic all over the interior of that thing is dismal, and with its age now it's a rattling mess.

 

I'll also take the cleaner, simpler lines, both inside and out, on the Escape to the overwrought styling of most of its peers.

[chrisholland03]

I agree Ford whiffed on the Escape from a styling and interior perspective.  I'm betting the Bronco Sport will be where people go, and honestly they should put the hybrid powertrain there.

[T-dubz]

4 hours ago, snooter said:

The exterior of the escape is decent but leaning bland...the interior is just garbage compared to what else is out there...the idea of believing former ford car buyers would migrate to higher priced, dismal at best lower-end suv's seems to have been fanciful thought by ford marketing....the lower end offerings from ford are 10 steps below the competition and the increased price has placed those offerings squarely in what the hell is ford thinking territory...dam that product just reeks "pontiac"of the 80's..too much garbage-cheap-plastic in the interior was asnine thought

Here is some of the competitions interiors:

Nissan Rogue

Hyundai Tuscon

 

honda crv

 

Toyota rav4

 

chevrolet equinox

 

mazda cx5

 

Bronco sport

 

ford escape

 

 

The escape is one of the newer designs here but it already looks old to me. The only interior that is worse is the equinox. The screen on the rav4 looks cheap, but otherwise I like it’s rugged looking design. If Toyota fixed the screen with its giant bezel it would be a lot better but for now it’s only slightly better than the escape. The layout of the Honda isn’t exciting at all, but the materials are much better than the escapes, which give it a more premium feel. The Mazda has a very similar design to the escape but they managed to make an interior that virtually everyone praises. If mazda adds a bigger screen and digital dash, it will be close to the top for me. I like the design of the Tucson’s interior. I’m not sure how well it will work with all of those touch buttons though. The rogues interior surprised me. I think it’s the best looking of the bunch. I don’t really care for the bronco sports interior either. 

interior

1. Rogue

2. Tuscon

3. CX5

4. CRV

5. RAV4

6. Bronco Sport

7. Escape

8. Equinox

exterior

1. Bronco sport

2. CX5

3. Rav4

4. Rogue

5. crv

6. tuscon

7. escape

8. equinox

 

bronco sport is the best looking of the bunch on the exterior. 2 through 4 could really be switched in any order depending on trim. The rav4 trd off road and xse hybrid trims look really good, but the lower trims are kinda boring. The rogue looks good in pictures and has the boxier shape I like, but I’m not a fan of nissans design language so I’d have to see that new front in person. Crv is the appliance you’d expect it to be and puts it in the middle of the pack. If the Tuscon toned down all the edges, it would look a lot better. Like the crv, the escape has appliance looks. There’s nothing offensive about it, but there’s nothing that makes me want to buy it either. It also looks like it’s smiling which I don’t care for and it’s a bit dated on the exterior since it’s using design elements that have been around since 2013 on other ford’s. The equinox is just garbage all around.

Edited December 31, 2020 by T-dubz

[FordBuyer]

35 minutes ago, chrisholland03 said:

I agree Ford whiffed on the Escape from a styling and interior perspective.  I'm betting the Bronco Sport will be where people go, and honestly they should put the hybrid powertrain there.

I own a 2020 Escape with premium package, having come from a Limited Crosstrek, and I would rate the interiors overall even in quality and design. Certainly not a "whiff" or "garbage." Not even close. I've also seen the BS up close and I see a very close resemblance to my Escape. Same switch gear and steering wheel minus the bucking Bronco. Similar console and design themes. Interior on BS plays a little more with color and trims, but materials I bet are the same. I hope the BS is a huge success, and I like it, but still very happy with my Escape. In fact, I would still buy it again today as the Escape offers so much more value for the money when you add in the incentives on 2020 Escape and great inventory. 

[FordBuyer]

16 minutes ago, T-dubz said:

Here is some of the competitions interiors:

Nissan Rogue

Hyundai Tuscon

 

honda crv

 

Toyota rav4

 

chevrolet equinox

 

mazda cx5

 

Bronco sport

 

ford escape

 

 

The escape is one of the newer designs here but it already looks old to me. The only interior that is worse is the equinox. The screen on the rav4 looks cheap, but otherwise I like it’s rugged looking design. If Toyota fixed the screen with its giant bezel it would be a lot better but for now it’s only slightly better than the escape. The layout of the Honda isn’t exciting at all, but the materials are much better than the escapes, which give it a more premium feel. The Mazda has a very similar design to the escape but they managed to make an interior that virtually everyone praises. If mazda adds a bigger screen and digital dash, it will be close to the top for me. I like the design of the Tucson’s interior. I’m not sure how well it will work with all of those touch buttons though. The rogues interior surprised me. I think it’s the best looking of the bunch. I don’t really care for the bronco sports interior either. 

interior

1. Rogue

2. Tuscon

3. CX5

4. CRV

5. RAV4

6. Bronco Sport

7. Escape

8. Equinox

exterior

1. Bronco sport

2. CX5

3. Rav4

4. Rogue

5. crv

6. tuscon

7. escape

8. equinox

 

bronco sport is the best looking of the bunch on the exterior. 2 through 4 could really be switched in any order depending on trim. The rav4 trd off road and xse hybrid trims look really good, but the lower trims are kinda boring. The rogue looks good in pictures and has the boxier shape I like, but I’m not a fan of nissans design language so I’d have to see that new front in person. Crv is the appliance you’d expect it to be and puts it in the middle of the pack. If the Tuscon toned down all the edges, it would look a lot better. Like the crv, the escape has appliance looks. There’s nothing offensive about it, but there’s nothing that makes me want to buy it either. It also looks like it’s smiling which I don’t care for and it’s a bit dated on the exterior since it’s using design elements that have been around since 2013 on other ford’s. The equinox is just garbage all around.

Nice job. However, it really is all about personal perspective. IMO, the HRV has the worst interior on your list. Info screen has be one very important and  CX 5 is useless and CRV is next to useless. The system on my Crosstrek was terrible compared to my Escape. So I think you need to do a rearrangement of your rankings. 

 

Having lived with my 2020 Escape for over 8 months now, my only complaints are the cheap looking door cards, no auto dimming mirror or fog lights, and no one up on driver side power window on $32,000 vehicle. Ths vehicle looks great on the outside and inside otherwise. Great tricoat, metallic paint job that pops with black and piano black trim and 19 inch alloy wheels and attractive, premium sandstone interior. 

[rmc523]

28 minutes ago, FordBuyer said:

Nice job. However, it really is all about personal perspective. IMO, the HRV has the worst interior on your list. Info screen has be one very important and  CX 5 is useless and CRV is next to useless. The system on my Crosstrek was terrible compared to my Escape. So I think you need to do a rearrangement of your rankings. 

 

Having lived with my 2020 Escape for over 8 months now, my only complaints are the cheap looking door cards, no auto dimming mirror or fog lights, and no one up on driver side power window on $32,000 vehicle. Ths vehicle looks great on the outside and inside otherwise. Great tricoat, metallic paint job that pops with black and piano black trim and 19 inch alloy wheels and attractive, premium sandstone interior. 

 

I'm sorry.  I regret to inform you that you're not allowed to like your Escape.  It's a dumpster fire piece of garbage - the internet and reviewers said so.

Edited December 31, 2020 by rmc523

[T-dubz]

14 minutes ago, FordBuyer said:

Nice job. However, it really is all about personal perspective. IMO, the HRV has the worst interior on your list. Info screen has be one very important and  CX 5 is useless and CRV is next to useless. The system on my Crosstrek was terrible compared to my Escape. So I think you need to do a rearrangement of your rankings. 

 

Having lived with my 2020 Escape for over 8 months now, my only complaints are the cheap looking door cards, no auto dimming mirror or fog lights, and no one up on driver side power window on $32,000 vehicle. Ths vehicle looks great on the outside and inside otherwise. Great tricoat, metallic paint job that pops with black and piano black trim and 19 inch alloy wheels and attractive, premium sandstone interior. 

Yep, all personal opinion there. I think the crv looks like a mini van interior but it has really good materials. Everything was soft touch. The crv, cx5 and equinox are also fairly old vehicles now, yet they still stack up well against the brand new escape. Think of what the difference will be when they get new interiors. 

The industry is heading towards giant screens in all vehicles now, I think ford should take this opportunity to be a leader in the segment and put the Mach e’s screen in the escape. I think that would drastically change people’s perception of the interior. Then all you need to do is change the front clip and you have a vehicle that’s at the top of its class. Using some of the Mach e’s visual tricks to make it more coupe like would help too.

 

[rperez817]

54 minutes ago, T-dubz said:

The escape is one of the newer designs here but it already looks old to me. The only interior that is worse is the equinox. The screen on the rav4 looks cheap, but otherwise I like it’s rugged looking design. If Toyota fixed the screen with its giant bezel it would be a lot better but for now it’s only slightly better than the escape. The layout of the Honda isn’t exciting at all, but the materials are much better than the escapes, which give it a more premium feel. The Mazda has a very similar design to the escape but they managed to make an interior that virtually everyone praises. If mazda adds a bigger screen and digital dash, it will be close to the top for me. I like the design of the Tucson’s interior. I’m not sure how well it will work with all of those touch buttons though. The rogues interior surprised me. I think it’s the best looking of the bunch. I don’t really care for the bronco sports interior either. 

interior

1. Rogue

2. Tuscon

3. CX5

4. CRV

5. RAV4

6. Bronco Sport

7. Escape

8. Equinox

 

Thank you for your rankings T-dubz sir. Chinese Ford Escape has a nicer interior design (and probably nicer material quality too) compared to the North American Escape. I'd say the Chinese Escape interior would be #4 or even higher in your rankings.

 

[rperez817]

6 minutes ago, rmc523 said:

I'm sorry.  I regret to inform you that you're not allowed to like your Escape.  It's a dumpster fire piece of garbage - the internet and reviewers said so.

 

Good one rmc523 sir. ?

 

In all seriousness, people who actually purchased or leased a 2020 Escape like FordBuyer seem to be satisfied with the vehicle. Escape actually tied Mazda CX-5 for first place among Compact SUV in this year's J.D. Power APEAL study, which measures "an owner’s emotional attachment to their new vehicle."

 

The problem for Ford, and why Automotive News said Escape is a "miss", is that fewer customers in the market for a compact crossover are choosing an Escape nowadays. Sales are down over 60,000 units in first 3 quarters of 2020 compared to the same period in 2019, and it's not all due to the decline in fleet sales. Clearly, even some Ford loyalists who previously owned a Ford passenger car are looking elsewhere. 

 

[FordBuyer]

32 minutes ago, T-dubz said:

Yep, all personal opinion there. I think the crv looks like a mini van interior but it has really good materials. Everything was soft touch. The crv, cx5 and equinox are also fairly old vehicles now, yet they still stack up well against the brand new escape. Think of what the difference will be when they get new interiors. 

The industry is heading towards giant screens in all vehicles now, I think ford should take this opportunity to be a leader in the segment and put the Mach e’s screen in the escape. I think that would drastically change people’s perception of the interior. Then all you need to do is change the front clip and you have a vehicle that’s at the top of its class. Using some of the Mach e’s visual tricks to make it more coupe like would help too.

 

Again, perspective.....what's most important to user as far as info screen goes. For me, intuitiveness comes first. That is connected to safety and usability.

 

Other important considerations are placement again connected to safety. Escape screen sits up into drivers line of vision and is horizontal which is good. A 10 inch horizontal screen would be better, but the 8 inch screen works fine. Intuitiveness is great and is a real positive. Resolution is good, and response is average to good. Sometimes a little laggy. Anything bigger than 10 inches would be overkill and maybe even more distracting.

 

And don't forget on hybrid and Titanium instrument panel is 12 inch digital screen that can be changed with steering wheel switch. That is enough going on....20 inches of digital screens. Kind of scary to think on screens going blank in 6 years or so of use.

[FordBuyer]

36 minutes ago, rperez817 said:

 

Good one rmc523 sir. ?

 

In all seriousness, people who actually purchased or leased a 2020 Escape like FordBuyer seem to be satisfied with the vehicle. Escape actually tied Mazda CX-5 for first place among Compact SUV in this year's J.D. Power APEAL study, which measures "an owner’s emotional attachment to their new vehicle."

 

The problem for Ford, and why Automotive News said Escape is a "miss", is that fewer customers in the market for a compact crossover are choosing an Escape nowadays. Sales are down over 60,000 units in first 3 quarters of 2020 compared to the same period in 2019, and it's not all due to the decline in fleet sales. Clearly, even some Ford loyalists who previously owned a Ford passenger car are looking elsewhere. 

 

I would say the number 1 reason Escape saled are down is reduced fleet sales. The previous generation Escape did very well with flsrt buyers. The Pandemic has cratered fleet sales. And it certainly does look like previous lease Escape buyers are considering competitor vehicles as rperez has shown. But lower fleet sales has hurt Escape sales. The Escape S is basically a fleet special. And I doubt if the big car rental outfits are buying many new vehicles as Hertz entered bankruptcy.

[bzcat]

Escape interior design is fine. It's a matter of taste and highly subjective.

 

It is really the quality of material that I think Ford can do better. If you drive the CX-5 and Escape back to back, you will really feel the quality difference. Everything you touch in the Mazda feels like it belongs in a more expensive car. Everything you touch in the Ford feels like it belongs in a cheaper car. Also, whether you like it or not, the size of the screen as become an important factor in shopping comparison. It is a key metric that people consider now when buying new vehicles and Ford should have put in a larger screen in the Escape. This is an easy fix - just look at the Chinese Escape interior.

 

The other thing that Ford should address with a mid cycle update is the exterior appearance. The car just look too cheap with too much black plastic. Why is the rear bumper black matte plastic? What year is this? The fancier looking wheels in the new appearance packages will help too but overall, the US spec Escape needs better detailing. More chrome or aluminium in appropriate places. More painted parts. More cohesive exterior themes. Again, this is pretty easy fix - just look at the Kuga ST-Line and Vignale exterior in Europe or the Chinese Escape - both much expensive-looking car than the US-spec Escape. 

 

And lastly, I sound like a broken record but Ford should really push the hybrid and PHEV. Survey after survey shows that people are very pre-disposed to look at hybrid and PHEV when replacing their current ICE only cars. Ford made a really big mistake 8 years ago killing the Escape hybrid and stopping all the momentum the nameplate had built up with hybrid shoppers. It is still in my opinion, one of the bigger blunder under Alan Mulally. Ford should do everything it can to restore Escape as the "go to" choice for hybrid CUV. Honda for some reason also whiffed and did not bring over the CR-V hybrid initially so this allowed Toyota to quitely dominate the segment. 

 

 

Edited December 31, 2020 by bzcat

[Chrisgb]

1 hour ago, T-dubz said:

1 hour ago, T-dubz said:

Yep, all personal opinion there. I think the crv looks like a mini van interior but it has really good materials. Everything was soft touch. The crv, cx5 and equinox are also fairly old vehicles now, yet they still stack up well against the brand new escape. Think of what the difference will be when they get new interiors. 

The industry is heading towards giant screens in all vehicles now, I think ford should take this opportunity to be a leader in the segment and put the Mach e’s screen in the escape. I think that would drastically change people’s perception of the interior. Then all you need to do is change the front clip and you have a vehicle that’s at the top of its class. Using some of the Mach e’s visual tricks to make it more coupe like would help too.

 

Better yet, with OLED technology it should be possible to replace the windshield with a panoramic screen using multiple cameras on all sides.You could have a main frontal view, open separate windows for the sides and rear. With Sync 5 put all your smartphone apps in other windows. Put the news up as a crawl along the bottom of the windshield, and run a 4k movie on the passenger side. As you drive by various businesses, popups could appear right on the screen alerting you to fast food or coffee deals, what's on sale at Home Depot, etc. Everything's fine. We will have Co-Pilot 360 Plus Ultra Elite Iridium Technology to actually pilot the car.

 

For now, can we have a Screen Delete option?

 

 

Edited December 31, 2020 by Chrisgb
grammar & form fixes

[fuzzymoomoo]

6 hours ago, slemke said:

 

It will be interesting to see if Ford can produce enough F150 powerboosts to meet demand.  Considering the price difference between it and the escape, the F150 will get batteries first to meet demand.

 Pretty sure they don't use the same battery 

[akirby]

1 hour ago, fuzzymoomoo said:

 Pretty sure they don't use the same battery 

I bet they use the same cells.

[AGR]

I like Mazdas (generally, the only Japanese or Korean vehicles I would even consider), but the user interface for their screens was copied from BMW. No thanks, I'll take a touchscreen please. I've never sat in one, but the picture of the Equinox interior looks fine to me. If the materials are anything like the those in the Malibu I rented last summer(2019), the 'nox interior would be AOK. I haven't sat in either Ford yet either, but my opinion on those might be a bit biased.

As for the rest, see the comment in parenthesis...

[slemke]

15 hours ago, akirby said:

I bet they use the same cells.

Nailed it.  I was referring to the individual battery cells needed to make the battery pack when I said batteries.  I have no idea how many Ford plans on making as I have not seen any information in the business news or press releases.  I think the F150 could have used a larger battery pack, particularly for the on board generator.  But, I suspect the pack was limited in size and capability to extend the limited availability of cells.  Lower cost was just icing on the cake.  Maybe we’ll see a plug-in version in a year or two along with the electric only version.

[tbone]

On 12/31/2020 at 10:33 AM, MadManMoon said:

I'm biased, because I own one, but I think the complaints about the Escape's interior are exaggerated.  It also helps that I have a 2007 Shelby GT500 - talk about garbage interior!  The hard plastic all over the interior of that thing is dismal, and with its age now it's a rattling mess.

 

I'll also take the cleaner, simpler lines, both inside and out, on the Escape to the overwrought styling of most of its peers.

I agree with you on the exaggeration. We bought an Escape for our daughter and she really likes it.  The interior is quiet contrary to a previous comment above and there isn’t a bunch of hard plastic all over.  The exterior is ok to me but she says she has had positive comments about it, mostly comparing it to the Porches. Is it a perfect vehicle, no, and it can be better. However, it is far from the POS Implied in these forums.  
 

As an aside,  I was with some friends at a local Ford dealer and they had the first Bronco Sport I’ve seen in person. My  friends thought it was the actual Bronco, and I had to explain the situation to them.  Needless to say they weren’t impressed with the Sport so not everyone appreciates the upright boxy look of the Bronco.  
 

It may have taken longer than it should, but I think Ford’s two vehicle approach to this segment will likely pay off in the long run.  Perhaps a little something for everyone.  

[FordBuyer]

15 hours ago, tbone said:

I agree with you on the exaggeration. We bought an Escape for our daughter and she really likes it.  The interior is quiet contrary to a previous comment above and there isn’t a bunch of hard plastic all over.  The exterior is ok to me but she says she has had positive comments about it, mostly comparing it to the Porches. Is it a perfect vehicle, no, and it can be better. However, it is far from the POS Implied in these forums.  
 

As an aside,  I was with some friends at a local Ford dealer and they had the first Bronco Sport I’ve seen in person. My  friends thought it was the actual Bronco, and I had to explain the situation to them.  Needless to say they weren’t impressed with the Sport so not everyone appreciates the upright boxy look of the Bronco.  
 

It may have taken longer than it should, but I think Ford’s two vehicle approach to this segment will likely pay off in the long run.  Perhaps a little something for everyone.  

Yep, I think it is a good strategy in the compact CUV segment. Cover all the bases. Look for other auto companies to copy. Especially GM as buyers flock to the apocalyptic type vehicles. 

[CKNSLS]

On 12/31/2020 at 11:25 AM, rperez817 said:

 

Good one rmc523 sir. ?

 

In all seriousness, people who actually purchased or leased a 2020 Escape like FordBuyer seem to be satisfied with the vehicle. Escape actually tied Mazda CX-5 for first place among Compact SUV in this year's J.D. Power APEAL study, which measures "an owner’s emotional attachment to their new vehicle."

 

The problem for Ford, and why Automotive News said Escape is a "miss", is that fewer customers in the market for a compact crossover are choosing an Escape nowadays. Sales are down over 60,000 units in first 3 quarters of 2020 compared to the same period in 2019, and it's not all due to the decline in fleet sales. Clearly, even some Ford loyalists who previously owned a Ford passenger car are looking elsewhere. 

 

The name "Fordbuyer" kinda sums it all up....doesn't it?

[FordBuyer]

1 hour ago, CKNSLS said:

The name "Fordbuyer" kinda sums it all up....doesn't it?

Guess what, I used to own up to 9 months ago a SUBARU Crosstrek and a Porsche Boxster. And I road tested and researched the RAV4, CRV, and CX-5 before buying the Escape SE Sport Hybrid with premium package and optional paint job. Car and Driver picked the Escape hybrid over the RAV hybrid and lots of complaints about CRV hybrid. And CX-5 fuel mileage is half of my hybrids fuel mileage. Escape WON.

[rperez817]

On 1/2/2021 at 6:03 PM, FordBuyer said:

Car and Driver picked the Escape hybrid over the RAV hybrid and lots of complaints about CRV hybrid.

 

Consumer Reports gave Escape SE Sport Hybrid a higher road test score than either RAV4 XLE Hybrid or CR-V EX Hybrid.

• Escape SE Sport Hybrid, 82 out of 100
• CR-V EX Hybrid, 80 out of 100
• RAV4 XLE Hybrid, 76 out of 100

Escape had the most improvement from choosing the hybrid powertrain. CR-V actually rated worse with its hybrid setup compared to the regular non-hybrid version.