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The New 6.8L V8 Thread


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2 hours ago, jpd80 said:

The 6.2 is no longer listed for E350 and has been effectively replaced by 300 hp and 350 hp 7.3 V8,

so I’m thinking  that will also happen in SD after the 6.2 is fully withdrawn.

I could've sworn the E-Series had the 6.2 listed when I looked the other day, but I just checked, and sure enough, it's just the two 7.3 variants. I must've been looking at the Chassis Cab specs, which still show the 6.2.

 

Funny thing, though--if you look at the Specifications for the F-450 Chassis Cab, it lists the 6.2, but with a note that says "F-350 only."

 

"Sure, you can get a 6.2 in an F-450, as long as it's an F-350."

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16 minutes ago, SoonerLS said:

I could've sworn the E-Series had the 6.2 listed when I looked the other day, but I just checked, and sure enough, it's just the two 7.3 variants. I must've been looking at the Chassis Cab specs, which still show the 6.2.

 

Funny thing, though--if you look at the Specifications for the F-450 Chassis Cab, it lists the 6.2, but with a note that says "F-350 only."

 

"Sure, you can get a 6.2 in an F-450, as long as it's an F-350."

While the 6.2 may be listed for certain applications, it’s clear that  the 7.3 is making it redundant in the eyes of buyers.

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15 hours ago, jpd80 said:

The 6.2 is no longer listed for E350 and has been effectively replaced by 300 hp and 350 hp 7.3 V8,

so I’m thinking  that will also happen in SD after the 6.2 is fully withdrawn.

 

 The 6.8 will be more than just another engine with half a litre less than the 7.3, it indicates much

more in the way a shorter stroke performance engine would be presented, still with decent capacity

but with much better high rpm breathing.

 

 

Are you saying that the 6.8 is a destroked 7.3 with the same bore size?

 

I hope this is the case from a performance standpoint. 
 

I don’t think it’s very likely as the automotive world goes headlong into electrification but an even smaller version say in the 5.8 range with an aluminum block and lower deck height but with the big bore would be a phenomenal engine for tinkerers. 
 

Just dreaming sorry......

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I don't think the 6.8L will end up in the Super Duty.  No need for it, there is an 'economy' version of the 7.3L for the E series, why not replace the 6.2L with that?

 

My guess is if the 6.8L sees production, it will be an aluminum block high performance limited edition engine for the F-150 and maybe the Mustang.

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3 hours ago, Stray Kat said:

Are you saying that the 6.8 is a destroked 7.3 with the same bore size?

 

I hope this is the case from a performance standpoint. 
 

I don’t think it’s very likely as the automotive world goes headlong into electrification but an even smaller version say in the 5.8 range with an aluminum block and lower deck height but with the big bore would be a phenomenal engine for tinkerers. 
 

Just dreaming sorry......

I guess I’m sayin that the 6.8 has to be more than a slightly smaller capacity 7.3,

if Ford is going to that effort, there must surely be lots of other changes to go along with that.

Edited by jpd80
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3 hours ago, Stray Kat said:

Are you saying that the 6.8 is a destroked 7.3 with the same bore size?

 

I hope this is the case from a performance standpoint. 
 

I don’t think it’s very likely as the automotive world goes headlong into electrification but an even smaller version say in the 5.8 range with an aluminum block and lower deck height but with the big bore would be a phenomenal engine for tinkerers. 
 

Just dreaming sorry......

 

More than likely.  

 

Take the 7.3s 4.22in bore diameter combined with the 6.2s 3.74in stroke and you get a 418ci 6.8. 

Godzilla and Boss share bore spacing.   

 

Edited by ESP08
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1 hour ago, ESP08 said:

 

More than likely.  

 

Take the 7.3s 4.22in bore diameter combined with the 6.2s 3.74in stroke and you get a 418ci 6.8. 

Godzilla and Boss share bore spacing.   

 

And that’s one of the possibilities because we know that Ford loves to reuse engines

when it can (6.8 V10 in MD). aAso all the development work that went into the 7.0 Boss

might be an easy solution / money already spent.

 

The way Ford can mix and match parts these days, it could do anything on either architecture.

Edited by jpd80
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3 hours ago, jpd80 said:

And that’s one of the possibilities because we know that Ford loves to reuse engines

when it can (6.8 V10 in MD). aAso all the development work that went into the 7.0 Boss

might be an easy solution / money already spent.

 

The way Ford can mix and match parts these days, it could do anything on either architecture.

 

I am still holding out hope the 6.8 is an all aluminum variation of the old 777 Boss

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16 minutes ago, ESP08 said:

 

I am still holding out hope the 6.8 is an all aluminum variation of the old 777 Boss

Hey, it may well be, all the Boss would need is Siamese bores like the 7.3, either iron or aluminium.

if indeed the 6.8 is the replacement for the 5.2, an alloy block for lighter weigh would be justifiable.

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On 6/21/2021 at 10:57 PM, SoonerLS said:

Why? The 7.3's numbers aren't a quantum leap over the Coyote, and they're not quite on par with the EB35, so if it's a Godzilla offshoot, even accounting for the different testing standards, tuning, etc, for the Super Duties, the 6.8 is going to be smack in the middle of no man's land. 

I figure the 7.3 will be for the super duty only.It would be nice for them to put that in the next COBRA!!32 valve monster,but the 6.8 v8 would do well in the autos that I talked about.Why not have a big v8 choice.

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8 hours ago, 7Mary3 said:

I don't think the 6.8L will end up in the Super Duty.  No need for it, there is an 'economy' version of the 7.3L for the E series, why not replace the 6.2L with that?

 

My guess is if the 6.8L sees production, it will be an aluminum block high performance limited edition engine for the F-150 and maybe the Mustang.

I agree!

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10 hours ago, mustang let back said:

I figure the 7.3 will be for the super duty only.It would be nice for them to put that in the next COBRA!!32 valve monster,but the 6.8 v8 would do well in the autos that I talked about.Why not have a big v8 choice.

It depends on what the 6.8 turns out to be. If, as some here have speculated, it's going to be a performance mill, yeah, it's a no-brainer. If, however, it's just an "economy" 7.3 to replace the 6.2 in the Super Duties, that's not really going to be an improvement over the Coyote (or the 5.2), so there'd be no point to it as a "big v8 choice."

Edited by SoonerLS
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On 6/25/2021 at 7:27 AM, SoonerLS said:

It depends on what the 6.8 turns out to be. If, as some here have speculated, it's going to be a performance mill, yeah, it's a no-brainer. If, however, it's just an "economy" 7.3 to replace the 6.2 in the Super Duties, that's not really going to be an improvement over the Coyote (or the 5.2), so there'd be no point to it as a "big v8 choice."

 

Other than the fact that it will be a more compact design which allows fitment into smaller engine bays and potentially lighter vehicles that don't need the space requirements of a DOHC V8. If the 6.8 also gets a shorter deck height block due to a shorter stroke that also makes it even smaller/lighter than a 7.3.

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10 hours ago, blksn8k2 said:

 

Other than the fact that it will be a more compact design which allows fitment into smaller engine bays and potentially lighter vehicles that don't need the space requirements of a DOHC V8. If the 6.8 also gets a shorter deck height block due to a shorter stroke that also makes it even smaller/lighter than a 7.3.

The Coyote already fits in the Mustang and F-150, so where are you anticipating them using it? I'm pretty sure the engine bay isn't why the Coyote isn't in the F-150-based Expedition/Navigator, which pretty much only leaves Explorer and Aviator. I wouldn't argue against a return of a V8 Explorer/Aviator, but I think their future is pretty solidly electrified, so I wouldn't hold my breath on that. Maybe a V8 PIU makes some sense (give it a blower and really make it the "last of the V8 Interceptors"), but that seems like too tiny of a niche for Ford to make a business case for it.

 

Maybe you could make a case for a V8 Ranger and/or Bronco, but shortening the deck height won't shorten it front-to-back, which is going to be the limiting factor there.
 

There is the Transit, but that's in the commercial lineup, which falls under the "makes a lot of sense for the Super Duty" category (and even then I'm not sure it'd work--Transit's engine bay is kind of shallow).

 

Even if you go to an aluminum block with a shorter deck height, at best you're looking at weight parity with the Coyote, so that just seems like a wash.

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12 hours ago, SoonerLS said:

Even if you go to an aluminum block with a shorter deck height, at best you're looking at weight parity with the Coyote, so that just seems like a wash.

 

A 6.8 would also be a lot simpler and probably cheaper to make than a Coyote. Being pushrod, things like cylinder deactivation is easier as well. A 6.8 hybrid in a Super Duty would make a lot of sense.

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After the 6.2 was put into production at Romeo engine plant, Roush Engineering did a 460 cubic inch version as a development project. Same bore centers with a unique cylinder head design.

It produced over 850 hp on the engine dyno naturally asperated!

If the 6.8 is a performance engine, maybe it’s a derivation of this 460 development engine?There is a u tube video on this engine on the dyno. The valve covers look somewhat wider than a production 6.2 V8 SOC!

edselford

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44 minutes ago, edselford said:

After the 6.2 was put into production at Romeo engine plant, Roush Engineering did a 460 cubic inch version as a development project. Same bore centers with a unique cylinder head design.

It produced over 850 hp on the engine dyno naturally asperated!

If the 6.8 is a performance engine, maybe it’s a derivation of this 460 development engine?There is a u tube video on this engine on the dyno. The valve covers look somewhat wider than a production 6.2 V8 SOC!

edselford

That’s the thing, give the 6.2 a Siamese bore and bigger pistons like the 7.3 and it becomes a 6.8 V8.

Anything is possible from there…..

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3 hours ago, NLPRacing said:

 

A 6.8 would also be a lot simpler and probably cheaper to make than a Coyote. Being pushrod, things like cylinder deactivation is easier as well. A 6.8 hybrid in a Super Duty would make a lot of sense.

 

They've already made the investment in cylinder deactivation for Coyote though, and given the widespread problems with DoD/AFM OHV lifters the two-piece OHC follower method may likely being the more reliable implementation of cylinder deactivation in the long run.  

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1 hour ago, edselford said:

After the 6.2 was put into production at Romeo engine plant, Roush Engineering did a 460 cubic inch version as a development project. Same bore centers with a unique cylinder head design.

It produced over 850 hp on the engine dyno naturally asperated!

If the 6.8 is a performance engine, maybe it’s a derivation of this 460 development engine?There is a u tube video on this engine on the dyno. The valve covers look somewhat wider than a production 6.2 V8 SOC!

edselford

 

That was the 777, the cylinder heads were modified "production-intent" Boss heads. 

The valve covers only looked wider because of their styling; that engine definitely had the production Boss SOHC rocker arm arrangement.

 

Good article on it here:  https://www.hagerty.com/media/automotive-history/how-a-secret-21st-century-7-liter-ford-v-8-reached-9000-rpm/

 

The 6.2 is such a great foundation for a performance engine it's a damn shame Ford is letting it die without giving it a fair shake. 

 

Just look at those cylinder heads, with larger valves and ports allowed by Godzilla's 4.22 bore you have a legitimate performance engine: 

 

Boss621.JPG

Boss622.JPG

Boss623.JPG

Edited by ESP08
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8 hours ago, NLPRacing said:

 

A 6.8 would also be a lot simpler and probably cheaper to make than a Coyote. Being pushrod, things like cylinder deactivation is easier as well. A 6.8 hybrid in a Super Duty would make a lot of sense.

Simpler? Possibly; it depends on the jiggery-pokery required for it to meet emissions and fuel economy in the classes where the Coyote is used.

 

The per-unit cost might be cheaper if they were both starting from go, but the Coyote has a decade-long head start in recovering its development and certification costs. The Coyote is also a known quantity, having gone through that decade of production and ongoing refinement. 
 

At this late stage in ICE development, I just don't see Ford dropping a bundle to replace the Coyote. If it's a baby Godzilla, it makes a lot of sense in the commercial lineup (I really like the Super Duty Hybrid scenario), and if it's a performance mill it makes sense as a halo vehicle powerplant, but I don't think either of those lend themselves to a mainstream V8 replacement. But hey, I've been wrong before...

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8 hours ago, blksn8k2 said:

I think an aluminum block pushrod 6.8 would make great competition for the LS in the aftermarket as well. There's a decent market there and Ford is not that competitive with the overly complex and wide Coyote.

Looking at the Ford Performance crate engines, I can certainly see them making it available, whether it's a baby Godzilla or a performance mill--heck, the Godzilla is first on the crate engine page right now.

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  • 4 weeks later...
On 6/30/2021 at 11:11 AM, SoonerLS said:

Simpler? Possibly; it depends on the jiggery-pokery required for it to meet emissions and fuel economy in the classes where the Coyote is used.

 

The per-unit cost might be cheaper if they were both starting from go, but the Coyote has a decade-long head start in recovering its development and certification costs. The Coyote is also a known quantity, having gone through that decade of production and ongoing refinement. 
 

At this late stage in ICE development, I just don't see Ford dropping a bundle to replace the Coyote. If it's a baby Godzilla, it makes a lot of sense in the commercial lineup (I really like the Super Duty Hybrid scenario), and if it's a performance mill it makes sense as a halo vehicle powerplant, but I don't think either of those lend themselves to a mainstream V8 replacement. But hey, I've been wrong before...

Replace Coyote? No but to replace the 5.2 V8 engine line? Heck yeah?

Fun fact,

The Coyote was a clever development of the earlier 4.6 MOD and

the 5.2 was a clever reuse and extension of the 5.0 Cammer MOD,

so I suspect that the 6.8 will be a clever rework of the 6.2 Boss.

 

The 6.8 is intended to be the new special engine line that replaces the

S/C 5.2 special production line when it  ends late next year. 

Edited by jpd80
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