ESP08 Posted August 16, 2021 Share Posted August 16, 2021 On 8/14/2021 at 5:25 AM, Stray Kat said: Okay gang back to the subject at hand. As we enter the twilight phase of ICE engines as the most common motive force for consumer vehicles I say a new big inch V8 hot on the heels of an even bigger inch brand new V8 is quite amazing. Surely these two engines will serve truck duty. How else could their existence be justified? Anyhow word on the street is that the 6.8 is related to the 7.3 in design. That’s really a no brainer anyhow. I think Ford realizes that the truck buying public doesn’t really care how their valves are actuated. I have no way of knowing, so I can only speculate that some test pours and test runs of this new size engine are beginning. They must be based on the timeline of information that has been shared with the public so far. My own personal feelings are that both the 6.8 and 7.3 will serve primarily in trucks and vans with the 6.8 possibly being used in a Mustang and F150. I think the 6.8 will be an aluminum block and I wouldn’t doubt a slightly bigger sleeve for the Mustang bringing it to 429 cubic inches to coincide with the launch of the S650 Mustang. That ☝️one feat will suck all the oxygen away from the Corvette and the aging Challenger Hellcats. Americans love muscle cars and many people will see a 429” Mustang as their last chance to buy one. If I’m correct I predict that Ford will not be able to keep up with demand. It almost surely would be a sales mega success. I honestly don't think the 6.8 will see the light of day. Maybe if Trump stayed in office... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
7Mary3 Posted August 16, 2021 Share Posted August 16, 2021 5 hours ago, ESP08 said: I honestly don't think the 6.8 will see the light of day. Maybe if Trump stayed in office... I hate to admit it seems unlikely to me too. Particularly if vehicles like the new Bronco prove to be popular and profitable, as they will affect CAFE. A 6.8L would have to be a very low production item if offered in the Mustang or F-150. Then again, BEV's like the Mach E could tip the balance enough to make the 6.8L possible for those vehicles. Hard to say at this point..... Just a thought, what if the 6.8L is a replacement for the 7.3L? Direct injection, modulated displacement, and a slightly smaller displacement could add up to an engine with the same or better output while delivering better fuel economy and lower emissions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captainp4 Posted August 16, 2021 Share Posted August 16, 2021 5 hours ago, 7Mary3 said: I hate to admit it seems unlikely to me too. Particularly if vehicles like the new Bronco prove to be popular and profitable, as they will affect CAFE. A 6.8L would have to be a very low production item if offered in the Mustang or F-150. Then again, BEV's like the Mach E could tip the balance enough to make the 6.8L possible for those vehicles. Hard to say at this point..... Just a thought, what if the 6.8L is a replacement for the 7.3L? Direct injection, modulated displacement, and a slightly smaller displacement could add up to an engine with the same or better output while delivering better fuel economy and lower emissions. They made an awful big stink about 7.3 being the "ideal" displacement for HD trucks for them to shrink it to 6.8 that quickly 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
7Mary3 Posted August 17, 2021 Share Posted August 17, 2021 4 hours ago, Captainp4 said: They made an awful big stink about 7.3 being the "ideal" displacement for HD trucks for them to shrink it to 6.8 that quickly Yes they did, but that was based on port fuel injection with a 10.5 compression ratio. Direct injection will allow a higher compression ratio. Still the 6.8L as a replacement for the 7.3L in truck applications is just a guess on my part. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captainp4 Posted August 17, 2021 Share Posted August 17, 2021 11 hours ago, 7Mary3 said: Yes they did, but that was based on port fuel injection with a 10.5 compression ratio. Direct injection will allow a higher compression ratio. Still the 6.8L as a replacement for the 7.3L in truck applications is just a guess on my part. I think most (maybe all) of us are just guessing here. Maybe just wishful thinking from some of us, but I like the idea of an aluminum version that can cross over into lighter high performance applications and still retaining the iron 7.3 for heavy work. Guess we'll find out soon enough! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Power Kid Posted August 17, 2021 Share Posted August 17, 2021 Why would it replace the 7.3L. 7.3L +8,500lbs doesn't impact cafe stds. Seems simple to me aluminum 6.xL V8 is compact, more compact than the 5.0L or 3.5L EB.Cheaper to build vs complex 5.0L. More upside vs 5.0L. But I realize I'm very biased as I want one in a F150. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stray Kat Posted August 17, 2021 Author Share Posted August 17, 2021 I’m pretty sure the factory is already being set up for 6.8 production. A little birdy told me. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Power Kid Posted August 17, 2021 Share Posted August 17, 2021 The $$$ question for me... does it land in any MY 22 F150. ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Power Kid Posted August 17, 2021 Share Posted August 17, 2021 @ month until we get 22 F150 order guide. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
7Mary3 Posted August 17, 2021 Share Posted August 17, 2021 1 hour ago, Stray Kat said: I’m pretty sure the factory is already being set up for 6.8 production. A little birdy told me. Windsor? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Power Kid Posted August 17, 2021 Share Posted August 17, 2021 Yes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ESP08 Posted August 18, 2021 Share Posted August 18, 2021 17 hours ago, Stray Kat said: I’m pretty sure the factory is already being set up for 6.8 production. A little birdy told me. If it's just a short deck 7.3 what is there to set up? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Power Kid Posted August 18, 2021 Share Posted August 18, 2021 Aluminum block? Won't be cast iron if in anything other than Super Duty. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ESP08 Posted August 18, 2021 Share Posted August 18, 2021 1 hour ago, Power Kid said: Aluminum block? Won't be cast iron if in anything other than Super Duty. Would that even involve Windsor Engine Plant? I thought Ford was getting their AL castings for Windsor/Essex Engine from the Nemak Essex Aluminum plant? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Power Kid Posted August 18, 2021 Share Posted August 18, 2021 No clue. All I know is union leader leaked news last last Oct/early Nov and hit every auto news site. He claimed heading to Mustang and F150. Articles easy to find. Rest is likely speculation unless u happen to know someone at Windsor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edselford Posted August 18, 2021 Share Posted August 18, 2021 Yes we are guessing but maybe when ford introduces the 6.8 with DI and the current port injection, the vast majority of the volume will be in F250 and F350 series trucks. F450/F550 could stay with the DI version of the 7.3 liter fast to production with cast iron blocks. The mustang and F150 volumes would be so low, these may not happen or if the did, the five liter V8 would be gone! It take a little more time to do an aluminum block and test it! edselford Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ESP08 Posted August 18, 2021 Share Posted August 18, 2021 (edited) On 8/18/2021 at 7:27 AM, Power Kid said: No clue. All I know is union leader leaked news last last Oct/early Nov and hit every auto news site. He claimed heading to Mustang and F150. Articles easy to find. Rest is likely speculation unless u happen to know someone at Windsor. Yeah I mean I read the UNIFOR press release when it dropped a year ago just like everyone else and it was extremely light on 6.8 details. That was also a year ago under different CAFE projections. I'm just wondering about Stray Kat's statement about Windsor getting ready for 6.8 production. If the 6.8 is really just short-deck 7.3 like many speculate, and IF the AL blocks are coming from Nemak down the road...I'm just wondering what Windsor has to get ready for? IF the 6.8 still sees the light of day I'm hoping Stray Kat's statement is implying that the 6.8 is more than just a short deck AL block 7.3. Edited August 19, 2021 by ESP08 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ESP08 Posted August 18, 2021 Share Posted August 18, 2021 32 minutes ago, edselford said: Yes we are guessing but maybe when ford introduces the 6.8 with DI and the current port injection, the vast majority of the volume will be in F250 and F350 series trucks. F450/F550 could stay with the DI version of the 7.3 liter fast to production with cast iron blocks. The mustang and F150 volumes would be so low, these may not happen or if the did, the five liter V8 would be gone! It take a little more time to do an aluminum block and test it! edselford The 5.0 isn't going anywhere. Ford just invested in DoD for the Gen IV 5.0 and the same UNIFOR press release that mentioned the 6.8 said 5.0 is staying in production at Essex for the foreseeable future. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted August 18, 2021 Share Posted August 18, 2021 Romeo engine plant and the special engine assembly line are both scheduled close late next year. So that means both the 6.2 and 5.2 are gone. The short money is on the 6.8 being a high performance engine that sees limited production but also a plan to cover the desires of Raptor and Shelby Mustang buyers to have something special to then as a last hurrah before electrification takes hold and makes them obsolete. So yeah, changes to CAFE may make this difficult but BEV rollout may actually offset a lot of the negativism blow back. The silence is deafening 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Rosadini Posted August 19, 2021 Share Posted August 19, 2021 On 8/16/2021 at 7:20 PM, Captainp4 said: They made an awful big stink about 7.3 being the "ideal" displacement for HD trucks for them to shrink it to 6.8 that quickly For sure. Beltramo (sp?) and I think Wolf both said 7.3 was the optimal displacement for MD. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slemke Posted August 19, 2021 Share Posted August 19, 2021 5 hours ago, jpd80 said: Romeo engine plant and the special engine assembly line are both scheduled close late next year. So that means both the 6.2 and 5.2 are gone. The short money is on the 6.8 being a high performance engine that sees limited production but also a plan to cover the desires of Raptor and Shelby Mustang buyers to have something special to then as a last hurrah before electrification takes hold and makes them obsolete. So yeah, changes to CAFE may make this difficult but BEV rollout may actually offset a lot of the negativism blow back. The silence is deafening Not just BEV, but electrification in general. A Maverick hybrid will help immensely with meeting cafe. The window sticker mpg isn’t even close to what is used to compute cafe. It uses the old 1979 standard and then there are extra credits for using certain technologies. I think it is something like a 30% adjustment. A 6.8 running on 4 cylinders may not be that much different than a 3.5l ecoboost running on no boost. The old epa cycle was designed for ‘79 vehicles. The 6.8 will likely run the cycle on 4 cylinders and have power to spare. The coyote made some impressive gains with cylinder deactivation. I would expect the 6.8l to be similar. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edselford Posted August 19, 2021 Share Posted August 19, 2021 Does anyone know how Ford came up with 6.8 size V8? Why? For most of the high performance vehicle days, all significant domestic OEM’s were sitting around 7.0 liters. ford 427FE (actually 425) ford 428FE (actually 427) Chevy 427, Chrysler 426, Olds 425, Pontiac 428, ford 429, Lincoln 430 ,Buick 430. edselford Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LSchicago Posted August 19, 2021 Share Posted August 19, 2021 53 minutes ago, edselford said: Does anyone know how Ford came up with 6.8 size V8? Why? For most of the high performance vehicle days, all significant domestic OEM’s were sitting around 7.0 liters. ford 427FE (actually 425) ford 428FE (actually 427) Chevy 427, Chrysler 426, Olds 425, Pontiac 428, ford 429, Lincoln 430 ,Buick 430. edselford Probably that was the stroke length that gave them the RPM needed for a specific performance number. Just like the 429/460's. The 429's always felt stronger with their faster revving powerband. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted August 20, 2021 Share Posted August 20, 2021 (edited) On 8/19/2021 at 12:38 PM, Bob Rosadini said: For sure. Beltramo (sp?) and I think Wolf both said 7.3 was the optimal displacement for MD. I think that the truth is that 7.3 was painted as one size fits all applications from F250 to F750. I can imagine a suit saying, “build one engine that does everything”. Food for thought, Ford could have chosen any capacities it wanted for the Boss, had it been built as a 5.4 and a 7.0 instead of just 6.2, it could have displaced the MOD 5.4 V8 and 6.8 V10 years early. On 8/20/2021 at 5:01 AM, LSchicago said: Probably that was the stroke length that gave them the RPM needed for a specific performance number. Just like the 429/460's. The 429's always felt stronger with their faster revving powerband. Evolving perceptions. The 460 was a continuation of the “max torque at 2500 rpm” applications where the 429 was more about mid range torque which suits both HP car and HD truck applications with constant heavy load. Edited August 20, 2021 by jpd80 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theoldwizard1 Posted August 20, 2021 Share Posted August 20, 2021 On 8/18/2021 at 10:23 AM, ESP08 said: Would that even involve Windsor Engine Plant? I thought Ford was getting their AL castings for Windsor/Essex Engine from the Nemak Essex Aluminum plant? Not sure how accurate this is, but the last I heard Ford does not own ANY casting facilities in the US, Canada, Mexico, South America or Western Europe. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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