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Stray Kat

The New 6.8L V8 Thread

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26 minutes ago, Power Kid said:

Why? 7.3L has more output in sd form. 

 

Well enlighten us then! What's the output of the 6.8L in SD form?

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47 minutes ago, Power Kid said:

Unless... the 6.8 will be in more applications. 

 

Like maybe a Raptor or Mustang?

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Think of a direct injected and port injected 6.8liter V8 having the same hp and torque numbers as the current 7.3!

Probably most of the F350/350 customers are going to be happy with better mpg and less susceptible to engine knock!

For F450/550 6.8 as base and just maybe 7.3 DI/Port injection as an up option with approx 8% more torque than current 7.3! or 7.3 goes away completely.

edselfird

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Disappointed that they aren't offering a hybrid version.  A 7.3 or 6.8 mated to an electric motor would provided diesel like torque with the benefits of gas, plus add the killer feature of the powerboost onboard power system, which would be awesome for campers and smaller rv's when boondocking.  Put in a large enough battery that would provide the needed capacity to pull up the mountains and you have a great daily driver that would easily handle the rigors of towing a 10k lb trailer.

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Makes no sense to keep both in F250/350.  If the 6.8 makes the same power with better mpg and emissions then why bother with a 7.3 in the first place?

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24 minutes ago, akirby said:

Makes no sense to keep both in F250/350.  If the 6.8 makes the same power with better mpg and emissions then why bother with a 7.3 in the first place?


One was probably a bridge to get to the other

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44 minutes ago, akirby said:

Makes no sense to keep both in F250/350.  If the 6.8 makes the same power with better mpg and emissions then why bother with a 7.3 in the first place?

 

Because Ford does things that way. 

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2 hours ago, Power Kid said:

Why? 7.3L has more output in sd form. 

Keep in mind what the  hype was when 7.3 came out....it was a "MEDIUM DUTY" motor and to this old guy medium duty has always been class 6 and 7.  I forgot the lead engineers name but he stated 7.3 was an optimal displacement because of its "stokeiometric" characteristics-which I don't understand but I'm sure 7M or a couple of others on here can explain.  To me the size was optimal for the intended purpose.

However it didn't take long for the gear heads to see its potential and for sure as a competitor for the big block Bow Tie.

 

And hasn't there been a continual  question about what it would be made of vs. the 7.3?And as I said-and someone else just commented, this 6.8 just may prevent a few more defections to Ram/Mopar/Fiat or GM by those who say "Keep it simple stupid".

Contractor friend of mine has a beautiful small fleet of old school Macks, and Ford 350 small trucks.  His personal truck was a nice 5.0 150.  Then he got tired of it "ticking" and gets a new GMC . Not sure what year the 5.0 was but again, 32 valves vs. 16??  KISS.

And again loyal Ford guy and my two sons and I are up from 9 EB's owned to 10!

But when I buy the last new vehicle I will ever own-getting close🙄- I just might want an old school pushrod V-8!

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Does seem strange that they would drop the 7.3 after touting that as the optimal displacement for heavy work for so long and so frequently when it was coming out. Maybe they can eek some more economy out of a 6.8 with lower output for those that don't "work" their trucks as much as others and keep the 7.3 around for heavier work? Kinda like the triton 5.4/6.8 days... but quite a bit more displacement difference between those two.

Wishful thinking wants it to be volume justification to stick it in raptor R and gt500 for one last hurrah of v8 glory, but much doubt there.

 

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Still wondering if this is as simple as using the 6.2L crankshaft in the 7.3L block? They share the same bore spacing and main bearing journal size. Using the 7.3's bore size of 4.220" and the 6.2's stroke of 3.74"  = 418 cu in or 6.8L. This would make for a quick revving engine similar to the old 429 ci big block.

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On 9/8/2022 at 4:55 PM, blksn8k2 said:

Still wondering if this is as simple as using the 6.2L crankshaft in the 7.3L block? They share the same bore spacing and main bearing journal size. Using the 7.3's bore size of 4.220" and the 6.2's stroke of 3.74"  = 418 cu in or 6.8L. This would make for a quick revving engine similar to the old 429 ci big block.

 

That may indeed be possible, but for emissions reasons you are usually better off with a smaller bore.  Personally I would like to see a smaller bore because I think the cylinder walls of the 7.3L are awfully thin.

Edited by 7Mary3

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I doubt the 7.3 is getting canceled. It is already on the small side of a new wave of fuel agnostic engines coming for use in medium duty trucks. 
 

 

The Isuzu NPR is the baby with a 6.0 GM engine option. Ram is coming with a Cummins built gas/gaseous 6 banger pretty soon. 
 

The Cummins engine will probably be seen across the board up to certain GVW’s. 
 

I believe the Cummins engine will be larger in displacement than the 7.3. 
 

 

That 6.8 is for F250/350 and Class C RV’s I’ll bet.

 

If Ford does a 6.8 hybrid with a ProPower onboard system in those vehicles they will simply own those categories. 
 

I was hoping the combination was going in the Raptor but alas no. 
 

Let’s hope Ford can find a way to do it on these. 

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The NPR is going to the new GM 6.6L V-8 with the Hydramatic 6 speed, while the NQR is now available with the old 6.0L teamed with an Allison 6 speed:  

 

 https://www.isuzucv.com/en/nseries/nseries_gas

 

https://www.isuzucv.com/en/nseries/class_5_gas

 

The first 'fuel agnostic' Cummins engine will be the 6.7L, but larger versions will follow.  No word for sure it will go into the Ram yet, but plenty of rumors.  

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On 9/8/2022 at 1:39 PM, Footballfan said:

These engines were not conceived until 1985 or 1986.  Prior to that, Ford was just going to ride with their traditional V-8s thinking that the market for them would eventually dry up (as other automakers did).  When people started demanding more V-8 powered vehicles around 1982 and 1983, Ford developed the Modular engines.  That is what I meant by "crash program."

You are correct in that development of the small block and 460 continued in the 1980s with EFI arriving in the latter half but things like alloy heads that would have really helped improved efficiency were not considered, most likely because the Mods were being developed by that time. Don Pietersen challenging the engine division to provide more advanced engines with increased efficiency. When the CEO tells the engine department to do that, it’s not really a crash program but more a complete change in direction but perhaps one based on the mis belief that a short V8 was needed for FWD applications that ere basically replaced by more efficient V6 engines.

 

Typical of Ford (and other manufacturers) trying to predict market directions and then snookering itself with some form of misstep…still, they managed to make the best of it

 

Edited by jpd80

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On 9/9/2022 at 9:55 AM, blksn8k2 said:

Still wondering if this is as simple as using the 6.2L crankshaft in the 7.3L block? They share the same bore spacing and main bearing journal size. Using the 7.3's bore size of 4.220" and the 6.2's stroke of 3.74"  = 418 cu in or 6.8L. This would make for a quick revving engine similar to the old 429 ci big block.

The extra capacity of the 6.8 vs 6.2 might be enough to improve fuel efficiency a bit and maybe carry a higher gear at speed. 
 

If the 7.3 answered a lot of buyers request for a simpler push rod  engine with PFI, then the 6.8 will simply add to that experience.

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When you think about it, the 6.8 probably makes sense for F250/F350 Ford could offer it as a base 400 hp/430-440 lb ft engine  while making the 7.3 a more premium offering, charging more for it in the 2023 model?

 

Perhaps  the torque curve on the 6.8 is a bit stronger in the lower end than the 6.2 which has 430 lb ft 

Edited by jpd80

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1 hour ago, jpd80 said:

When you think about it, the 6.8 probably makes sense for F250/F350 Ford could offer it as a base 400 hp/430-440 lb ft engine  while making the 7.3 a more premium offering, charging more for it in the 2023 model?

 

Perhaps  the torque curve on the 6.8 is a bit stronger in the lower end than the 6.2 which has 430 lb ft 


I know the 6.2 has better peak hp numbers than the old v10 did, but it feels like an absolute dog when towing relatively heavy compared to it. Pretty quick without a trailer on it.

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Just can't see offering both the 6.8L and the 7.3L in the same vehicle line, particularly knowing Ford wants to decrease the number of ICE's they offer.  An optional gasoline engine in the Super Duty is not needed, how could you make a business case for it?  They should have dropped the 6.2L in 2020.

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51 minutes ago, Captainp4 said:


I know the 6.2 has better peak hp numbers than the old v10 did, but it feels like an absolute dog when towing relatively heavy compared to it. Pretty quick without a trailer on it.

And this is where larger capacity comes into play at low rpm, another 40-50 lb ft at say, 2,000 rpm makes a world of difference.

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2 hours ago, jpd80 said:

When you think about it, the 6.8 probably makes sense for F250/F350 Ford could offer it as a base 400 hp/430-440 lb ft engine  while making the 7.3 a more premium offering, charging more for it in the 2023 model?

 

Perhaps  the torque curve on the 6.8 is a bit stronger in the lower end than the 6.2 which has 430 lb ft 

 

Perhaps a small increase in power/torque to the 7.3 will come to make more "room" in the lineup for the 6.8?

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I don’t remember where I read it but on another forum someone claims to have been told by “someone in the know” that the 6.8 is a larger version of the 6.2 rather than a smaller version of the 7.3. 
 

 

That doesn’t make any sense at all but nothing makes any sense to me anymore nor am I ever surprised. 

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3 hours ago, Stray Kat said:

I don’t remember where I read it but on another forum someone claims to have been told by “someone in the know” that the 6.8 is a larger version of the 6.2 rather than a smaller version of the 7.3. 
 

 

That doesn’t make any sense at all but nothing makes any sense to me anymore nor am I ever surprised. 

Yeah, that doesn't make any sense as a business case. Right now, you have two unique engines in the SuperDuty lineup, and only one of them can go across the full lineup, so increasing the displacement of the smaller one (which had already been rejected for use in anything beyond the F-250) leaves you with two unique engines. At least if you build the 6.8 off the Godzilla architecture you get some economy of scale by having the opportunity to share components between them.

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