Melino Posted August 12, 2021 Share Posted August 12, 2021 https://www.bronco6g.com/ford-announces-mic-hardtop-solution-unscheduled-orders-to-get-my2022-delivered-built-broncos-will-have-tops-replaced/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kyle Posted August 12, 2021 Share Posted August 12, 2021 Good to know the hard top issue is tied to extreme temperatures and humidity....must be a brutal summer in Michigan Premiere:) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jcartwright99 Posted August 12, 2021 Share Posted August 12, 2021 The only thing they could do really. I wonder who is eating the cost of the new tops? Webasto or Ford? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted August 12, 2021 Share Posted August 12, 2021 9 minutes ago, jcartwright99 said: The only thing they could do really. I wonder who is eating the cost of the new tops? Webasto or Ford? Probably both since it appears to be both a design and manufacturing issue. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twintornados Posted August 12, 2021 Share Posted August 12, 2021 Only question that remains is who builds OEM tops for Jeep? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fuzzymoomoo Posted August 12, 2021 Share Posted August 12, 2021 1 hour ago, kyle said: Good to know the hard top issue is tied to extreme temperatures and humidity....must be a brutal summer in Michigan Premiere:) Its been a little hotter and a little more humid than normal (currently in the middle of a 85+ degree humid heat wave) but nothing worse than what I can remember in the last 5-8 years 34 minutes ago, twintornados said: Only question that remains is who builds OEM tops for Jeep? That would be Webasto AFAIK. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PREMiERdrum Posted August 12, 2021 Share Posted August 12, 2021 8 minutes ago, fuzzymoomoo said: That would be Webasto AFAIK. Yep, albeit in a different facility and with a VERY different construction method. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvrsvt Posted August 12, 2021 Share Posted August 12, 2021 At this point I'm wondering if I should pop smoke on the whole thing...Ford's time table for the new tops is very aggressive (less then 90 days) and I have to wait another 30 or so days for an shipping update? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted August 12, 2021 Share Posted August 12, 2021 11 minutes ago, silvrsvt said: At this point I'm wondering if I should pop smoke on the whole thing...Ford's time table for the new tops is very aggressive (less then 90 days) and I have to wait another 30 or so days for an shipping update? out on a limb....Celcius vs farenheight again...…...90 days...yeah right.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted August 12, 2021 Share Posted August 12, 2021 I assume the redesign and tooling is either already in place or imminent and if so - and if 100% of production goes directly to built but not shipped vehicles - then 90 days MIGHT be doable. But that also assumes no new problems. Are they so bad they can’t be shipped as is and replaced at the dealer later or is Ford just trying to save money by doing it all at the factory? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PREMiERdrum Posted August 12, 2021 Share Posted August 12, 2021 6 minutes ago, akirby said: Are they so bad they can’t be shipped as is and replaced at the dealer later or is Ford just trying to save money by doing it all at the factory? There are PR implications of releasing another 2,200+ bad roof units out into the wild, and both the cost of and risk of damage in shipping that many roof units is just not tenable. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mackinaw Posted August 12, 2021 Share Posted August 12, 2021 I should have asked this question a long time ago. Is this a functional problem, meaning the roof leaks? Or cosmetic? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PREMiERdrum Posted August 12, 2021 Share Posted August 12, 2021 8 minutes ago, mackinaw said: I should have asked this question a long time ago. Is this a functional problem, meaning the roof leaks? Or cosmetic? There are several examples of water intrusion in early builds. The more widespread issues are material loss on the "open" raw cut edges, "snakeskin" effect of the honeycomb core showing through the outer laminate panel, and ugly forming issues in the interior of the clamshell piece. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted August 12, 2021 Share Posted August 12, 2021 (edited) 12 minutes ago, PREMiERdrum said: There are several examples of water intrusion in early builds. The more widespread issues are material loss on the "open" raw cut edges, "snakeskin" effect of the honeycomb core showing through the outer laminate panel, and ugly forming issues in the interior of the clamshell piece. question...I know its obviously designed by Ford....does WEBASTO then supply the tooling and manufacture....or is the "tooling" supplied by Ford? Edited August 12, 2021 by Deanh 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PREMiERdrum Posted August 12, 2021 Share Posted August 12, 2021 6 minutes ago, Deanh said: question...I know its obviously designed by Ford....does WEBASTO then supply the tooling and manufacture....or is the "tooling" supplied by Ford? The first set of tooling was provided by Webasto under Ford's licensure. New tooling was acquired by Ford earlier this year with a modified production process of the same design. This new tooling will also be fully funded by Ford with a modified roof design. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted August 12, 2021 Share Posted August 12, 2021 8 minutes ago, Deanh said: question...I know its obviously designed by Ford....does WEBASTO then supply the tooling and manufacture....or is the "tooling" supplied by Ford? I believe Ford supplies the tooling. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted August 12, 2021 Share Posted August 12, 2021 (edited) 8 minutes ago, akirby said: I believe Ford supplies the tooling. if so Id say blame would lie at the feet of Ford....although why Webasto wouldn't bring it to their attn is beyond me...and I still cant get my head around why after so long?./... Edited August 12, 2021 by Deanh 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted August 12, 2021 Share Posted August 12, 2021 9 minutes ago, Deanh said: if so Id say blame would lie at the feet of Ford....although why Webasto wouldn't bring it to their attn is beyond me...and I still cant get my head around why after so long?./... They only provided the tooling after the initial Webasto problems. Responsibility lies with Ford either way but the blame is on Ford for a hard to build design and Webasto for saying they could build them when they can’t. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twintornados Posted August 12, 2021 Share Posted August 12, 2021 1 hour ago, fuzzymoomoo said: That would be Webasto AFAIK. Well, then Webasto knows how to build 'em... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted August 12, 2021 Share Posted August 12, 2021 17 minutes ago, akirby said: They only provided the tooling after the initial Webasto problems. Responsibility lies with Ford either way but the blame is on Ford for a hard to build design and Webasto for saying they could build them when they can’t. maybe Ford should contact Navistar......what?...too soon?....lol 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ausrutherford Posted August 13, 2021 Share Posted August 13, 2021 10 hours ago, twintornados said: Only question that remains is who builds OEM tops for Jeep? My JK Wrangler went through three soft tops in 6 years. First was too small, so they fitted a larger one. Early JKs had this issue. Second ripped from a seem about 18 months in. Third, they finally got the fabric right, but it still kept on losing screws in the hinge between the front and rear doors. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvrsvt Posted August 13, 2021 Share Posted August 13, 2021 10 hours ago, ausrutherford said: My JK Wrangler went through three soft tops in 6 years. First was too small, so they fitted a larger one. Early JKs had this issue. Second ripped from a seem about 18 months in. Third, they finally got the fabric right, but it still kept on losing screws in the hinge between the front and rear doors. I was under the impression that soft tops where considered consumable items? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted August 13, 2021 Share Posted August 13, 2021 11 hours ago, ausrutherford said: My JK Wrangler went through three soft tops in 6 years. First was too small, so they fitted a larger one. Early JKs had this issue. Second ripped from a seem about 18 months in. Third, they finally got the fabric right, but it still kept on losing screws in the hinge between the front and rear doors. That’s not possible. Only Ford has problems. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FordBuyer Posted August 13, 2021 Share Posted August 13, 2021 23 hours ago, kyle said: Good to know the hard top issue is tied to extreme temperatures and humidity....must be a brutal summer in Michigan Premiere:) More like extreme rain as in multiple flood and wind events. MI has more 60+ mph wind events than Central FL. Just before we left MI for good in 2017, we got hit by 70+ mph wind gusts where I thought we were going to lose the 2nd story of our house. Over 1 million lost power that day. And MI seems to have those wind events multiple times now. And floods. We have been hit by one hurricane down here so far....Irma with wind gusts of 60 mph and 12 inches of rain in 18 hours. Flooding kept to minimum because of excellent water management system...retention ponds connected to one another. 12 inches of rain in SE MI would be catastrophic. They can't handle 3 inches in short period of time. Maybe that is why everyone wants Bronco/Wrangler with huge tires to get through the floods. You need a good weather proof top though. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FordBuyer Posted August 13, 2021 Share Posted August 13, 2021 22 minutes ago, akirby said: That’s not possible. Only Ford has problems. I don't know that I have ever seen a vehicle with soft top that was impressive long term. I remember those little GM SUV's with the canvas tops in the 80's and they looked like hell after a few years. All faded and tattered. And terrible wind noise at speed. My Mustang convertible top held up well, but noisy at speed and not well insulated in winter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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