'21 December/ Year End Total

[ANTAUS]

Ford Motor Company

 

Sales Chart

[rperez817]

Highlights.

• Ford was the best-selling automaker in the fourth quarter
• Ford brand posts best-ever sales for full electric vehicles, second only to Tesla for 2021
• Ford electrified vehicles grew 36 percent faster than the segment overall in 2021, while achieving new sales records for the month of December and all of 2021
• Mustang Mach-E sales totaled 27,140 vehicles in 2021, making it the nation’s second bestselling full electric SUV behind Tesla’s Model Y
• Thirty-three percent of Ford retail sales were the fulfillment of customer orders for the month (December 2021)

[akirby]

Remind me again why killing cars were a bad idea?

[rperez817]

17 minutes ago, akirby said:

Remind me again why killing cars were a bad idea?

 

Ford's tarnished passenger car nameplates in the U.S. (i.e. cars other than Mustang)? Killing those was not a bad idea.

[HotRunrGuy]

26 minutes ago, akirby said:

Remind me again why killing cars were a bad idea?

 

Remind me again why they don't kill Lincoln?   If this WAS badge engineering, it would make sense, but with these volumes, and all the bespoke panels, parts and tooling required, I can't imagine how the business case remains.

 

HRG

[jasonj80]

15 minutes ago, HotRunrGuy said:

 

Remind me again why they don't kill Lincoln?   If this WAS badge engineering, it would make sense, but with these volumes, and all the bespoke panels, parts and tooling required, I can't imagine how the business case remains.

 

HRG

Lincoln is around for China. The added North American volume is just bonus. 

[ice-capades]

Ford CEO Alan Mulally wanted to kill off the Lincoln Division years ago, but the Ford family refused. A decision was made to make a commitment to investing in the Lincoln brand to reestablish it, but years later there's little to show for it. At least now, Lincoln is starting to establish some model name recognition after the nonsense of the MK-ABC naming convention that was just confusing to all. Lincoln needs more and distinctive models, but I expect that certain plans were derailed with the increasingly rapid development of BEV transition plans.     

[FordBuyer]

22 minutes ago, ice-capades said:

Ford CEO Alan Mulally wanted to kill off the Lincoln Division years ago, but the Ford family refused. A decision was made to make a commitment to investing in the Lincoln brand to reestablish it, but years later there's little to show for it. At least now, Lincoln is starting to establish some model name recognition after the nonsense of the MK-ABC naming convention that was just confusing to all. Lincoln needs more and distinctive models, but I expect that certain plans were derailed with the increasingly rapid development of BEV transition plans.     

 

I don't think anyone knows about Lincoln until things return to normal, whenever that is. I know the Lincoln dealer by me has no new vehicles to sell...only orders. In November at the car show here, the Lincoln stand only had a couple used Nautiluses to show. It's basically a used car dealer now. 

 

Now whether Ford is ready to sink hundreds of millions of new dollars into Lincoln at this time is another story. I would guess Ford's attention and money are looking elsewhere. 

[akirby]

56 minutes ago, jasonj80 said:

Lincoln is around for China. The added North American volume is just bonus. 

They’re also selling for $50k - $100k as opposed to cars which were in the $20k-$40k range.

[coupe3w]

1 hour ago, akirby said:

Remind me again why killing cars were a bad idea?

Pretty hard to tell if you don't have any product to sell don't you think?

[akirby]

1 hour ago, coupe3w said:

Pretty hard to tell if you don't have any product to sell don't you think?

Nope not hard at all.  Fusions and Focus selling for mid $20ks with $4k rebates and MKZ selling for mid $30Ks also with rebates vs Ranger, Bronco, Bronco Sport and Maverick with the last 3 selling in just a few days at or above MSRP (no rebates) even before the supply chain crisis and at much higher MSRPs especially Bronco and Bronco Sport.  It’s a no brainer.

[coupe3w]

20 minutes ago, akirby said:

Nope not hard at all.  Fusions and Focus selling for mid $20ks with $4k rebates and MKZ selling for mid $30Ks also with rebates vs Ranger, Bronco, Bronco Sport and Maverick with the last 3 selling in just a few days at or above MSRP (no rebates) even before the supply chain crisis and at much higher MSRPs especially Bronco and Bronco Sport.  It’s a no brainer.

Where can I get a 2022 Fusion or Focus in the USA?

[akirby]

28 minutes ago, coupe3w said:

Where can I get a 2022 Fusion or Focus in the USA?

Doesn’t make any difference.  The car market hasn’t changed.

[coupe3w]

28 minutes ago, akirby said:

Doesn’t make any difference.  The car market hasn’t changed.

Nice spin on it.

Do you have any stock picks for me since you can tell the future. LOL

[Willwll313wll]

35 minutes ago, akirby said:

Doesn’t make any difference.  The car market hasn’t changed.

 

People still dont want low riding cars like they used too. Ford's decision made sense to me then, and still does. 

The only thing cars had over crossovers was efficiency, and then automakers made crossovers more efficient.

Edited January 5, 2022 by Willwll313wll

[FordBuyer]

23 minutes ago, Willwll313wll said:

 

People still dont want low riding cars like they used too. Ford's decision made sense to me then, and still does. 

The only thing cars had over crossovers was efficiency, and then automakers made crossovers more efficient.

 

Interesting though that lots of new BEVs happen to be sedans like Model 3, Lucid Air, Porsche Taycan, Model S, Fisker, and so on. Certainly Ford has become largely a truck/van company in recent years, and does make sense for Ford to concentrate on segments that pay the bills.

 

Still would like to see Ford or Lincoln do a Sport sedan and a 2 row station wagon. Maybe the 2 row wagon in the Maverick family. 

[akirby]

37 minutes ago, coupe3w said:

Nice spin on it.

Do you have any stock picks for me since you can tell the future. LOL

No spin at all just cold hard facts.  Cars are commodities with 7 or 8 competitors in each market segment and they’re cheap and have to compete on price.  Ranger, Bronco, Bronco Sport and Maverick only have 1 or 2 competitors at most and sell at much higher prices and do t compete on price.  The profit margin difference is probably 10x if not more.

[akirby]

15 minutes ago, FordBuyer said:

 

Interesting though that lots of new BEVs happen to be sedans like Model 3, Lucid Air, Porsche Taycan, Model S, Fisker, and so on. Certainly Ford has become largely a truck/van company in recent years, and does make sense for Ford to concentrate on segments that pay the bills.

 

Still would like to see Ford or Lincoln do a Sport sedan and a 2 row station wagon. Maybe the 2 row wagon in the Maverick family. 

I think they’re doing sedans first because they’re more aerodynamic.

 

I can see Lincoln doing a BEV sedan if it doesn’t take away from utility or truck development.  The BEV sedan market has more room for differentiation and isn’t commoditized (yet).

[Deanh]

56 minutes ago, coupe3w said:

Nice spin on it.

Do you have any stock picks for me since you can tell the future. LOL

up until Covid hit and every vehicle instantaneously became in short supply...that was, and will become reality again....Honda was having issues selling their Accord...as was every other manufacturer as the market had shifted significantly towards taller top hats/...aka CUV and SUVs....one only needs to look at all ESTABLISHED manufacturers as a whole and see they have also embraced those facts ...start ups not so much...

[rmc523]

4 hours ago, HotRunrGuy said:

 

Remind me again why they don't kill Lincoln?   If this WAS badge engineering, it would make sense, but with these volumes, and all the bespoke panels, parts and tooling required, I can't imagine how the business case remains.

 

HRG

 

Looking too much at sales numbers/trends the last 2 years for any model or brand is a mistake given the market and limitations.  Hard to draw any real conclusions from them.

 

A few factors of Lincoln to consider:

-ATPs have increased quite a bit with the introduction of the new Navigator, Aviator, etc., so even if there are fewer sales (which also wasn't true for those models), ATPs are up

-Lincoln is also in the midst of transitioning sedans out of the lineup, so you have that volume drop on top of the depressed vehicle supply due to chip shortages making figures look worse than they otherwise would.....Lincoln's sedan sales the last 5  years ('17-21) have been 39.5k, 28.6k, 24.3k, 17.7k, 3.1k.  So compared to just last year, that's a 14.6k drop from discontinued sedans alone, which is almost all of the 18.4k decline for the year.  So for continuing products losing only 3,842 units for the year given the market limitations, I'd say that's pretty good.

 

 

4 hours ago, ice-capades said:

Ford CEO Alan Mulally wanted to kill off the Lincoln Division years ago, but the Ford family refused. A decision was made to make a commitment to investing in the Lincoln brand to reestablish it, but years later there's little to show for it. At least now, Lincoln is starting to establish some model name recognition after the nonsense of the MK-ABC naming convention that was just confusing to all. Lincoln needs more and distinctive models, but I expect that certain plans were derailed with the increasingly rapid development of BEV transition plans.     

 

Lincoln sales had been improving, but as pointed out above, at the same time they've dropped sedans so that affects figures negatively.  Also, the sales they've gotten have been much higher prices than years past, so even if sales have been relatively flat, if you're making more on each sale, you're making more on less volume.

 

1 hour ago, FordBuyer said:

 

Interesting though that lots of new BEVs happen to be sedans like Model 3, Lucid Air, Porsche Taycan, Model S, Fisker, and so on. Certainly Ford has become largely a truck/van company in recent years, and does make sense for Ford to concentrate on segments that pay the bills.

 

Still would like to see Ford or Lincoln do a Sport sedan and a 2 row station wagon. Maybe the 2 row wagon in the Maverick family. 

 

I think after they get their BEV platform lined up and some crossovers operational on it, we'll see a single BEV sedan for both Ford and Lincoln appear in the lineups.

[rmc523]

For those that like mostly red lol, here are colored charts for the year.

 

 

I put it in the post above, but I'll repeat it here - Lincoln's sales aren't as bad as they may look on paper this year.

 

Lincoln is the midst of transitioning sedans out of the lineup, so you have that volume drop on top of the depressed vehicle supply due to chip shortages making figures look worse than they otherwise would.....Lincoln's sedan sales the last 5  years ('17-21) have been 39.5k, 28.6k, 24.3k, 17.7k, 3.1k.  So compared to just last year, that's a 14.6k drop from discontinued sedans alone, which is almost all of the 18.4k decline for the year.  So for continuing products losing only 3,842 units for the year given the market limitations, I'd say that's pretty good.  Let's hope Lincoln can push back next year with higher crossover sales.

 

That said, it would be nice to see Lincoln get some additional product, though, to replace sedan volume.  What products that/those would be beyond BEV versions of what's there, I don't know.  Lowest hanging fruits would be lower volume, though - some sort of crossover coupe, a "Continental" flagship crossover.   I don't think a subcompact crossover should be the direction to go.  As I also said above, I wouldn't mind seeing a large midsize BEV sedan to slot in the lineup to give a product there and some volume.  I doubt it'd be in the cards (would depend on how flexible the BEV skateboard would be), but a Mustang coupe twin Lincoln coupe would be nice too, but also low volume.

 

Edited January 5, 2022 by rmc523

[rmc523]

Also, Here's the Q4 (left 4 columns) and YTD (right 4 columns) comparions for truck sales in 2021.

 

[rperez817]

6 hours ago, FordBuyer said:

I don't think anyone knows about Lincoln until things return to normal, whenever that is. I know the Lincoln dealer by me has no new vehicles to sell...only orders.

 

Lincoln could present a good opportunity for Ford to test sales and marketing strategies based on retail sold orders. Maybe Ford could make new Lincoln vehicles in the U.S. available solely via orders, with the goal of zero new car inventory at Lincoln dealerships other than demonstrator vehicles.

Edited January 6, 2022 by rperez817

[jpd80]

1 hour ago, rperez817 said:

 

Lincoln could present a good opportunity for Ford to test sales and marketing strategies based on retail sold orders. Maybe Ford could make new Lincoln vehicles in the U.S. available solely via orders, with the goal of zero new car inventory at Lincoln dealerships other than demonstrator vehicles.

Order only vehicle process really mucks up Ford’s long term supplier scheduling, remembering that the Lincolns are built down the same line as the Ford version, everything has to be coordinated. It’s a big problem that Hackett bumped up against with wanting customer orders to be prioritised, it throws out scheduling and JIT supply contracts, not impossible but costs more….which is like a knife in Ford’s ribs.

Edited January 6, 2022 by jpd80

[akirby]

1 hour ago, jpd80 said:

Order only vehicle process really mucks up Ford’s long term supplier scheduling, remembering that the Lincolns are built down the same line as the Ford version, everything has to be coordinated. It’s a big problem that Hackett bumped up against with wanting customer orders to be prioritised, it throws out scheduling and JIT supply contracts, not impossible but costs more….which is like a knife in Ford’s ribs.

At first maybe but you would think after a few months a pattern would emerge and they’d be able to forecast parts requirements pretty closely.  I don’t think the special orders would vary a lot month to month but I could be wrong.  

Edited January 6, 2022 by akirby