JX1 Posted January 15, 2022 Share Posted January 15, 2022 20 minutes ago, DeluxeStang said: If you don't mind me asking, who were you quoting? Hi, a source from Ford in Dearborn, named Aaron. Had involvement with the S650 Program. Where is @ExplorerDude? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jcartwright99 Posted January 15, 2022 Share Posted January 15, 2022 33 minutes ago, JX1 said: Hi, a source from Ford in Dearborn, named Aaron. Had involvement with the S650 Program. Where is @ExplorerDude? I really hope he's not named Aaron. Do you know what his employee number is? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JX1 Posted January 15, 2022 Share Posted January 15, 2022 (edited) 3 hours ago, fuzzymoomoo said: It has been suspected that S650 won't be a radical redesign but more of an evolution of S550 which tracks along with what they're doing with the rest of the lineup, mainly F-series. For the Mustang it's not entirely welcome after almost 9 long years since 2014, but acceptable and anyone who doesn't know that in automotive circles, must be living under a rock. Keep seeing allusions to CD6 off of BOF, which are totally inaccurate. Especially Reddit. This practice seems to be standard fare for the F150 anyway, right? Not that you're criticizing anything, but it's sensible business practice and good ole Ford tradition. From the fall of 1979 to the end of 1995, it was just moderate redesigns of the same old basis. MY1987, MY1992. Well, only until Ford initiated an all new truck program for 1996 in November of '89 (PN96), when the '92 Bronco and F-150 had finally been dialed in for September 1991 intro. That swoopy PN96 generation was a one-off and mysteriously abandoned so abruptly, when under Sir Trotman he ordered for development in 1997, another all new F-150 basis for 2003 (P221). Then Bill Ford in the early 2000s, initiated further development of P221's frame as T1, the renewed unifying basis for all 1500 products (2007 Expy, Navi, '09 F150). T3 replaced it of course and also migrated to the Super Duty. (T6 operates similarly) I say this because, a lot of tone deaf detractors were so quick to criticize the 2021 F-150 as "repetitive", forgetting that Ford ALWAYS does this. The 2015 was all new in virtually every sense, like the 2004 F-150. So the 2021, followed in the footsteps of the 2009 F-150 by being evolutionary and not an unnecessary expenditure of proportions. The P736 and P800 Lightning will be the revolution like the 2004 P221 and 2015 P552 trucks were. With Super Duty, it was much worse, but quite understandable. An 18.5 year run from 1998 to 2016, but for 2023 gets revised T3 and all new in 2028. For the Stang, I admit I still have sour grapes over Hackett's decision to jettison an all new ICE Mustang. I had hoped a CD6 car, would be able to match the Alpha Camaro in performance versus reusing the S550 platform, which is distantly related to the S197 and JagLincolnThunderbird DEW98 allegedly. I guess the lack of significant enough 2018 midcycle S550 revisions like 1987, 1999, and 2010, means the amount of S650 changes coming are acceptable for 2023, just very belated after 8.5 years on sale. The S650 goes beyond 1999 in my opinion, which kept the same interior. The interior is very much new from what I am told, but everyone seems to have a conflicting perspective on this vehicle in Dearborn. Edited January 15, 2022 by JX1 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JX1 Posted January 15, 2022 Share Posted January 15, 2022 (edited) 19 minutes ago, jcartwright99 said: I really hope he's not named Aaron. Do you know what his employee number is? ExplorerDude is not Aaron.? Wouldn't compromise anyone here. I don't have the employee number of Aaron. Edited January 15, 2022 by JX1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jcartwright99 Posted January 15, 2022 Share Posted January 15, 2022 Hybrid is a lock for this car. I'm actually surprised that it didn't come in the current generation refresh. The real question is will it be 4 cylinder only or will they build a V8 version. AWD has been constantly brought up with the Mustang. We know with the S550 there were some experimental test cars. Just thinking out loud, I am wonder with hybrid/PHEV they've learned some new tricks and/or how to keep the weight down. There already is a 4 door mustang....it's called the Mach E Whatever happens with the generation, enjoy it. As this will be the last gen of dino burning stangs. Absolute end of an era. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JX1 Posted January 15, 2022 Share Posted January 15, 2022 13 minutes ago, jcartwright99 said: Hybrid is a lock for this car. I'm actually surprised that it didn't come in the current generation refresh. The real question is will it be 4 cylinder only or will they build a V8 version. AWD has been constantly brought up with the Mustang. We know with the S550 there were some experimental test cars. Just thinking out loud, I am wonder with hybrid/PHEV they've learned some new tricks and/or how to keep the weight down. There already is a 4 door mustang....it's called the Mach E Whatever happens with the generation, enjoy it. As this will be the last gen of dino burning stangs. Absolute end of an era. That last paragraph, very well stated. Good insight BTW overall. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
atomcat68 Posted January 15, 2022 Share Posted January 15, 2022 1 hour ago, DeluxeStang said: Not to me, the foxbody next to the mustang two is my least favorite mustang design. I was more or less thinking of a modern day version of this: 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
atomcat68 Posted January 15, 2022 Share Posted January 15, 2022 3 hours ago, fuzzymoomoo said: That is my one statement on the matter. I'm not even going to hint one way or the other on what it could be referring to. I was thinking out loud rather than asking. I wouldn't want you to hurt your job. I apologize if I put you on the spot. I am just hoping that Ford made a decision on the plant that would be a benefit to the employees by committing the Mustang and maybe other products now that their stock is going up. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Footballfan Posted January 15, 2022 Share Posted January 15, 2022 (edited) 29 minutes ago, jcartwright99 said: Hybrid is a lock for this car. I'm actually surprised that it didn't come in the current generation refresh. The real question is will it be 4 cylinder only or will they build a V8 version. AWD has been constantly brought up with the Mustang. We know with the S550 there were some experimental test cars. Just thinking out loud, I am wonder with hybrid/PHEV they've learned some new tricks and/or how to keep the weight down. There already is a 4 door mustang....it's called the Mach E Whatever happens with the generation, enjoy it. As this will be the last gen of dino burning stangs. Absolute end of an era. The Mach E is classified as a CUV, not a sedan. Regarding this being the last gen of ICE don't bet on it. Nobody can predict what the market will be like 10 years from now. Edited January 15, 2022 by Footballfan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mackinaw Posted January 15, 2022 Share Posted January 15, 2022 27 minutes ago, jcartwright99 said: Whatever happens with the generation, enjoy it. As this will be the last gen of dino burning stangs. Absolute end of an era. And the last Mustang on a dedicated platform. Future Mustangs will probably be based on some sort of common skateboard used by everything. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tbone Posted January 15, 2022 Share Posted January 15, 2022 3 hours ago, fuzzymoomoo said: It has been suspected that S650 won't be a radical redesign but more of an evolution of S550 which tracks along with what they're doing with the rest of the lineup, mainly F-series. Im not a fan of this level of evolutionary makeover. They did not go far enough with the exterior IMO, regardless of their claim that all exterior panels were new. They are still selling all they can make, but the latest generation reminds me of the level of change the 3rd gen (I think) Silverado got. You really had to look hard to find the differences. The fender vent on the current gen F-150 is what tells me now what truck I’m looking at from a distance. Don’t get me wrong, I like the new F-150, but Im guessing the new interior is helping it sell more than the exterior. I just hope they do more with the Mustang, because they hit it out of the park when the S550 came out. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted January 15, 2022 Share Posted January 15, 2022 (edited) 2 hours ago, DeluxeStang said: Perhaps, but I was thinking maybe they're saying things like, the styling is eye-catching, but may annoy purists who only want mustangs to look a certain way. Or perhaps Ford is going to take the maverick route, where they somehow manage to make the standard powertrains hybrids, and customers will have to pay more to get ICE only powertrains. A lot of people would like that, but purists would be pissed about having to pay more to get non hybrid mustangs. In all likelihood, the hybrid will be something like a 2.3 Powerboost ( new SVO?) and in that instance, the GT (V8) would remain more expensive. Edited January 15, 2022 by jpd80 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmc523 Posted January 15, 2022 Share Posted January 15, 2022 2 hours ago, JX1 said: I understan your perspective, as it's not easy. I think usually production changes are announced very far in advance, by nearly 2-3 calendar years out. This vehicle is definitely coming and it's coming to somewhere already established. FRAP, as there's no capacity elsewhere in USA. Canada (Oakville, etc) would cause a backlash. I wouldn't be surprised to see a spring reveal. The S197 was allegedly first spotted testing, 9 months before NAIAS 2004 reveal. S550, just 6 months. Dearborn really wanted to keep this one close to vest, so I imagine like the Bronco first "spied" exactly 2 years ago today, they want to reveal it ASAP. Bronco debut was mid March of 2020, before pandemic hit. Plus, here's a good comparison between the first shots of S550 on June 10, 2013 versus today 8 1/2 years later. Someone has mentioned this though: "I've seen what it's near-final form will be. A lot of good things are in store, but there's things that may anger a vocal minority of purists. I'm really excited to see what features make it to market, there were a lot of really cool and interesting possibilities floated. I would say the structural cell of the passenger compartment is basically unchanged. It's definitely evolutionary, if I were to compare, I might say a change scope similar to the 1999 SN95 refresh" I personally have heard it's a little more than that, but nothing too drastically different. That "anger a vocal minority" has me thinking, either hybrid, transmission choice, or 4/5 door model. I know that's a mule, but it seems to have some new body work under there. Whatever it is, it's using the same mirrors as the current model. 1 hour ago, atomcat68 said: I was more or less thinking of a modern day version of this: With it being more evolutionary, which we've known for a while now, I don't see drastic changes to the form/silhouette in store. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Footballfan Posted January 15, 2022 Share Posted January 15, 2022 2 hours ago, atomcat68 said: I was thinking out loud rather than asking. I wouldn't want you to hurt your job. I apologize if I put you on the spot. I am just hoping that Ford made a decision on the plant that would be a benefit to the employees by committing the Mustang and maybe other products now that their stock is going up. I hear a lot of different things. All I know is that they are hiring a lot of new management and engineers at FRAP and I heard that they are looking at adding a second shift and another product in 2024. With launch 14 months away and preproduction pilots planned for the end of this year, it is too late in the game for Ford to move the Mustang to another plant. Ford plans to sell about 100k of the new Mustang a year so common sense would say that Ford is indeed planning another product for FRAP. However, we all know Ford changes plans as often as most people change their socks and that common sense is not so common. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fuzzymoomoo Posted January 15, 2022 Share Posted January 15, 2022 6 hours ago, JX1 said: The interior is very much new from what I am told I've heard similar and I'm going to reserve judgment until I see it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harley Lover Posted January 15, 2022 Share Posted January 15, 2022 (edited) 12 hours ago, ausrutherford said: This doesn't look good? That is not a notchback (coupe). This is a notchback/coupe: Edited January 15, 2022 by Harley Lover Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harley Lover Posted January 15, 2022 Share Posted January 15, 2022 And this is a hatchback/fastback: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HotRunrGuy Posted January 15, 2022 Share Posted January 15, 2022 Damn, still no shooting brake version,,,,, Hahaha, HRG 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tbone Posted January 15, 2022 Share Posted January 15, 2022 1 hour ago, HotRunrGuy said: Damn, still no shooting brake version,,,,, Hahaha, HRG Thank God! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LSchicago Posted January 15, 2022 Share Posted January 15, 2022 11 hours ago, atomcat68 said: I was more or less thinking of a modern day version of this: Not going to happen. The days of Notchback Mustangs has sailed. Virtually everyone wants Fastbacks, even when buying the Classics. The only reason Fox body notch cars got popular is they were lighter than the Hatchbacks. Ford has already said that the Roof and rear window are carry overs from the S550. So no notchbacks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeluxeStang Posted January 15, 2022 Share Posted January 15, 2022 12 hours ago, atomcat68 said: I was more or less thinking of a modern day version of this: I'll be honest, even that looks worse that the fastback version. Fastback beats notchback 99% of the time in terms of looks imo lol. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeluxeStang Posted January 15, 2022 Share Posted January 15, 2022 1 hour ago, tbone said: Thank God! Well hang on, if you tweaked the roofline on that, and made it slightly sportier, it wouldn't look terrible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tbone Posted January 15, 2022 Share Posted January 15, 2022 5 hours ago, DeluxeStang said: Well hang on, if you tweaked the roofline on that, and made it slightly sportier, it wouldn't look terrible. That style has never appealed to be on any brand. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted January 15, 2022 Share Posted January 15, 2022 8 hours ago, HotRunrGuy said: Damn, still no shooting brake version,,,,, A better option might be a two door pickup, Ford could do that more easily and it would work in the existing Flat Rock facility 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted January 15, 2022 Share Posted January 15, 2022 1 hour ago, jpd80 said: A better option might be a two door pickup, Ford could do that more easily and it would work in the existing Flat Rock facility Will it fit height wise? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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