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Hau Thai-Tang to Retire


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4 hours ago, slemke said:

How so?  What are the leading disagreements about?


The biggest one will be starting pay. I've never seen so many people go through orientation just to never come back after their first real day on the line because you can make just as much money pretty much anywhere else and not beat the dog fu*k out of your body. What people who have never done this type of work before don't understand just how much we deal with physically. Why would I put myself through that when I can make almost as much at Wendy's and get a hiring bonus at the same time? 

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7 hours ago, fuzzymoomoo said:


The biggest one will be starting pay. I've never seen so many people go through orientation just to never come back after their first real day on the line because you can make just as much money pretty much anywhere else and not beat the dog fu*k out of your body. What people who have never done this type of work before don't understand just how much we deal with physically. Why would I put myself through that when I can make almost as much at Wendy's and get a hiring bonus at the same time? 

Fuzzy,

Always appreciate your views from the "line"but what am I missing?  I appreciate how the repetitive nature of most assembly line jobs can wear on you, but how can you compare a job at Wendy's with a UAW job if you stick it out?  Or are you saying new hires will  never be around long enough to progress through the wage progression scale to earn a good buck-and build toward a good retirement? 

 

By the way, what is the start rate off the street??

And as for  the repetitive issue you do get the chance to rotate jobs to some degree?

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36 minutes ago, Bob Rosadini said:

Fuzzy,

Always appreciate your views from the "line"but what am I missing?  I appreciate how the repetitive nature of most assembly line jobs can wear on you, but how can you compare a job at Wendy's with a UAW job if you stick it out?  Or are you saying new hires will  never be around long enough to progress through the wage progression scale to earn a good buck-and build toward a good retirement? 

 

By the way, what is the start rate off the street??

And as for  the repetitive issue you do get the chance to rotate jobs to some degree?


Nobody understands entry level and working your way up over your career.  They want instant gratification with no effort.

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32 minutes ago, Bob Rosadini said:

Fuzzy,

Always appreciate your views from the "line"but what am I missing?  I appreciate how the repetitive nature of most assembly line jobs can wear on you, but how can you compare a job at Wendy's with a UAW job if you stick it out?  Or are you saying new hires will  never be around long enough to progress through the wage progression scale to earn a good buck-and build toward a good retirement? 


Good questions. Starting wage is $16.67 with no insurance benefits. What’s been happening is once you experience how fast the line moves, how much you have to do in not much time, and how much micromanaging that goes on a lot more people than what there used to be have been deciding to leave and never come back, sometimes before the end of their first day on the line. That has always happened but it's getting worse. I've done both jobs (my first job was at McDonald's). For that kind of money I would much rather do that than work here and not have nearly as much hassle. 
 

 

36 minutes ago, Bob Rosadini said:

 

And as for  the repetitive issue you do get the chance to rotate jobs to some degree?


Depends on the plant. We rotate every day in body because of the way our operating agreement is structured. There's not a job in here you can't learn relatively quickly.  It's much, much different in final where you have 3 days doubled up with someone (2 people on 1 job) to learn that job and if you don't you’re moved elsewhere. They don't rotate at all over there unless you’re in the pool and I've been there before, it sucks. A lot. A lot easier to rotate and keep up quality when robots are involved rather than final assembly where everything is done by hand. Quality would suffer even more if they rotated. 

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22 minutes ago, akirby said:


Nobody understands entry level and working your way up over your career.  They want instant gratification with no effort.


Its not necessarily a matter of instant gratification, though I'm sure for some that's part of it. The hours are very long, the conditions on the floor can get rough, especially in the middle of summer, and there's a ton of pressure to keep things moving. We make it look easy because we've been doing it for years and most have forgotten what it was like the first few weeks. I'm not far enough removed to have forgotten that. I remember going home after that first night and having my entire body hurt and the sheer exhaustion from keeping up with the line. 

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35 minutes ago, bzcat said:

I think it is a lot more clear now why Hau Thai-Tang decided to retire. Ford Blue is on managed decline and Hau doesn't want to stick around for that. 

 

That's correct bzcat. Same deal for the other Ford executive that retired at the same time as Thai-Tang, Frederiek Toney. Toney was VP of Customer Service for Ford Blue Division. That division's managed decline will significantly impact its customer service functions, and Toney figured it wasn't worth sticking around for that.

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21 minutes ago, akirby said:


Nobody understands entry level and working your way up over your career.  They want instant gratification with no effort.

 

So true. The last 15-20 years I'll say, new hires come in with a sense of entitlement that they're owed something. It has nothing to do with doing your homework, doing your best, learning as much as you can, contributing, developing a career, etc. Oh no, they just want to walk in the door, put their time in regardless of how productive they are, and put their hand out because they're owed. The work ethic is simply horrible with so many. Schools keep lowering standards and parents don't lead by example, set standards and expectations, etc.   

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3 hours ago, fuzzymoomoo said:


Its not necessarily a matter of instant gratification, though I'm sure for some that's part of it. The hours are very long, the conditions on the floor can get rough, especially in the middle of summer, and there's a ton of pressure to keep things moving. We make it look easy because we've been doing it for years and most have forgotten what it was like the first few weeks. I'm not far enough removed to have forgotten that. I remember going home after that first night and having my entire body hurt and the sheer exhaustion from keeping up with the line. 


But where is the auto worker 5 yrs later vs the McDonald’s worker?

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20 minutes ago, akirby said:

But where is the auto worker 5 yrs later vs the McDonald’s worker?

 

Depends on each worker's goals and aptitude. One thing is for sure, the auto worker is much more likely to end up on long term disability 5 years later. Got a few friends retired from GM Arlington Assembly who have a host of health issues directly tied to working at an auto assembly plant, and they know other workers with severe injuries they suffered on the job.

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2 hours ago, rperez817 said:

 

Depends on each worker's goals and aptitude. One thing is for sure, the auto worker is much more likely to end up on long term disability 5 years later. Got a few friends retired from GM Arlington Assembly who have a host of health issues directly tied to working at an auto assembly plant, and they know other workers with severe injuries they suffered on the job.


Im only 9 years in and I have problems with pinched nerves and tendinitis I'll be dealing with for the rest of my life. 

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4 hours ago, fuzzymoomoo said:


Im only 9 years in and I have problems with pinched nerves and tendinitis I'll be dealing with for the rest of my life. 

I think all of us autoworkers have some kind of pain we’re dealing with whether it be pinched nerves, carpal tunnel, back and hip issues etc yet ppl say we’re just overpaid button pushers. We’re at these factories banging out these vehicles and are getting repetitive strain injuries. I feel your pain bro.

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Not to get side tracked, but to follow up on what Fuzzy was saying and some additional following comments...

 

For those who haven't worked in a plant you won't fully understand. Seems like a cop out explanation, sure. However, its hard to accurately convey in words how physically demanding some line jobs can be. While the working conditions in the plants has improved a lot in 50 years, it can still be pretty bad (repetition, air quality and heat being the top 3). The plants themselves are dangerous.  People get injured and yes sometimes die on the job. These things easily get overlooked, when you see some final assembly press video where somebody in a clean plant looks like they are barely working doing post production inspections.   

 

Things were better for the UAW factory workers, pre financial crisis. Fast forward to now,  where minimum wage is trending toward 15 bucks an hour (if not there already in some places) and fast food workers want a living wage. I will say it, fast workers are the lowest common denominator. I've worked it when I was 16 and 17. It's even worse now as automation, lack of good workers, and cell phones have made the attention span of a fast food worker even less. The biggest concern for a fast food manager is, "will the employee show up today?" and not "will this employee do a good or at least marginal job today?".

 

With low entry level pay/no or low benefits for the UAW factory jobs today and only the promise that in 5 years or so they could be making more, do you think there are a lot of folks that want to do that? I'm going to say no. I'd go to work Starbucks or Target for 5 years in A/C  and try upgrade my skillset for a better paying job. 

 

This is why wages need to increase. You can't give away money to the lowest workers and not have a ripple effect up the chain.

 

/end rant

 

 

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1 hour ago, akirby said:

If they can’t get workers at entry level they’ll be forced to raise wages.


Thats my whole point. They can't. None of the big 3 can right now. Despite that it's going to be a fight to raise the wage, especially when Ford cries broke in the media every chance they get. 

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7 hours ago, CKNSLS said:

$16.67  an hour is terrible...especially on an assembly line. 

It wasn’t bad back in 2010 when the two tiered wages were instituted, but it hasn’t kept up with the changing labor market.  I thought there was a cost of living adjustment made to the wages or was that eliminated.

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9 hours ago, CKNSLS said:

$16.67  an hour is terrible...especially on an assembly line. 

Unfortunately, we are headed into a recession.  I think a lot of things will change including the full scale push to EVs. A year from now people will be begging for jobs and the Big Three can more or less get what they want.  Job security may trump higher wages.

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7 hours ago, slemke said:

It wasn’t bad back in 2010 when the two tiered wages were instituted, but it hasn’t kept up with the changing labor market.  I thought there was a cost of living adjustment made to the wages or was that eliminated.


it was only $15.67 when I started 9 years ago. There was also zero hope of ever getting to what I make now because of an arbitrary formula heavily tilted in favor of the company. That was eliminated in 2015. 

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On 7/19/2022 at 11:58 AM, slemke said:

Perhaps.  He likely saw what was coming for product development and funding for what he would be working on and didn’t want a part of it.  Better to retire in good standing.  He’s young.  I’m sure he will pop up at a supplier or startup doing something he enjoys.

Wasn't he part of this?  Ford's future EV architecture?

Electric-bronco.jpg

 

He's turning 56 this year by the way. Not sure if you'd consider that young considering how a lot of guys in the auto Industry seem to retire in their early/mid 60s.

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