'23 Escape May Get New Trim Names

[bzcat]

1 hour ago, Harley Lover said:

 

Solve the distribution issue first. H2 doesn't have infrastructure, nor does it have political momentum behind it to make the infrastructure happen.

 

Or basic chemsitry. You can't make Hydrogen without consuming more energy than the resulting output. It's a fools errant.

 

Hydrogen will have limited application but it will never be widely deployed for vehicle transportation. Anyone that thinks otherwise needs to retake 10th grade physics and chemistry classes. 

[silvrsvt]

29 minutes ago, bzcat said:

 

Or basic chemsitry. You can't make Hydrogen without consuming more energy than the resulting output. It's a fools errant.

 

Hydrogen will have limited application but it will never be widely deployed for vehicle transportation. Anyone that thinks otherwise needs to retake 10th grade physics and chemistry classes. 

 

Then why are some manufactures thinking its "the way of the future" then?

[bzcat]

On 9/9/2022 at 10:09 AM, silvrsvt said:

 

Then why are some manufactures thinking its "the way of the future" then?

 

Hydrogen cheerleaders generally fall into 3 camps:

 

1. Fossil fuel shills: Since the only semi-efficient way to make hydrogen is with natural gas/methane (CH4), it locks in dependency on fossil fuel. Fracking companies are especially fond of hydrogen because it ensures continue demand for natural gas and reliance on gas pipelines.They are the new version of the "clean coal" backer. Most people on TV talking about a hydrogen future falls in this camp.

 

2. Charge time obsessives: People who hand wrings needlessly about how long it takes to fully charge a BEV but totally ignores real life experience of BEV owners who rarely if ever fully charge their EVs. Most EV on the market will get meaningful range if you plug it into level 2 charger for 10-15 minutes or so and this will get better/faster overtime. This camp is basically stuck in the gas station frame of mind... they think it is essential to refuel your vehicle in a minute or less so they want hydrogen. Nevermind that the average car sits parked for 22 hours a day where it can charge. But they also generally do not understand the infrastructure investment required to make that happen vs. electricity which is already available in every home and business. Toyota's misguided backing for hydrogen falls in this camp. 

 

3. Science illiterates: This includes most of the politicians that advocates for hydrogen and keyboard warriors on the internet. This camp likes to blather about a magical alternative reality where hydrogen molecules are not somehow tightly bonded to other elements and takes enormous amount of energy to seperate it from carbon or oxygen, the two most common sources.

 

We shouldn't miss the forest for the tree... the reason we are trying to decarbonize our transportation system is because all the carbon. Hydrogen production doesn't reduce carbon emission in a significant way because the inherent inefficiency - in fact, given the same amount of energy requirement, hydrogen is one of the least efficient storage medium. Let me try an analogy... let say you need pay $5 for a cup of coffee at Starbucks and you have a $100 bill. Instead of using that $100 bill to pay for $5 cup of coffee, you shred the $100 bill so you can sell the waste paper to recycler for $5 and use that $5 to pay for coffee.  That's what producing hydrogen from another energy source is like in concept.

 

As I have mentioned before many times on this forum, hydrogen makes a lot of sense in some settings. For localized or closed loop network that require zero emission, hydrogen is a plausible alternative. You'll need to be located close to the source of hydrogen production and/or storage to minimize the transportation costs. But no matter how you make hydrogen, it is alway more efficient to use the raw source as the fuel. Burning the natural gas uses less carbon than converting it hydrogen. Using nuclear power to charge BEV is more efficient than using that power to make hydrogen. The basic physics cannot be changed. 

Edited September 14, 2022 by bzcat

[CLTEcoBoost]

So where the heck is the '23 Escape?  Corsair has been revealed and it looks like the next reveal is of the Super Duty pickups on the 27th.  I thought the order banks for the '23 Escape opened tomorrow, but without a reveal?

[j2sys]

1 hour ago, CLTEcoBoost said:

So where the heck is the '23 Escape?  Corsair has been revealed and it looks like the next reveal is of the Super Duty pickups on the 27th.  I thought the order banks for the '23 Escape opened tomorrow, but without a reveal?

 

Good question.  Unless it's changed, the latest info indicates that MY 2023 Escape order bank opens up tomorrow.  Even with NAIAS underway, no official word of the Escape refresh has been released.  Did they forget?  Are they just going to do what Apple sometimes does which is to announce a refreshed model with a press release at the time it becomes available?

 

 

Edited September 18, 2022 by j2sys

[CLTEcoBoost]

On 9/18/2022 at 10:05 AM, j2sys said:

 

Good question.  Unless it's changed, the latest info indicates that MY 2023 Escape order bank opens up tomorrow.  Even with NAIAS underway, no official word of the Escape refresh has been released.  Did they forget?  Are they just going to do what Apple sometimes does which is to announce a refreshed model with a press release at the time it becomes available?

Wanna bet that Ford is redoing trim levels and content?

 

On 9/18/2022 at 10:05 AM, j2sys said:

 

 

[akirby]

27 minutes ago, CLTEcoBoost said:

 

Wanna bet that Ford is redoing trim levels and content?

I’ll take that bet.  They would have most likely delayed the order guide if that was the case.  I mean, they should redo them but I doubt it.

[j2sys]

39 minutes ago, CLTEcoBoost said:

 

 

 

Not sure why you quoted me as my questions haven't been answered.

 

So far, dealers have today received the order guide which @ice-capades has kindly shared with us, as well as the price list which we do not have.

 

Order bank is listed to open today - that thread was my source.

 

No public announcement has been made about it.

 

Apparently they don't even have a 2023 Escape on the show floor at NAIAS, although the refreshed Corsair is there.

[ice-capades]

27 minutes ago, j2sys said:

So far, dealers have today received the order guide which @ice-capades has kindly shared with us, as well as the price list which we do not have.

 

Order bank is listed to open today - that thread was my source.

 

No public announcement has been made about it.

 

Apparently they don't even have a 2023 Escape on the show floor at NAIAS, although the refreshed Corsair is there.

 

As posted earlier in the 2023 Escape Order Guide thread...

 

The 2023 Escape Price List (PL315) was released to Dealers this morning. The USOB (Unscheduled Order Bank) will open when both the 2023MY vehicle specifications and prices are available in the WBDO (Web Based Dealer Ordering) system. The vehicle specifications and prices are not yet available in WBDO. 2023MY Escape scheduling is due to start on 10/20/2022. 

Edited September 19, 2022 by ice-capades
Additional Content

[j2sys]

22 minutes ago, ice-capades said:

 

As posted earlier in the 2023 Escape Order Guide thread...

 

The 2023 Escape Price List (PL315) was released to Dealers this morning. The USOB (Unscheduled Order Bank) will open when both the 2023MY vehicle specifications and prices are available in the WBDO (Web Based Dealer Ordering) system. The vehicle specifications and prices are not yet available in WBDO. 2023MY Escape scheduling is due to start on 10/20/2022. 

 

Just in case you thought I was contradicting you, I wasn't.   Thanks as always for the helpful info.

[ice-capades]

• The USOB (Unscheduled Order Bank) is now open and accepting 2023MY Escape orders. 

[rperez817]

 

On 8/29/2022 at 10:52 AM, Chrisgb said:

The 2023  will have "Active" badging For 2024, It will be decontented to "Activ."

 

On 8/29/2022 at 1:25 PM, fuzzymoomoo said:

And  in 2025 it will just be "Actv"

 

In all seriousness, Ford is now facing issues getting enough badges (Blue Oval and model/trim) to affix to its vehicles. This WSJ article says F-Series is affected. No mention on whether Escape is or not. Ford’s Latest Supply-Chain Problem: a Shortage of Blue Oval Badges - WSJ

 

Ford Motor Co. has delayed deliveries of certain vehicles because it didn’t have the blue oval badges that go on them, in another example of how supply-chain challenges have hit auto makers.

The car company has run into supply constraints with the brand-name badges and the nameplates that specify the model, according to people familiar with the matter. Both parts are affixed to the vehicle’s exterior and are important identifiers for the auto maker’s products. A company spokesman confirmed it has held some vehicle shipments because of a lack of badges.

[j2sys]

27 minutes ago, rperez817 said:

 

 

 

In all seriousness, Ford is now facing issues getting enough badges (Blue Oval and model/trim) to affix to its vehicles. This WSJ article says F-Series is affected. No mention on whether Escape is or not. Ford’s Latest Supply-Chain Problem: a Shortage of Blue Oval Badges - WSJ

 

 

 

 

Wow, I guess the teasing herein was spot on.  Way to go, Ford...

Edited September 24, 2022 by j2sys

[Chrisgb]

23 hours ago, rperez817 said:

 

 

 

In all seriousness, Ford is now facing issues getting enough badges (Blue Oval and model/trim) to affix to its vehicles. This WSJ article says F-Series is affected. No mention on whether Escape is or not. Ford’s Latest Supply-Chain Problem: a Shortage of Blue Oval Badges - WSJ

 

 

 

In 1960, when Ford discontinued the Edsel, Ford had a sister car to the Falcon in the works that was to be marketed under the Edsel banner. The car debuted under the  Mercury banner in 1962 as a Comet but with no Mercury badging inside or out until the 1963 model year. Anonymous '62 Comets don't have the same caché as  split window 'Vettes, but folks bought them, anyway. 

Edited September 25, 2022 by Chrisgb