rmc523 Posted January 4, 2023 Share Posted January 4, 2023 14 hours ago, dds010 said: Off topic but I find it a blunder that Lincoln didn’t captioize off of the 2018-2021 Navigators double DRL design motif. They “slimmed down” the headlights and took away the double DRL which was on of it distinguishing features. Whether you noticed the car or not, the big double DRL made it instantly recognizable as the navigator and that should have spread through the lineup A la Cadillac with the huge vertical DRL from Escalade or the Double white/amber DRL in Genesis models. with such few achievements in recent memory, you’d think they would take a lil element like the double DRL and take advantage of it it’s like no one in their company thinks of things like this. I remember about 6-7 years ago I was posting how it’s ridiculous that they have sync and ecoboost badging/branding on their vehicles and and even people of this site were giving me a hard time as if I was crazy eh, the double DRL didn’t do anything for me…if anything it looked like they were trying to fill space so they copy-pasted the DRL. 5 hours ago, akirby said: Thats why they created the Blackwood - to give Lincoln dealers something to sell after killing Conti and before Aviator in 03. haha, Blackwood redux with carpeted frunk and regular bed so that it’s actually useful? Lol 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted January 4, 2023 Share Posted January 4, 2023 57 minutes ago, rmc523 said: eh, the double DRL didn’t do anything for me…if anything it looked like they were trying to fill space so they copy-pasted the DRL. haha, Blackwood redux with carpeted frunk and regular bed so that it’s actually useful? Lol When I bought my 2000 LS they were running a special - buy a Blackwood at MSRP and get a Cougar for free! Cougars at the time were about $19k and that’s about the same discount they had to put on the Blackwood to sell them towards the end. So same discount but a much more clever marketing scheme. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmc523 Posted January 5, 2023 Share Posted January 5, 2023 On 1/4/2023 at 1:18 PM, akirby said: When I bought my 2000 LS they were running a special - buy a Blackwood at MSRP and get a Cougar for free! Cougars at the time were about $19k and that’s about the same discount they had to put on the Blackwood to sell them towards the end. So same discount but a much more clever marketing scheme. I liked the look of them, but the bed arrangement plus 4 seat setup certainly limited appeal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dds010 Posted January 8, 2023 Share Posted January 8, 2023 On 1/4/2023 at 12:44 PM, rmc523 said: eh, the double DRL didn’t do anything for me…if anything it looked like they were trying to fill space so they copy-pasted the DRL. haha, Blackwood redux with carpeted frunk and regular bed so that it’s actually useful? Lol The point I was making is that those double DRL, whether to your liking or not, was a unique easily identifiable element and with a brand with almost zero hallmark or unique design traits since the suicide door continentals or yore, when they finally struck somewhat gold with the 2k18 Navigator, the double DRLs should have been a element that they went forward with. look at the acclaim Escalade front lighting elements get. Look at the acclaim that the new genesis models get for their lighting designs. NOW LOOLAT HOW EASILY IDENTIFIABLE AND UNIQUE BOTH ARE: THATS what I’m talking about. Now look at the updated headlights, there’s literally nothing undistinguishable about them from other vehicles Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted January 8, 2023 Share Posted January 8, 2023 Wait - you think the Caddy lights get “acclaim”? I don’t know anybody that likes them. Nobody buys a vehicle because of the lights. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tbone Posted January 8, 2023 Share Posted January 8, 2023 1 hour ago, akirby said: Wait - you think the Caddy lights get “acclaim”? I don’t know anybody that likes them. Nobody buys a vehicle because of the lights. The new Caddy has no presence, mostly because of the front end treatment, IMO. The Yukon is a significantly better looking vehicle with much better presence. I know this strays from the light discussion a bit, lol. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dds010 Posted January 8, 2023 Share Posted January 8, 2023 15 hours ago, akirby said: Wait - you think the Caddy lights get “acclaim”? I don’t know anybody that likes them. Nobody buys a vehicle because of the lights. And this is where these forums become very muddled. You say YOU don’t know anyone that likes them. The Escalade leads this segment in sales two fold, they have a V model that none of the other BOF makes can compete with and it essentially is synonymous with this segment BUT yet because you yourself don’t like it, you’ve allowed that to cloud your judgment SO MUCH to the point that you state that you don’t know anyone that likes it. Lol a vehicle that sales almost as much as all the competitors combined, largely based off its engine and its styling (because Navi has pretty much always been a better functional SUV) and yet you think skewed “people I know” mind frame holds merit? PRICELESS that’s prob the exact mindset of ford executives that have allowed Lincoln to sit second fiddle since the 60s 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dds010 Posted January 8, 2023 Share Posted January 8, 2023 14 hours ago, tbone said: The new Caddy has no presence, mostly because of the front end treatment, IMO. The Yukon is a significantly better looking vehicle with much better presence. I know this strays from the light discussion a bit, lol. In YOUR OPINION, once again, this is comical. Now you may not like the Escalade front end treatment, and I don’t particularly like it myself, but to say that it doesn’t have PRESENCE is just disingenuous, that’s the MAIN thing is has for better or worse and it’s easily identifiable for what it is and that’s the point I was trying to make. You need brand identities and whether you liked them or not, the double DRL were unique. In daylight or nighttime, when you see a Escalade or a Genesis, you IMMEDIATELY KNOW WHAT YOU’RE LOOKING AT FOR BETTER OR WORSE. Now look at the refreshed Navi headlight elements and you don’t know what particular vehicle it may be and Combine that with a grille that’s also not distinct furthermore, look at this Chinese nautilus and the zephyr, when the average person sees them, THEY HAVE NO CLUE WHAT KIND OF VEHICLE THE LOOKING AT, and that’s a major issue Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tarheels23 Posted January 8, 2023 Share Posted January 8, 2023 42 minutes ago, dds010 said: And this is where these forums become very muddled. You say YOU don’t know anyone that likes them. The Escalade leads this segment in sales two fold, they have a V model that none of the other BOF makes can compete with and it essentially is synonymous with this segment BUT yet because you yourself don’t like it, you’ve allowed that to cloud your judgment SO MUCH to the point that you state that you don’t know anyone that likes it. Lol a vehicle that sales almost as much as all the competitors combined, largely based off its engine and its styling (because Navi has pretty much always been a better functional SUV) and yet you think skewed “people I know” mind frame holds merit? PRICELESS that’s prob the exact mindset of ford executives that have allowed Lincoln to sit second fiddle since the 60s had an uncle who was sponsored on TV and radio by White Lilly Flour with the tagline, 'White Lilly the Cadillac of the Flours'. Not always the product but the cache' Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tbone Posted January 8, 2023 Share Posted January 8, 2023 1 hour ago, dds010 said: In YOUR OPINION, once again, this is comical. Now you may not like the Escalade front end treatment, and I don’t particularly like it myself, but to say that it doesn’t have PRESENCE is just disingenuous, that’s the MAIN thing is has for better or worse and it’s easily identifiable for what it is and that’s the point I was trying to make. You need brand identities and whether you liked them or not, the double DRL were unique. In daylight or nighttime, when you see a Escalade or a Genesis, you IMMEDIATELY KNOW WHAT YOU’RE LOOKING AT FOR BETTER OR WORSE. Now look at the refreshed Navi headlight elements and you don’t know what particular vehicle it may be and Combine that with a grille that’s also not distinct furthermore, look at this Chinese nautilus and the zephyr, when the average person sees them, THEY HAVE NO CLUE WHAT KIND OF VEHICLE THE LOOKING AT, and that’s a major issue Last time I checked, looks were subjective, so no, I’m not being disingenuous. I also didn’t say the Caddy lights were junk, but I also look at it from the totality of the package, and lights are not a deciding factor for me. Now I understand what you are saying, and my Raptor’s amber markers, are a unique lighting characteristic that helps make it noticeable, aside from all the aftermarket lights out there mimicking the look now. But it just isn’t something I care about that much, other than wanting the headlights to be LEDS. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted January 8, 2023 Share Posted January 8, 2023 2 hours ago, dds010 said: And this is where these forums become very muddled. You say YOU don’t know anyone that likes them. The Escalade leads this segment in sales two fold, they have a V model that none of the other BOF makes can compete with and it essentially is synonymous with this segment BUT yet because you yourself don’t like it, you’ve allowed that to cloud your judgment SO MUCH to the point that you state that you don’t know anyone that likes it. Lol a vehicle that sales almost as much as all the competitors combined, largely based off its engine and its styling (because Navi has pretty much always been a better functional SUV) and yet you think skewed “people I know” mind frame holds merit? PRICELESS that’s prob the exact mindset of ford executives that have allowed Lincoln to sit second fiddle since the 60s Escalades (and Suburbans and Tahoes) were #1 far before vertical lights and V series. And when I say I don’t know anyone that includes public media. You say they’re acclaimed - so where is the Acclaim? Truth is lights are just one small design feature that has very little impact on sales. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joseodiaga4 Posted March 1, 2023 Author Share Posted March 1, 2023 more "spy" pics: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jniffen Posted March 1, 2023 Share Posted March 1, 2023 45 minutes ago, joseodiaga4 said: more "spy" pics: Glad I ordered a ‘23 Nautilus. Don’t like the front or back, look more KIA than Lincoln. The sales in China will improve or not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jniffen Posted March 1, 2023 Share Posted March 1, 2023 On 1/3/2023 at 7:39 AM, SmartKid001 said: It's not as bad as I previously thought but that rear light......?? No, it’s worse. ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
escapeman Posted March 1, 2023 Share Posted March 1, 2023 Not sure myself if I am liking it or not. I do not mind the front end , as it is an evolution of the current front clip. The rear bar tail lights appear to have too much of an angle to them. My lease is up exactly a year from now on my 21. Looks like the timing will be right if they do decide to bring it across the pacific. I would have thought we would have something more concrete by now, that is unless the new Bevs out of Oakville or wherever are not going to be ready for prime time on time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted March 1, 2023 Share Posted March 1, 2023 If they import it I’d bet that they give it the current NA family grille. I don’t hate it but much prefer the current one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvrsvt Posted March 1, 2023 Share Posted March 1, 2023 I like the front end of it, but those spy shots with the glare isn’t doing it any favors-you can’t even see the D pillar that is in gloss black in the picture. It’s not bad at all IMO, just I think the photos don’t help and I’d need to see it in person. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmc523 Posted March 1, 2023 Share Posted March 1, 2023 4 hours ago, akirby said: If they import it I’d bet that they give it the current NA family grille. I don’t hate it but much prefer the current one. Why would they do that when we've seen the Aviator refresh is going to this look? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted March 1, 2023 Share Posted March 1, 2023 34 minutes ago, rmc523 said: Why would they do that when we've seen the Aviator refresh is going to this look? Are we sure that’s the NA version? Isn’t Aviator sold in China? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ausrutherford Posted March 3, 2023 Share Posted March 3, 2023 On 3/1/2023 at 12:20 PM, akirby said: Are we sure that’s the NA version? Isn’t Aviator sold in China? Built and sold. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tbone Posted March 3, 2023 Share Posted March 3, 2023 I like it. I think it would sell here, just as it sits. Now just build it here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tbone Posted March 3, 2023 Share Posted March 3, 2023 (edited) Deleted duplicate post. Edited March 3, 2023 by tbone Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joseodiaga4 Posted March 10, 2023 Author Share Posted March 10, 2023 hybrid model: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmc523 Posted March 10, 2023 Share Posted March 10, 2023 2 hours ago, joseodiaga4 said: hybrid model: I like that lower/silver version. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tbone Posted March 10, 2023 Share Posted March 10, 2023 49 minutes ago, rmc523 said: I like that lower/silver version. Too bad you won’t be able to buy one here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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