Megazilla

[Broncofan7]

I didn't see any other topics about this.

 

Ford Megazilla crate engine revealed with 615 hp (motorauthority.com)

 

615HP - 7.3L MEGAZILLA Crate Engine is Here!!! | PRI 2022 - YouTube

[Rick73]

I’m impressed they gain 35% greater peak torque and at lower RPM.  Power gain speaks for itself, especially with same CR so it can run on pump gas, but the 640 lb-ft at 3,800 RPM is what I like best.  Perhaps some of that improvement will make it to Super Duty 7.3 and 6.8L V8s.  A bump from 475 to 500 lb-ft or greater sounds more likely to me now.  Lower profile intake should make dropping into classic cars that much easier.

[coupe3w]

I love it. Great swap motor. LS what? LOL

Edited December 13, 2022 by coupe3w

[tbone]

I’m surprised such little discussion about this motor.  I find these power numbers to be excellent for an NA motor.   I wish a version of this was the base motor in the Raptor.  

[coupe3w]

29 minutes ago, tbone said:

I’m surprised such little discussion about this motor.  I find these power numbers to be excellent for an NA motor.   I wish a version of this was the base motor in the Raptor.  

Raptor and Mustang GT / Dark Horse.

 

[Broncofan7]

6 hours ago, tbone said:

I’m surprised such little discussion about this motor.  I find these power numbers to be excellent for an NA motor.   I wish a version of this was the base motor in the Raptor.  

 

6 hours ago, coupe3w said:

Raptor and Mustang GT / Dark Horse.

 

 

I always pictured what is described in your posts as the rumored 6.8 that was mentioned to go in variants of the Mustang and F150. If they can get good performance out of it, it could go in a Shelby or some other Mustang variant (I like a Boss as a possibility). And the Raptor would get a V8 people could actually somewhat afford.

[tbone]

1 hour ago, Broncofan7 said:

 

 

I always pictured what is described in your posts as the rumored 6.8 that was mentioned to go in variants of the Mustang and F150. If they can get good performance out of it, it could go in a Shelby or some other Mustang variant (I like a Boss as a possibility). And the Raptor would get a V8 people could actually somewhat afford.

If you gave this or the 6.8l as an option for Raptor buyers, I would bet that 95% of them would choose these over the 3.5l.  That’s not meant to say the 3.5 isn’t a good motor, but I believe people simply want the V8. This would absolutely meet the needs of most Raptor buyers, and be significantly cheaper than The 5.2l.  

[Broncofan7]

12 hours ago, tbone said:

If you gave this or the 6.8l as an option for Raptor buyers, I would bet that 95% of them would choose these over the 3.5l.  That’s not meant to say the 3.5 isn’t a good motor, but I believe people simply want the V8. This would absolutely meet the needs of most Raptor buyers, and be significantly cheaper than The 5.2l.  

 

I agree completely. Without any data to back it up, I think that Raptor owners would be far more likely than the average F150 buyer to prefer a V8. The 3.5 HO is good, but there is some portion of the Raptor segment that was somewhat turned off by it and could be better served by a V8.

 

Heck, even the talk of a Ranger Raptor R with a Coyote shows how Raptor people can like V8s.

Edited December 16, 2022 by Broncofan7

[jpd80]

4 hours ago, Broncofan7 said:

 

I agree completely. Without any data to back it up, I think that Raptor owners would be far more likely than the average F150 buyer to prefer a V8. The 3.5 HO is good, but there is some portion of the Raptor segment that was somewhat turned off by it and could be better served by a V8.

 

Heck, even the talk of a Ranger Raptor R with a Coyote shows how Raptor people can like V8s.

Also something to consider, maybe electrified vehicles permit sufficient CAFE/EPA offset to permit certain indulgences…..

[tbone]

1 hour ago, jpd80 said:

Also something to consider, maybe electrified vehicles permit sufficient CAFE/EPA offset to permit certain indulgences…..

Good point.  The Lightnings should be providing some offset. 

[Broncofan7]

On 12/16/2022 at 4:20 PM, jpd80 said:

Also something to consider, maybe electrified vehicles permit sufficient CAFE/EPA offset to permit certain indulgences…..

 

I think you're right. Look at the advertising emphasis on the v8 in the Mustang specs video, f150 raptor r, talk of a ranger raptor r, etc. You don't really hear that kind of stuff much anymore. And Megazilla is another extension of that too, though as a crate engine.

[tbone]

21 hours ago, Broncofan7 said:

 

I think you're right. Look at the advertising emphasis on the v8 in the Mustang specs video, f150 raptor r, talk of a ranger raptor r, etc. You don't really hear that kind of stuff much anymore. And Megazilla is another extension of that too, though as a crate engine.

I would like to think it is a situation where Ford can’t build what people want due to regulatory issues versus they won’t build what people want because they are taking away resources to meet those future regulatory requirements.  
 

Nobody in my circle of friends and family are even talking about EVs. I live in a truck heavy area and I suspect they are still being viewed as a novelty at this point because of perceived limitations.   The GM dealers have several new trucks on their lots that have been sitting because they are the 4 cylinders. Not one V8 in the lot to be had. Fords V6s are good, but there is still plenty of room for the V8, especially ones they have already put the work into. 
 

Like you say, it wasn’t that long ago they would have been screaming about the virtues of their new V8s.  Not anymore.  

[Broncofan7]

1 hour ago, tbone said:

I would like to think it is a situation where Ford can’t build what people want due to regulatory issues versus they won’t build what people want because they are taking away resources to meet those future regulatory requirements.  
 

Nobody in my circle of friends and family are even talking about EVs. I live in a truck heavy area and I suspect they are still being viewed as a novelty at this point because of perceived limitations.   The GM dealers have several new trucks on their lots that have been sitting because they are the 4 cylinders. Not one V8 in the lot to be had. Fords V6s are good, but there is still plenty of room for the V8, especially ones they have already put the work into. 
 

Like you say, it wasn’t that long ago they would have been screaming about the virtues of their new V8s.  Not anymore.  

 

In my own personal life no one wants an electric vehicle to be honest. I'm usually one of the few car people that talks about this stuff, but people I have talked to have only wanted reliable gas transportation. Where I differ from them is wanting loud V8s, just because I love the sound, feel, etc. But they all think that electric is a boondoggle, to use nice language.

 

I think that the Ecoboost is really good too. I drove the Ecoboost Ranger and it was fun! But, if it was my money really on the line (and with prices so high), I'd want a V8 to "have it all" to get my money's worth.

 

Personally, I think that that whatever source of power- Electric, V8, Ecoboost, etc.- people want for their life is fine. I have no right to force my views on anyone. If electric is what someone wants, cool! If not, that's cool too.

 

I am sure that there are many others like me too.

[tbone]

6 hours ago, Broncofan7 said:

 

In my own personal life no one wants an electric vehicle to be honest. I'm usually one of the few car people that talks about this stuff, but people I have talked to have only wanted reliable gas transportation. Where I differ from them is wanting loud V8s, just because I love the sound, feel, etc. But they all think that electric is a boondoggle, to use nice language.

 

I think that the Ecoboost is really good too. I drove the Ecoboost Ranger and it was fun! But, if it was my money really on the line (and with prices so high), I'd want a V8 to "have it all" to get my money's worth.

 

Personally, I think that that whatever source of power- Electric, V8, Ecoboost, etc.- people want for their life is fine. I have no right to force my views on anyone. If electric is what someone wants, cool! If not, that's cool too.

 

I am sure that there are many others like me too.

I think you summed it up nicely.  My only issue is losing options because of government policy.  That’s what disappoints me.  If electric is best, let it win out on its own.  

[ESP08]

On 12/12/2022 at 11:05 PM, Rick73 said:

I’m impressed they gain 35% greater peak torque and at lower RPM.  Power gain speaks for itself, especially with same CR so it can run on pump gas, but the 640 lb-ft at 3,800 RPM is what I like best.  Perhaps some of that improvement will make it to Super Duty 7.3 and 6.8L V8s.  A bump from 475 to 500 lb-ft or greater sounds more likely to me now.  Lower profile intake should make dropping into classic cars that much easier.

 

I seriously doubt anything translates   

 

Megazilla comes with CNC ported heads, big cam with no VCT, forged rods/pistons, new intake manifold, etc.   

 

Results are pretty typical of modified "heads/cam/intake" and I don't see how any of it will translate to a warrantied production engine with durability, NVH, emissions and cost metrics that need to be met.    

Edited December 20, 2022 by ESP08

[silvrsvt]

7 hours ago, tbone said:

I think you summed it up nicely.  My only issue is losing options because of government policy.  That’s what disappoints me.  If electric is best, let it win out on its own.  

So let’s put this way-one of the major reasons why fuel injection was introduced in the 1980s was because of better gas mileage and emissions control…both because of government mandates. 
 

Fuel injection existed for years prior to this, but had issues with cost and complexity, but manufacturers kept using carburetors because they where cheaper but had distinct issues with them like cold weather startup. 
 

don’t disregard change becuase one of the major reasons it doesn’t happen is because of cost and when it needs to happen, normally companies/people are forced too. 

[Rick73]

9 hours ago, ESP08 said:

 

I seriously doubt anything translates   

 

Megazilla comes with CNC ported heads, big cam with no VCT, forged rods/pistons, new intake manifold, etc.   

 

Results are pretty typical of modified "heads/cam/intake" and I don't see how any of it will translate to a warrantied production engine with durability, NVH, emissions and cost metrics that need to be met.    

 

Ford hasn’t published new Super Duty engine ratings yet, so it is reasonable that if different than 2022, they will likely be to the up side.  I think 500 lb-ft would be a great target if they can achieve it.

 

In video the Ford rep says the new intake and 92 mm throttle body provide 10 HP and extra 15 lb-ft across most of range; and that it can be fitted to existing engines.   Even though a lower profile intake isn’t needed for Super Duty, it suggest modifications in that area alone could bump HP and torque a bit.  He also mentions new cam is responsible for much of gain, and while I agree that particular unit is probably not suitable for production engine, it may be possible for a new cam to gain a bit more power and torque and still be legal.

 

Rep also mentioned production pistons and rods being weak link when supercharging engine, which may be reason they were upgraded in anticipation some of these engines will be supercharged.  A naturally aspirated production engine may not need stronger pistons and rods.  Hard to say.

 

With diesel cost being around 50% higher than gasoline per gallon, it seems that Ford would try to upgrade gas towing as much as practical, even if it adds a little cost to engine.  Assuming 7.3L premium engine needs new pistons and rods to increase power, it should not add much cost compared to diesel option.  Please understand I know that upgrading the 7.3L will not allow it to compete with diesel at the upper limit, but any additional gasoline towing capability may be enough to attract new buyers.

[Stray Kat]

1 hour ago, Rick73 said:

 

Ford hasn’t published new Super Duty engine ratings yet, so it is reasonable that if different than 2022, they will likely be to the up side.  I think 500 lb-ft would be a great target if they can achieve it.

 

In video the Ford rep says the new intake and 92 mm throttle body provide 10 HP and extra 15 lb-ft across most of range; and that it can be fitted to existing engines.   Even though a lower profile intake isn’t needed for Super Duty, it suggest modifications in that area alone could bump HP and torque a bit.  He also mentions new cam is responsible for much of gain, and while I agree that particular unit is probably not suitable for production engine, it may be possible for a new cam to gain a bit more power and torque and still be legal.

 

Rep also mentioned production pistons and rods being weak link when supercharging engine, which may be reason they were upgraded in anticipation some of these engines will be supercharged.  A naturally aspirated production engine may not need stronger pistons and rods.  Hard to say.

 

With diesel cost being around 50% higher than gasoline per gallon, it seems that Ford would try to upgrade gas towing as much as practical, even if it adds a little cost to engine.  Assuming 7.3L premium engine needs new pistons and rods to increase power, it should not add much cost compared to diesel option.  Please understand I know that upgrading the 7.3L will not allow it to compete with diesel at the upper limit, but any additional gasoline towing capability may be enough to attract new buyers.

It’s not just a cost issue with the pistons. It’s the location of the top ring. On a normally aspirated modern engine the top ring is located much closer to the top of the piston. This is done to reduce unburned fuel and thereby clean up emissions. 
 

This ring placement leaves less material strength above the ring land. They can crack or burn far more easily. 
 

A typical piston designed to withstand a power adder has a lower ring placement leaving a much stronger and cooler running piston dome. 

[jpd80]

7 hours ago, Stray Kat said:

It’s not just a cost issue with the pistons. It’s the location of the top ring. On a normally aspirated modern engine the top ring is located much closer to the top of the piston. This is done to reduce unburned fuel and thereby clean up emissions. 
 

This ring placement leaves less material strength above the ring land. They can crack or burn far more easily. 
 

A typical piston designed to withstand a power adder has a lower ring placement leaving a much stronger and cooler running piston dome. 

On that point, Harrop Engines in Australia is doing good work with blown version.

There’s a  picture on the link below illustrates the point you were making with regards

to piston top ring placement.

https://www.whichcar.com.au/news/video-harrop-supercharged-ford-godzilla-v8-makes-1300hp

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited December 21, 2022 by jpd80

[ESP08]

14 hours ago, Rick73 said:

 

Ford hasn’t published new Super Duty engine ratings yet, so it is reasonable that if different than 2022, they will likely be to the up side.  I think 500 lb-ft would be a great target if they can achieve it.

 

2023 Super Duty engine ratings: 

 

7.3 - 430 hp / 485 lb-ft

6.8 - 405 hp / 445 lb-ft 

6.7 PSD - 475 hp / 1050 lb-ft

6.7 PDS HO - 500 hp / 1200 lb-ft 

 

https://media.ford.com/content/fordmedia/fna/us/en/news/2022/10/27/all-new-ford-f-series-super-duty-pickup-takes-heavy-duty-triple-.html

[Rick73]

1 hour ago, ESP08 said:

 

2023 Super Duty engine ratings: 

 

7.3 - 430 hp / 485 lb-ft

6.8 - 405 hp / 445 lb-ft 

6.7 PSD - 475 hp / 1050 lb-ft

6.7 PDS HO - 500 hp / 1200 lb-ft 

 

https://media.ford.com/content/fordmedia/fna/us/en/news/2022/10/27/all-new-ford-f-series-super-duty-pickup-takes-heavy-duty-triple-.html

 

Thank you.  Specs I had just looked at showed TBD, so assumed numbers were not final/official yet.  Lack of RPM data also suggested ratings were not final.  My mistake.