Possible Mach-E related model spotted

[slemke]

8 hours ago, rperez817 said:

 

That's correct rmc523. The president of dealership group Sonic Automotive said about 4 years ago that so many of its BMW 3-Series customers (Sonic is one of the largest franchisees for BMW of NA) were defecting to Tesla Model 3 rather than getting another 3-Series, it contributed heavily to disappointing profitability for Sonic back then.

 

 

 

Seems to fit what I see around here.  Many fewer 3 series and lots of Teslas.  It went from look at me I drive a luxury car to look at me I drive an electric car.  
 

I haven’t seen a Lightning on the road, but I have seen a couple Rivian trucks and an occasional Mach-e and Id.4  My guess is the lightning and Mach e don’t have the cachet of a Tesla or Rivian.

[jpd80]

1 hour ago, slemke said:

Seems to fit what I see around here.  Many fewer 3 series and lots of Teslas.  It went from look at me I drive a luxury car to look at me I drive an electric car.  
 

I haven’t seen a Lightning on the road, but I have seen a couple Rivian trucks and an occasional Mach-e and Id.4  My guess is the lightning and Mach e don’t have the cachet of a Tesla or Rivian.

Sales volume for Lightning and Mach E is still quite small

[silvrsvt]

9 hours ago, slemke said:

Seems to fit what I see around here.  Many fewer 3 series and lots of Teslas.  It went from look at me I drive a luxury car to look at me I drive an electric car.  
 

I haven’t seen a Lightning on the road, but I have seen a couple Rivian trucks and an occasional Mach-e and Id.4  My guess is the lightning and Mach e don’t have the cachet of a Tesla or Rivian.

 

In my area I see lots of Tesla 3 and Xs, not so many S lately. I've also noticed a significant increase or at least a future build out of charging stations near me-just as an example, a new Target has level 2 chargers and another Target near by has Electificy America chargers waiting to be installed. A Mall up the street has EA Chargers waiting to be installed also and a large convenience store near by is getting Telsa super chargers installed-this is all in a about 15 mile radius of where I live.

 

I've also seen more Rivian trucks then Lightnings, but someone at work just got a CG one. I've seen a ton of Mach Es in the area...a few Saturdays ago I saw four of them in 30 minute period. 

 

Rivian sold about 20K trucks last year vs 15K Lightnings also. 

 

[rperez817]

9 hours ago, slemke said:

 My guess is the lightning and Mach e don’t have the cachet of a Tesla or Rivian.

 

That's true slemke, though F-150 Lightning and Mustang Mach-E have their own strengths over comparable Rivian and Tesla products. Lightning's more conventional design for example has much broader appeal, and in Motor Trend's comparison with Rivian R1T it eked out a victory, though the margin was the smallest in MT history. 2022 Ford F-150 Lightning vs. Rivian R1T: The Closest Finish in MT History (motortrend.com)

 

As for Mustang Mach-E, it is the most stylish crossover type vehicle from any manufacturer, much better looking than the boring and ugly Model Y.

[Chrisgb]

2 hours ago, rperez817 said:

As for Mustang Mach-E, it is the most stylish crossover type vehicle from any manufacturer, much better looking than the boring and ugly Model Y.

I recently was at my dealership for a Works Package and they had a $63k Mach-e Premiums on the show floor, and a half dozen more on the lot, all Premiums ranging from $56- to73k. It comes off better in real life than in pics. Very nicely done and not just a reinvention of the Honda Crosstour. Sized right for my preference, but $15-30k  outside of what I would spend on a car.

[rperez817]

45 minutes ago, Chrisgb said:

It comes off better in real life than in pics. Very nicely done and not just a reinvention of the Honda Crosstour.

 

Well said Chrisgb! This is something that my wife (primary driver of our Mustang Mach-E) and I continue to appreciate. Even though Mustang Mach-E looked great when we first saw photos of it, when it arrived at our dealership on delivery day, we both marveled at the fact that it looked even better in person. 

 

The Grabber Blue paint color in particular is stunningly beautiful in real life, particularly on a sunny day. ?

 

[rmc523]

15 hours ago, slemke said:

Seems to fit what I see around here.  Many fewer 3 series and lots of Teslas.  It went from look at me I drive a luxury car to look at me I drive an electric car.  
 

I haven’t seen a Lightning on the road, but I have seen a couple Rivian trucks and an occasional Mach-e and Id.4  My guess is the lightning and Mach e don’t have the cachet of a Tesla or Rivian.

 

I've seen several Rivans around, and slightly fewer Lightnings.  Mach E's are increasingly common, though.

 

For reference, Teslas are everywhere here.

[akirby]

22 hours ago, rmc523 said:

 

I get what you're saying.  I just don't think it's purely black and white like you're making it out to be.

 

Someone may look at both and be hesitant to switch to BEV, but ultimately pull the trigger on a BEV.  That doesn't mean the two weren't cross shopped.  That obviously doesn't apply to everyone.  But neither does BEV only.

You’re probably right and part of this is semantics.  Obviously almost all BEV sales come from non BEV owners.  But to me a buyer decides BEV or non BEV then shops within that category.  But I can see someone saying I could go BEV but then shopping both and looking at price, options, etc before deciding.  I do think that’s the minority though and most are one or the other.

[jpd80]

1 hour ago, akirby said:

You’re probably right and part of this is semantics.  Obviously almost all BEV sales come from non BEV owners.  But to me a buyer decides BEV or non BEV then shops within that category.  But I can see someone saying I could go BEV but then shopping both and looking at price, options, etc before deciding.  I do think that’s the minority though and most are one or the other.

The good part is at the moment, most Ford EV sales are conquests from other brands. That to me is a small victory in a much larger long term battle.

[slemke]

16 hours ago, silvrsvt said:

 

In my area I see lots of Tesla 3 and Xs, not so many S lately. I've also noticed a significant increase or at least a future build out of charging stations near me-just as an example, a new Target has level 2 chargers and another Target near by has Electificy America chargers waiting to be installed. A Mall up the street has EA Chargers waiting to be installed also and a large convenience store near by is getting Telsa super chargers installed-this is all in a about 15 mile radius of where I live.

 

I've also seen more Rivian trucks then Lightnings, but someone at work just got a CG one. I've seen a ton of Mach Es in the area...a few Saturdays ago I saw four of them in 30 minute period. 

 

Rivian sold about 20K trucks last year vs 15K Lightnings also. 

 

You sure those aren’t model Ys?  I’ve seen fewer Xs than Ss.  
 

I have gas stations going up around me.  Kinda weird with all the Teslas driving around.  The target got level 2 chargers quite some time ago.  Some of the public parking decks have added them, but they aren’t used much.  I suspect that most are charged at home in the garage with no need to pay extra for public charging.  I do see many requests for solar panels to be installed in my neighborhood and those homes often have an electric car or buy one shortly after.
 

I lost track that Rivian increased production faster than Ford.  Last time I looked in fall, Ford was claiming to be the EV truck leader…that was probably 3rd quarter.  Ford still claims to be the EV truck leader after sales increased in December.  The 20k Rivians include the Amazon vans and R1S suv.  Seems to be a close race.  Doesn’t change the fact that I haven’t spotted a Lightning, but have seen several R1T and an R1S.

[slemke]

16 hours ago, rperez817 said:

 

That's true slemke, though F-150 Lightning and Mustang Mach-E have their own strengths over comparable Rivian and Tesla products. Lightning's more conventional design for example has much broader appeal, and in Motor Trend's comparison with Rivian R1T it eked out a victory, though the margin was the smallest in MT history. 2022 Ford F-150 Lightning vs. Rivian R1T: The Closest Finish in MT History (motortrend.com)

 

As for Mustang Mach-E, it is the most stylish crossover type vehicle from any manufacturer, much better looking than the boring and ugly Model Y.

I agree the Mach e and lightning have their own strengths.  I think it is more the demographics of the area I live in that leads to the large number of Teslas.  If you want people to know you drive an EV, you drive a Tesla.  My kids know a Tesla is an electric car, even with me pointing out the Mach E s and I’d.4s, they still aren’t convinced those are electric cars.  Then again, many around me have no clue what a Lincoln is either.

 

I don’t know what to say about the model Y, other than it is the ugliest Tesla currently on the market.  The proportions are just off. The X is a little better, but not much.  The best looking is the Model S.

 

The few ID.4s I see driving around are pretty sharp looking.  To me the Mach e needs a smaller nose.  Both are better looking than the Y.

[rperez817]

8 hours ago, slemke said:

I think it is more the demographics of the area I live in that leads to the large number of Teslas.  If you want people to know you drive an EV, you drive a Tesla.  My kids know a Tesla is an electric car, even with me pointing out the Mach E s and I’d.4s, they still aren’t convinced those are electric cars.  Then again, many around me have no clue what a Lincoln is either.

 

Good points slemke. Tesla is far ahead of the legacy automakers when it comes to designing, engineering, and marketing BEV. And in the U.S. market, it has a sizeable lead in BEV sales over everyone else. So what you've seen in your area with the popularity of Tesla is also the case where I live in the Dallas-Fort Worth Metroplex, and throughout the U.S. as well. That's why Jim Farley is content for Ford to be the #2 brand for BEV, there's no chance Ford will catch up to Tesla anytime soon in terms of those capabilities. But he does have a strategy for Ford to be #1 in certain categories where Ford is already strong, like full-size pickup trucks with F-150 Lightning. But to your point, Tesla will remain the "go to" BEV brand for a lot of consumers throughout the world.

 

Lincoln has an opportunity to re-invent itself and become relevant to younger buyers in the U.S. by becoming a 100% electric brand before the end of this decade. Hopefully the upcoming BEV Lincolns have the kind of styling flair that makes Mustang Mach-E the best looking crossover vehicle in history, but with Lincoln's own design language of course.

 

I would love to see the combination of Tesla + Cadillac + Lincoln + Lucid create a renaissance for American luxury automobiles over the next few years and take market share away from European and Asian automakers.