Biker16 Posted June 20 Share Posted June 20 Another Dumb Electrical Code Change Could Ban DIY EV Charger Installs Quote If the 2026 edition of the National Electrical Code is approved as proposed, it will become illegal in coming years for many U.S. homeowners to install their own EV chargers. The only thing stopping this from happening is a last-chance motion supported by Rivian to strike the clause from the code at the National Fire Protection Association’s annual technical meeting on Friday, June 20, 2025 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted June 20 Share Posted June 20 It’s not stupid when you’re talking about 50 amp double pole circuits. Lots of calculations to be made on wire size, length and more importantly capacity of the existing system. Permits and inspections are already required in most localities and most DIYers wouldn’t get a permit or inspection anyway. 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick73 Posted June 20 Share Posted June 20 Devil is in the details. I read statement below as an effort to address and include more complex installations before they become more common. A simple charger is one thing, but as more vehicles are designed to feed power back to a home during power outages, the risk of major screw-ups and injuries goes up tremendously in my opinion. Adding a simple breaker may be DIY territory, but transfer switches and the like requires more knowledge and experience than average homeowner should mess with. Just my 2 cents. Quote The change stems from a new addition to the 2026 NEC that reads, “Permanently installed electric vehicle power transfer system equipment shall be installed by qualified persons.” 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fordmantpw Posted June 20 Share Posted June 20 Yeah, adding transfer switches with the ability to feed power back to the grid affects much more than the homeowner. It affects the linemen out working on the lines, putting their lives in danger. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Biker16 Posted June 21 Author Share Posted June 21 7 hours ago, akirby said: It’s not stupid when you’re talking about 50 amp double pole circuits. Lots of calculations to be made on wire size, length and more importantly capacity of the existing system. Permits and inspections are already required in most localities and most DIYers wouldn’t get a permit or inspection anyway. The calculations are simple, the situation I can foresee is that these rules will increase the number of DIYers that don't seek a permit, which is the best way to ensure that the wiring is done correctly. Personally, I think mandates like this are overkill, and can do more harm than good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted June 21 Share Posted June 21 3 hours ago, Biker16 said: The calculations are simple, the situation I can foresee is that these rules will increase the number of DIYers that don't seek a permit, which is the best way to ensure that the wiring is done correctly. Personally, I think mandates like this are overkill, and can do more harm than good. Calculations are easy for a licensed electrician. Not for a DIYer. It’s more than just what gauge wire. I’ve wired entire basements and added multiple circuits but I wouldn’t touch a 50 amp 220 circuit. And Very few DIYers would pull permits anyway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HotRunrGuy Posted June 21 Share Posted June 21 13 hours ago, fordmantpw said: Yeah, adding transfer switches with the ability to feed power back to the grid affects much more than the homeowner. It affects the linemen out working on the lines, putting their lives in danger. Agreed. A simple AC to DC charger is one thing, but when considering the use of a bi-directional charger (V2H), isolation from the grid becomes paramount. Adding an inverter panel, with the appropriate isolation relays, will be above the talent of most DIY'ers. However, a typical 1-way EV charger (H2V), direct-wired or plugged into a 50-amp 14-50 outlet, should not have the capability to backfeed the grid. HRG Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick73 Posted June 21 Share Posted June 21 Let’s also consider that permits and inspections are meant to protect future homeowners as well, not just linemen from a poorly-installed system that could back feed the grid. Obviously both are important. On subject of back feeding the grid, during extended power outages following hurricanes, it’s not entirely uncommon to connect portable generators to a house’s electrical system to power essential needs much easier than running extension cords all over the place. It is not technically permissible to do, but relatively safe by throwing the main breaker first to isolate home from grid. Think of it as a manual transfer switch. Many homeowners can handle that. I did it for entire week last year and it was so much more convenient than using extension cords, plus added safety by powering lights throughout entire house, and also reduced chances of tripping over extension cords. My point is that many homeowners will do what they feel necessary and or beneficial as long as it’s reasonably safe in their own minds. And no doubt some will install equipment wrong. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick73 Posted June 21 Share Posted June 21 8 hours ago, akirby said: Calculations are easy for a licensed electrician. Not for a DIYer. It’s more than just what gauge wire. I’ve wired entire basements and added multiple circuits but I wouldn’t touch a 50 amp 220 circuit. And Very few DIYers would pull permits anyway. IMO it’s not that much more difficult to install 50A 240 VAC so I’m sure you could do it. You do bring up a good point that it’s not just a matter of using heavier gauge and 4 conductor wire in that an EV plugged into a 50A circuit can pull 40 Amps steady for many hours at a time, and on a regular basis. On most newer homes with higher-capacity panels it may not be a problem, but older homes, particularly with high electrical loads, could easily overload system. That would have definitely been the case in my parent’s house in Florida where everything was powered with electricity. At times there would not have been 40 Amps to spare for an EV. That’s not to say a homeowner could not schedule EV charging when other loads were lower. And also reduce charging rate. However, the code takes a more conservative approach which likely would have required a substantial and expensive electrical upgrade. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted June 21 Share Posted June 21 6 minutes ago, Rick73 said: IMO it’s not that much more difficult to install 50A 240 VAC so I’m sure you could do it. You do bring up a good point that it’s not just a matter of using heavier gauge and 4 conductor wire in that an EV plugged into a 50A circuit can pull 40 Amps steady for many hours at a time, and on a regular basis. On most newer homes with higher-capacity panels it may not be a problem, but older homes, particularly with high electrical loads, could easily overload system. That would have definitely been the case in my parent’s house in Florida where everything was powered with electricity. At times there would not have been 40 Amps to spare for an EV. That’s not to say a homeowner could not schedule EV charging when other loads were lower. And also reduce charging rate. However, the code takes a more conservative approach which likely would have required a substantial and expensive electrical upgrade. I know how to do it but that’s not the point. That’s far more dangerous than a 15V 110. And if your charger causes a house fire and the work was not permitted and inspected insurance won’t cover it. My city won’t allow homeowners to pull permits anyway. Had to get my nephew who owns an electrical business to pull a permit and run a new circuit in existing conduit for my outdoor kitchen. When you’re dealing with high amperages you have to calculate total load, size of the panel, type of breaker - even how to run the wire safely within the walls. Even simple things like lock out tag out procedures are very important. There is a reason we have an electrical code and certifications and licenses and why permits are required. This just isn’t a good DIY project and saying it will cause more DIYers to do work without a permit is silly. Most wouldn’t pull a permit anyway even if allowed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick73 Posted June 21 Share Posted June 21 I know stupidity has no limits. Recently discovered a DIY installation where homeowner split a single circuit and made two separate ones without adding new wiring. It was so wrong and dumb I won’t even say how they did it so as not to give others bad ideas. Not much surprises me but that one was hard to believe. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmc523 Posted June 23 Share Posted June 23 I'm able to do more "minor" electrical things like changing light fixtures, fans, timer boxes, etc, but I wouldn't have any interest in messing with something like an EV charger - even if I could read some "simple" instructions, I don't have the expertise needed, nor would I want to count on "hope I did it right" for something using so much power. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick73 Posted June 23 Share Posted June 23 At least in Tesla’s case the 40-Amp charger is self contained and only needs a 50-Amp receptacle in garage. Charger just plugs in. Adding a 50-Amp receptacle is not all that different than wiring 240-VAC electric stove, water heater, clothes dryer or a welder in garage, but you guys make a valid point. If homeowner is not comfortable with DIY or if licensed electrician is required, best to leave it to professionals. Besides, most people who can afford a new BEV can afford an electrician. 😀 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick73 Posted June 23 Share Posted June 23 P.S. — It may be 32 Amp charger, not 40 Amps. It’s been a while and don’t recall, but point is the same. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fuzzymoomoo Posted June 23 Share Posted June 23 Hi. Actual electrician here. This in no way stupid. The code exists for a reason, and believe me I’m a big less regulations are better kind of guy. Even if it’s a 30 amp charger there’s still a lot to consider when deciding on wire size and length, whether or not to you want to backfeed to the panel in the event of a power outage and in that case if you do a transfer switch will be required by the utility (and code, it’s treated similar to a generator). This is not something the average DIY hack should ever consider doing. 10 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twintornados Posted June 24 Share Posted June 24 I am always reminded of this sticker when I work around electricity... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fuzzymoomoo Posted June 26 Share Posted June 26 On 6/24/2025 at 5:20 AM, twintornados said: I am always reminded of this sticker when I work around electricity... I have one on my toolbox at work 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mackinaw Posted June 26 Share Posted June 26 Reddy Kilowatt! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Biker16 Posted June 27 Author Share Posted June 27 (edited) For the Record, no EV on the Markets in the US can provide V2G capability or backfeed grid without a Dedicated system to enable that feature. To put it bluntly, Standard EVSE will never provide V2G capability. The systems that offer V2G Tesla- Requires A powershare gateway to enable V2G and disconnet from the grid. Powershare - Vehicle to Home Backup System | Tesla Ford and GM - Reqire a seperate inverter to function as well as a 80 amp circuit Standard EVSE wiring Diagram Ford V2H Wiring Diagram Can you see the Difference? Edited June 29 by Biker16 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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