Ford to launch 5 new sub 40k affordable models by 2030.

[DeluxeStang]

So just trying to piece together the design to the best of our knowledge using press material so far. We know that close up is the front of the truck now, with a sealed grill, and an angled hood. Many of us also believe this clay model is the truck, so it gives us a better idea of the overall proportions. I also believe this fender is the truck, or at least, very similar to what the truck will have. It has that horizontal hood look closer to the windshield that we know the truck has, because the reaction vid shows us that portion of the hood isn't that angled, but then also swoops down near the leading edge like we can see in the close up. 

Edited February 9 by DeluxeStang

[DeluxeStang]

I'll add the low swooping hood almost makes it look like top of the grille lines up more or less with the top of the wheel arches more or less, a much lower front end than a conventional maverick. I've marked the photos below so you can see things like what I believe is the shape of a wheel arch, and character like on the covered design, and how the leading edge of the grille in the clay model seems to line up with the peak of the fender flare more or less. 

[rmc523]

13 hours ago, DeluxeStang said:

Agreed. It's a shame those plans went out the window, but of all the Ford plans, they seem like some of the most logical to dust off and try again. Cd6 seems like a really capable platform, heck, if it can make the explorer a solid performance car, I can only imagine how well an actual sedan or coupe on that platform would handle if just a bit of effort was put in. 

 

It's just sitting there begging to be optimized and improved. 

 

It all depends how expensive CD6 is.....I thought it was pricey, which is a factor in it not being used elsewhere.

 

12 hours ago, DeluxeStang said:

Borg is claiming the sub 40k car is the mustang sedan. So I wonder if the sedan is gonna be this affordable EV sedan after all, or if the mustang sedan will co-exist with another affordable EV rwd sedan that goes by a different name like escort, falcon, or Galaxie. 

 

Borg also completely forgot about that model until others pointed it out, so I'm skeptical on his knowledge of what's coming.......not saying he's necessarily wrong, just that he doesn't know everything like he projects.

 

I still think this leaves the door open for a S650-based model to start at $38 or something just under the $40k mark.

[jpd80]

36 minutes ago, rmc523 said:

 

It all depends how expensive CD6 is.....I thought it was pricey, which is a factor in it not being used elsewhere.

 

 

Borg also completely forgot about that model until others pointed it out, so I'm skeptical on his knowledge of what's coming.......not saying he's necessarily wrong, just that he doesn't know everything like he projects.

 

I still think this leaves the door open for a S650-based model to start at $38 or something just under the $40k mark.

Originally the 2.3 EB Hybrid Mustang was going to be pitched as sub $40k, not much interest from clinics so they didn’t proceed. At some point I think people started conflating that vehicle with Mustang based four door car which has been circling the airport for years.

 

Sometimes people see what they want to see……

 

Edited February 9 by jpd80

[bzcat]

1 hour ago, rmc523 said:

 

It all depends how expensive CD6 is.....I thought it was pricey, which is a factor in it not being used elsewhere.

 

 

Borg also completely forgot about that model until others pointed it out, so I'm skeptical on his knowledge of what's coming.......not saying he's necessarily wrong, just that he doesn't know everything like he projects.

 

I still think this leaves the door open for a S650-based model to start at $38 or something just under the $40k mark.

 

I doubt CD6 is expensive in the conventional sense. As is the case with all other Ford North America production planning decision, it always comes down to capital costs for tooling up a 2nd production site. The CD6 Edge was snuffed because Ford didn't want to convert Oakville to another CD6 plant. The CD6 Mustang was nixed because Ford didn't project enough volume to make it worthwhile at Flat Rock. Ford choose to put its second CD6 Explorer plant in China which on balance is probably the right decision but it limited its option to some something else with that platform in North America. 

 

Same dynamics we see now that Ford is not willing to invest in a second T6 plant in the US which could enable Everest and a Lincoln SUV because it won't sell enough to fully utilized the second plant in North America. 

 

 

[T-dubz]

13 hours ago, DeluxeStang said:

I'll add the low swooping hood almost makes it look like top of the grille lines up more or less with the top of the wheel arches more or less, a much lower front end than a conventional maverick. I've marked the photos below so you can see things like what I believe is the shape of a wheel arch, and character like on the covered design, and how the leading edge of the grille in the clay model seems to line up with the peak of the fender flare more or less. 

To me, this front end looks very similar to the Explorer EV, but stretched a bit to look more truck-like. I wouldn’t be surprised if it looks like this but with the C shape lighting elements the trucks use.

[DeluxeStang]

4 hours ago, rmc523 said:

 

It all depends how expensive CD6 is.....I thought it was pricey, which is a factor in it not being used elsewhere.

 

 

Borg also completely forgot about that model until others pointed it out, so I'm skeptical on his knowledge of what's coming.......not saying he's necessarily wrong, just that he doesn't know everything like he projects.

 

I still think this leaves the door open for a S650-based model to start at $38 or something just under the $40k mark.

Yeah his track record seems a little iffy. I personally believe that EV RWD sedan makes a lot more sense for an affordable vehicle offering, but time will tell. 

[DeluxeStang]

4 hours ago, jpd80 said:

Originally the 2.3 EB Hybrid Mustang was going to be pitched as sub $40k, not much interest from clinics so they didn’t proceed. At some point I think people started conflating that vehicle with Mustang based four door car which has been circling the airport for years.

 

Sometimes people see what they want to see……

 

That's very interesting. You would think a mustang 2.3 hybrid would go over really well with potential buyers. Something that was still relatively affordable, that would probably have a level of power not that far off where a 5.0 is, and that would almost certainly get better fuel economy than a normal 2.3. 

 

That sounds like a winning combination all day. A coupe that could archive over 30 mpg or something and have like 400 hp at the same time. IDK, maybe there was something else about it that turned clinics off. 

Edited February 9 by DeluxeStang

[DeluxeStang]

2 hours ago, T-dubz said:

To me, this front end looks very similar to the Explorer EV, but stretched a bit to look more truck-like. I wouldn’t be surprised if it looks like this but with the C shape lighting elements the trucks use.

Which isn't bad. It has that blocky look but is a little more rounded for areo. The clay reminds me vaguely of things like the super chief or interceptor concepts by having that singular, blocky graphic that goes across the entire front end. It gives it a more muscular look which I can get behind. 

[Sherminator98]

9 minutes ago, DeluxeStang said:

Yeah his track record seems a little iffy. I personally believe that EV RWD sedan makes a lot more sense for an affordable vehicle offering, but time will tell. 

 

He has a weird personality disorder-he basically throws shit against the wall to see if it sticks

 

It was also part of the reason he got booted here because he was wrong more often then not. 

[DeluxeStang]

2 minutes ago, Sherminator98 said:

 

He has a weird personality disorder-he basically throws shit against the wall to see if it sticks

 

It was also part of the reason he got booted here because he was wrong more often then not. 

Yeah, he does seem to be all over the place. I believe members like Fuzzy, JPD, and Explorerdude are a lot more consistent in the info they leak to us. 

[jpd80]

 

So how are we to know what Ford’s plans are if they are continually changing them?

 

While it’s not hard to map out possible products and put your own spin on what’s likely, all of that can go out the window  if Ford goes in another direction because they’ll take a bath on costs or some other sourcing or shipping issue.

 

Economy is getting tougher and it feels like more people will be cautious with new vehicle purchases but then, Theres probably another group above them that’s less affected……it’s a hard read this year, I’m glad we have this place to discuss things and how Ford copes with change.

Edited February 9 by jpd80

[akirby]

1 hour ago, Sherminator98 said:

 

He has a weird personality disorder-he basically throws shit against the wall to see if it sticks

 

It was also part of the reason he got booted here because he was wrong more often then not. 

I don't think he got booted he just left (twice) after being called out when he was wrong.

[akirby]

1 hour ago, DeluxeStang said:

Yeah, he does seem to be all over the place. I believe members like Fuzzy, JPD, and Explorerdude are a lot more consistent in the info they leak to us. 

He's not an actual insider.  He gets his info from others.

[akirby]

44 minutes ago, jpd80 said:

 

So how are we to know what Ford’s plans are if they are continually changing them?

 

While it’s not hard to map out possible products and put your own spin on what’s likely, all of that can go out the window  if Ford goes in another direction because they’ll take a bath on costs or some other sourcing or shipping issue.

 

Economy is getting tougher and it feels like more people will be cautious with new vehicle purchases but then, Theres probably another group above them that’s less affected……it’s a hard read this year, I’m glad we have this place to discuss things and how Ford copes with change.

I hope Farley has realized his past mistakes and won't change course again midstream.

[fordmantpw]

1 hour ago, akirby said:

I don't think he got booted he just left (twice) after being called out when he was wrong.

 

Yeah, I think he took his ball and went home.

[rmc523]

5 hours ago, bzcat said:

 

I doubt CD6 is expensive in the conventional sense. As is the case with all other Ford North America production planning decision, it always comes down to capital costs for tooling up a 2nd production site. The CD6 Edge was snuffed because Ford didn't want to convert Oakville to another CD6 plant. The CD6 Mustang was nixed because Ford didn't project enough volume to make it worthwhile at Flat Rock. Ford choose to put its second CD6 Explorer plant in China which on balance is probably the right decision but it limited its option to some something else with that platform in North America. 

 

Same dynamics we see now that Ford is not willing to invest in a second T6 plant in the US which could enable Everest and a Lincoln SUV because it won't sell enough to fully utilized the second plant in North America. 

 

 

 

Mustang on CD6 probably made a lot more mathematical sense when a Ford and Lincoln (Conti?) sedan were also going to be on it, presumably at Flat Rock.

 

2 hours ago, DeluxeStang said:

Yeah his track record seems a little iffy. I personally believe that EV RWD sedan makes a lot more sense for an affordable vehicle offering, but time will tell. 

 

Sure, it can make sense, but who knows at this point.

 

2 hours ago, Sherminator98 said:

 

He has a weird personality disorder-he basically throws shit against the wall to see if it sticks

 

It was also part of the reason he got booted here because he was wrong more often then not. 

 

I think he just left because he didn't like being called out for not being right.  I actually enjoy his info, as it gives points to discuss/talk about, but I also look at it with a skeptical eye because he's often been wrong, even though he's sometimes right.  What he couldn't accept is that sometimes he's not right and would have a fit when people would say hey, this isn't accurate info.  He thought his info was 100% right all the time, and nothing could be said to question it.  When in reality, as jpd points out above, how can we truly speculate about Ford plans when Ford doesn't even know what it's doing half the time lol.

 

1 hour ago, akirby said:

I hope Farley has realized his past mistakes and won't change course again midstream.

 

1000% agree.  Ford is at the point where it needs to just pick something and go with it because they've cut so much already without replacements.

[jpd80]

Just my thoughts on CD6…

 

The biggest failing of CD6 was not capitalising on building Explorer and Edge at the same time as LWB/SWB three row and two row sporty hatchback. Ford’s  insistence on individual developments wreaks of being hamstrung by financing rules.

 

In a perfect world, all the Utilities would be developed together to improve scales of economy. Equally a CD6 Mustang coupe, developed with car in two wheelbase lengths gives the other side of the coin.

 

Two plants filled with Ford and Lincoln vehicles sounds like CAP and FRAP loaded to the gills with products.

 

 

[jpd80]

8 hours ago, akirby said:

I hope Farley has realized his past mistakes and won't change course again midstream.

Truth to tell, Bill Ford is  the real culprit here with his insistence that

Ford CEOs be more active with delivering mass produced BEVs.

 

 

 

 

 

[akirby]

7 hours ago, jpd80 said:

Truth to tell, Bill Ford is  the real culprit here with his insistence that

Ford CEOs be more active with delivering mass produced BEVs.

Understood but Farley is responsible for the screwups in the implementation of said plans.

[rmc523]

8 hours ago, jpd80 said:

Just my thoughts on CD6…

 

The biggest failing of CD6 was not capitalising on building Explorer and Edge at the same time as LWB/SWB three row and two row sporty hatchback. Ford’s  insistence on individual developments wreaks of being hamstrung by financing rules.

 

In a perfect world, all the Utilities would be developed together to improve scales of economy. Equally a CD6 Mustang coupe, developed with car in two wheelbase lengths gives the other side of the coin.

 

Two plants filled with Ford and Lincoln vehicles sounds like CAP and FRAP loaded to the gills with products.

 

 

 

So you're proposing that Edge had the same style as Explorer, just 2-row/3-row like Grand Cherokee/Grand Cherokee L?

 

They were working on a CD6 Edge, but the proportions were said to be strange.

 

I think if Fields had been kept, we would've seen a better/broader CD6 portfolio.

 

12 minutes ago, akirby said:

Understood but Farley is responsible for the screwups in the implementation of said plans.

 

He's talking further back/when Fields was shown the door for not doing enough on BEVs.

Then there was Hackett, but obviously since then, Farley has been in charge of what is essentially no new product since then, mostly cancellations of existing and upcoming products.

[jpd80]

5 hours ago, rmc523 said:

 

So you're proposing that Edge had the same style as Explorer, just 2-row/3-row like Grand Cherokee/Grand Cherokee L?

 

They were working on a CD6 Edge, but the proportions were said to be strange.

 

I think if Fields had been kept, we would've seen a better/broader CD6 portfolio.

Yeah pretty much, it felt like vehicles built in silos instead of what the platform could achieve with scales of economy. A lot of the financing decisions are made on business case of individual vehicle types instead of a more cohesive approach to what becomes derivatives or close cousins…

 

5 hours ago, rmc523 said:

 

 

He's talking further back/when Fields was shown the door for not doing enough on BEVs.

Then there was Hackett, but obviously since then, Farley has been in charge of what is essentially no new product since then, mostly cancellations of existing and upcoming products.

Thank you for that summary, exactly what I was thinking

and akirby is right, Jim Farley was there and responsible, the warning signs were there.

 

I guess Farley was so onboard with BEVs that Ford overcommitted before confirming just how many buyers were out there. I think that’s where building up hybrids,, PHEV/EREVs is important in growing customer trust and familiarity…the steps Ford dismissed as over complications…

[Trader 10]

6 hours ago, rmc523 said:

 

They were working on a CD6 Edge, but the proportions were said to be strange.

 

I remember when that was reported. Seemed like BS (and I don’t mean Bronco Sport) to me. No reason why a well proportioned Edge couldn’t be developed on CD6. 

[jpd80]

28 minutes ago, Trader 10 said:

I remember when that was reported. Seemed like BS (and I don’t mean Bronco Sport) to me. No reason why a well proportioned Edge couldn’t be developed on CD6. 

The problem was that there were already camouflaged vehicle spyshots, it was cancelled so late in the process

My beef was it was separate development to Explorer instead of a close derivative developed at the same time.

 

back Chanel says problem with Proportions affecting the aesthetics in vehicle clinics.

Convenient excuse if say, a two row Explorer could be used instead to replace some Edge sales…

Whatever, the CD4 Edge was extended until another plan was drafted for Oakville LOL, then that  vehicle plan was scrapped too…and now the plan is SD F Series

Edited February 10 by jpd80

[akirby]

1 hour ago, Trader 10 said:

No reason why a well proportioned Edge couldn’t be developed on CD6. 

It could have been but apparently it wasn't.  My guess is they were trying to limit development costs and were therefore stuck with compromised proportions or other components rather than a true clean sheet design.  And by that point it wasn't worth fixing.

 

In hindsight it should have been a C2 hybrid from the start.