jpd80 Posted May 7 Share Posted May 7 (edited) 5 hours ago, Zestyg said: The thing is that as far as shareholders are concerned, since Farley became CEO he has increased revenue and gross profit every single year. Issues with operating profit can be looked at in the lens of his EV efforts (Ford Blue and Pro show the sought after 8%+ margins…) which Wall Street is viewing moderately positively. They don’t buy the cars, they don’t care as much that sales haven’t recovered to pre-covid, he’s not been trying to do that. To Farley’s credit he’s also done this without doing the stupid Jeep pricing thing that predictably imploded in Stellantis’s face. He has kept all the people he actually needs to keep happy plenty happy. This is conjecture but the only thing he needs to actually deliver on is UEV, the hybrid shit and new affordable models could just be pure vaporware. And if UEV really works then it will have absolutely been the correct thing to lie about. He also needs to fix the aluminum supply issue and not totally fuck up union negotiations again, normal CEO shit. Sorry, the below ended up a ramble, not specifically directed at you… It’s an example of the policies of many US corporations where they value return over profit, the same sort of thing that Disney did with its theme park patrons, realising that higher valued once in a lifetime tourists will pay prices far beyond what locals ever will. Their problem is that Gen Z can’t see the value in paying for activities in theme parks like their parents onc did. Sorry I’m digressing here.. OK, everything Farley has done has been under the directions of Bill Ford , so thers no way he can really be held to account when his boss tells him to get mass electrification roll out done….he tried that, didn’t work, big losses piling up so switch plans to more modest BEV plans supported by electrification of ICE vehicles. finally, Ford’s stock price is of little consequence to the day to day operations, the Ford Family retaining of original undiluted B Stock means they effectively have control of the company, so no grass roots voter revolt is ever going to do anything. Edited May 7 by jpd80 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeluxeStang Posted May 7 Share Posted May 7 45 minutes ago, rmc523 said: Well, I think we figured at the time that that was a preview of the T3 Lighting......it's not surprising that they'd have borrowed styling cues from that and applied it to the CE1 truck. Exactly, and I believe you and I theorized at the time some of the styling from this and T3 would translate to the ce1 truck. Looks like I was right for once lol. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zestyg Posted May 7 Share Posted May 7 (edited) 1 hour ago, jpd80 said: finally, Ford’s stock price is of little consequence to the day to day operations, the Ford Family retaining of original undiluted B Stock means they effectively have control of the company, so no grass roots voter revolt is ever going to do anything. To be clear, the reason I mention all the finances isn’t because of a hypothetical shareholder revolt. We know the Ford family holds the power. This doesn’t change though that Farley is evaluated on how well he makes the company money, and his longevity is affected by how sustainable that is. The Ford family’s control does mean Farley has to pursue certain priorities that aren’t necessarily the most short-term profit maximizing (EVs) but his job is to make them money and my point is that he does both these things pretty well. Whether or not UEV flopping would cause the family to lose faith is up to them, but on a human level, it would be weird to still have faith in him at that point. Edited May 7 by Zestyg Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fuzzymoomoo Posted May 8 Share Posted May 8 All I’m reading through all of this is that I am the furthest thing from the target demographic for this thing as one can get. I’ll keep my fusion until I inevitably hit a deer and total it. Then I’ll buy used from then on out 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
02MustangGT Posted May 8 Share Posted May 8 6 hours ago, DeluxeStang said: Reminds me of… Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeluxeStang Posted May 8 Share Posted May 8 34 minutes ago, 02MustangGT said: Reminds me of… Which isn't bad. It has that boxy, truck look to it which buyers should appreciate. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zestyg Posted May 8 Share Posted May 8 48 minutes ago, 02MustangGT said: Reminds me of… I do genuinely think that Kia and Hyundai imitate a lot of Ford’s designs tbh. Hard to call them unoriginal though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted May 8 Share Posted May 8 (edited) 10 hours ago, Zestyg said: To be clear, the reason I mention all the finances isn’t because of a hypothetical shareholder revolt. We know the Ford family holds the power. This doesn’t change though that Farley is evaluated on how well he makes the company money, and his longevity is affected by how sustainable that is. The Ford family’s control does mean Farley has to pursue certain priorities that aren’t necessarily the most short-term profit maximizing (EVs) but his job is to make them money and my point is that he does both these things pretty well. Whether or not UEV flopping would cause the family to lose faith is up to them, but on a human level, it would be weird to still have faith in him at that point. That still has no bearing in him, it’s Bill Ford’s directive that he actively peruse and develop electrified vehicles. Why do you think he set up Ford Blue, Ford Pro and Model E? It was to underscore to the board what actually makes money and how much Bill Ford’s desired EV roll out costs. He is not saying it’s right or wrong, just keeping his bosses aware of where this is going and the best way to get there. Edited May 8 by jpd80 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zestyg Posted May 8 Share Posted May 8 4 hours ago, jpd80 said: That still has no bearing in him, it’s Bill Ford’s directive that he actively peruse and develop electrified vehicles. Why do you think he set up Ford Blue, Ford Pro and Model E? It was to underscore to the board what actually makes money and how much Bill Ford’s desired EV roll out costs. He is not saying it’s right or wrong, just keeping his bosses aware of where this is going and the best way to get there. I’m not certain we are actually disagreeing on anything jpd Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
morgan20 Posted May 8 Share Posted May 8 7 hours ago, jpd80 said: Why do you think he set up Ford Blue, Ford Pro and Model E? It was to underscore to the board what actually makes money and how much Bill Ford’s desired EV roll out costs. Jimbo, Billy Boy, and the finance big shots at Ford wanted to emphasize that Model e operates like a startup company within the larger Ford organization. They're right, that's exactly what Model e is "As everyone knows, EV startups lose money while they invest in capability, develop knowledge, build (sales) volume and gain (market) share" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted May 8 Share Posted May 8 4 hours ago, morgan20 said: Jimbo, Billy Boy, and the finance big shots at Ford wanted to emphasize that Model e operates like a startup company within the larger Ford organization. They're right, that's exactly what Model e is "As everyone knows, EV startups lose money while they invest in capability, develop knowledge, build (sales) volume and gain (market) share" And it separates the big loser (model E) from the big winner (Ford Pro - 13%) and more modest winner (Blue 6%). It better justifies Ford's investment in Pro and shows that the company could kill the EVs and be a very profitable company after the writedown. As opposed to lumping them all together and saying Ford only made a 2% profit. (I guessed at the percentages but they're in the ballpark). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted May 8 Share Posted May 8 8 hours ago, Zestyg said: I’m not certain we are actually disagreeing on anything jpd I don’t think so either, my comments are more for the benefits of others who think JF will be held to account for huge losses, he won’t and Ford will take it up to the important learning process required to build better vehicles. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
morgan20 Posted May 8 Share Posted May 8 (edited) 1 hour ago, akirby said: And it separates the big loser (model E) from the big winner (Ford Pro - 13%) and more modest winner (Blue 6%). It better justifies Ford's investment in Pro and shows that the company could kill the EVs and be a very profitable company after the writedown. As opposed to lumping them all together and saying Ford only made a 2% profit. (I guessed at the percentages but they're in the ballpark). Yea, good summary. I understand the rationale, but it's annoying to read in the business and automotive press bullshit headlines like "Here's the Staggering Amount of Money Ford Loses on Each EV It Makes" even after the Ford big shots repeatedly described the design of Model e as a startup company within FoMoCo. That's why I was skeptical of the benefits to customers, shareholders, and employees from Ford reporting financials for Model e, Pro, and Blue separately. No other automaker did that. But that's in the rearview mirror now, I'm glad Ford is movin' full speed ahead with CE1 product launch. Edited May 8 by morgan20 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zestyg Posted May 8 Share Posted May 8 2 hours ago, akirby said: And it separates the big loser (model E) from the big winner (Ford Pro - 13%) and more modest winner (Blue 6%). It better justifies Ford's investment in Pro and shows that the company could kill the EVs and be a very profitable company after the writedown. As opposed to lumping them all together and saying Ford only made a 2% profit. (I guessed at the percentages but they're in the ballpark). To be fair, he absolutely should tout Ford Pro. What they’ve been able to do there is kind of brilliant and interesting. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeluxeStang Posted May 14 Share Posted May 14 We might see substantial active aero on this thing. That would be pretty radical, but awesome, I can't think of another affordable model with advanced active aero so this could be pretty revolutionary. https://fordauthority.com/2026/05/future-ford-pickups-could-get-fins-for-aerodynamics/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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