igor
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Posts posted by igor
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MKX, Navigator, and the Aviator concept ... it's incredible how much metal Lincoln is putting out these days. The "one model per year" scheme is working beautifully. Now they will have 1 MCE, 1 new model, and 2 concept to talk about each year.
This year it's MKZ, Conti, and Navi.
Next year MKC, Navi, Aviator
Then MKX, Aviator, and ???
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The issue is the distance involved and associated shipping costs involved....lots cheaper to be moved via rail from Mexico then by ship from China.
Only if you assume that the model's primary market will be USA / NA.
For Mexico, that is usually true, but even for Fusion Brazil is a significant market.
For China, we will see imports for models primarily sold there, with few units shipped overseas. Much cheaper to ship some models across the pacific than to spin up a second plant for just a few units.
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The cars are getting much better for sure. I am disappointed in the modest sales gains with all he new models, I think Lincoln crossovers should be performing better than they are relative to the size and growth of the segment dominated by others. It'll be interesting to see what happens with Continental and the new look, Lincoln is still a brand that lacks mass appeal and the Continental might change attitudes a bit. In either case, Lincoln is doing the right thing for its business and they are clearly making progress in every area of their business, but the Lincoln audience is still very small and that's going to remain a progressive struggle to fix. I definitely don't believe we'll ever see Lincoln as a global luxury marque so it's probably going to be a negligible business for the foreseeable future, but it's like Apple's Mac lineup, it's still important to the company even if it's not a significant sales or profit generator. Lincoln just has to cement itself as too important and stable to get rid of the next time Ford is faced with a leadership and economic crisis.
I just keep remembering how poorly the Fusion did in its first generation and it "second" generation / serious MCE. It was a great car that could not outsell mediocre cars in the segment.
All of this tipped around 2011 when following the buzz around Flex, Ford introduced the Fiesta, Focus, and Escape and then the new Fusion. By the time the "Gen 3" Fusion was released it garnered none of the cautious "could this Ford really be this good" damnation with faint praise and sales were surging.
I have no doubt there will be a tipping point for Lincoln. At one point one of the rags will say "Lincoln has been quietly making wonderful cars" and others will follow into a chorus, and the sales will tip upwards.
It's all about patience and staying the course right now.
EDIT: Also yes, Ford should be happy with Lincoln. Calm, disciplined, steady. Audi, Lexus, and BMW are not where they are by being brash and twitchy at the gas pedal. (although I have serious misgivings about the germans' recent obsession with needless model proliferation; which come to think of it may represent just the opportunity Lincoln (and Cadillac) could exploit)
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Isn't Nissan bringing that Quashqui thing here?
nissan qashqai
If they are, this is first I've heard of it.
Again -- I may be completely wrong, but it seems to me that EcoSport is being readied for imminent release in the US, and moving the ES to C3 seems odd in my perspective. ... that is a guess .. a read of tea leaves ... many people know, some may say.
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You keep Ecosport for the lower price point and MOW. You make Focus and Escape slightly longer. Then you add a shorter C3 ute to bridge the gap.
Despite the move to 106.3" wheelbase by most competitors, we see 0 movement to slotting more sizes of SUVs between What is HRV ad CRV, Mazda CX3 and CX5, Juke and Rogue ... and that is from brands (besides Nissan) that do not have Edge sitting atop their compact SUV. I just do not see it at the moment, but hey ... I am not being paid to make market research or product planning for the company .. so what do I know?
One thing I COULD see (In my imagination and dreams) is Ford taking on the XV/Crosstrek with a Focus Allroad.
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The C3/ C5xx platform will be interesting to watch. The C1/C2 was a big deal with the whole "Mazda/Volvo/Ford COOP development" and it spanning EUCD and CD4. With the way C-cars evolved since C1 was released 12 years ago, and with Volvo and Mazda gone, I am interested to see what they cook up.
The Focus definitely needs longer wheelbase (106.3" seems to be the sweet spot, so let's get closer than today to that). Also fix the short stubby snout.
Having the focus come out in late 2018 is "right on schedule" -- I am not too worried.
I would be VERY surprised if Ford turned EcoSport into mini-Escape on the C3 platform, that platform will likely be WAY too expensive for what EcoSport is supposed to be, and way more expensive than what the competition (in EU/US and in developing markets) offers. Who offer a complex IRS C platform against competition built with twist-beam tech on simple, cheap B-car platforms?
I expect Ford will release the refreshed EcoSport in the US, then I expect the new Fiesta will have new platform, but not revolutionalrily so, maintaining downward compatibility with the likes of Fido, Ka, and Ka+. EcoSport will soldier on its 2016 refresh for ~3 years and then get replaced with a better global car.More and more confirmation of the Model E range is good The fact that it's using the next C3 platform is also good. Nothing terribly news, but it's what makes sense, so I am happy to keep sing it confirmed over and over.
So this is all good. I am interested to see the CD6 piece ... Ford's split between the C3 and CD6 cars will be fascinating -- where will it occur? Will Aviator be Cd6? MKZ? If MKZ is CD6, will Fusion -- Fusion makes a lot of sense as a C3/CD5 car sharing tech with Focus .... SO.MANY.QUESTIONS!
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Ecosport (new to NA), Bronco, Aviator, Everest?
This is my guess. 2 ranger based SUV's one mainstream to chase TrailBlazer and Grand Cherokee and one more intense -- either a "Raptor" or a full on Wrangler 2 door.
EcoSport (WIIC) and Aviator (VIIC) are a given.
There's also this:
Lincoln already has a compact crossover with the MKC, a midsize crossover with the MKX and a full-size SUV with the Navigator. Adding an Explorer-sized, three-row crossover still leaves room to add a subcompact crossover, as well.Lincoln has stated that they do not plan to add vehicles cheaper than the MKZ / MKC .. so this seems unlikely.
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C-segment Lincoln is coming... there is no doubt about that. But it's a few more years away. Lincoln will need to address the price gap between MKZ and Continental now.
Lincoln recently dais that it does not plan to go below MKZ/MKC in price. I Think to me that implies either no C-segment car, or Mustang-based performance C-segment car (based on Mustang)
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Right and the inference by Ford was that 90% dimension makes the Ranger too close to F150 in size.
I defy anyone to sit in vehicles with that much difference in width and mistake one for the other...
We can say the same silly stuff about Explorer Vs Edge Vs Escape, there's less difference between those
yet no one would really entertain the 90% or 95% rule as grounds for exclusion from sale....
I see the new Ranger as more like an Explorer Sport Trac in size with mostly Crew Cab market,
something I think Colorado is currently demonstrating (GM's first choice in body styles anyway...)
That is far and away different to the last of 2011 Ranger SC which were mostly sub $2k sales.
With regards weight and fuel economy for CAFE, imagine narrowed F150 alloy cabs fitted to next gen Ranger
such a move could drop Ranger's weight by 400-500 lbs and make the use of an EB 2.0 even more viable
and the highway fuel economy up to 30 to 32 mpg without a diesel...
I hear you on this, but I would love a somewhat smaller (lower) truck than the T6.
The jump from the old Ranger is just too big.
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Back to Ranger ..... being 2 years behind the first significant move on the midsize truck market since .... well the exit of Colorado and Ranger is hardly trouble. The Taco has been stagnant for about 5 years, the Frontier is even worse; neither will be better by 2018, so really, Ford will be "the next one to innovate and leva the Japanese behind" .... Ford made its own bets (e.g. hybrids, Fusion), being 2 years behind cutting edge is not late to the party. It's letting others fail, and following colosely if they do not.
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I have no use for a transit connect. I doubt it would survive my abuse like a ranger due to the lack of a robust chassis and drivetrain like the ranger has. If I need space for the family we drive the Excursion. Gas mileage doesn't matter much when you need the space. People ask me how I can afford 10 mpg in a family vehicle but the truth is that just doesn't see that many miles.
interesting. Everyone has different needs. I love small trucks, but for what I do with them, the TC would likely be just as good, if not better car for my needs (more usable locked space, load bearing roof, seats 5, shorter and tighter turning radius ... better mileage)... but again .. to each their own, for sure.
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I'm a rural truck lover. And I love Rangers. I have an F250 and Excursion but I drive a 4 cyl ranger daily. It uses so much less gas but still handles everyday throwing stuff in the bed and commuting tasks easily. Plus the 5-spd is just so much fun to drive. Obviously I'm not going to pull a tractor around with it but I have other trucks for that.
If you ask me, the F150 is the goofy needless size. All the footprint and heft of a 250 but without the payload and towing capacity.
Rangers are like cockroaches and my newest one is a 2011. I figure I'm good as long as Ford gets around to making another one in the next 30 years.
I agree with you on so many levels .... I "married" into a 99 Mazda truck 2.5I4, stick. I love that thing. It's currently our only car and it handles everything well (except for passengers). However if we were to replace it, we would likely go for a transit connect than another ranger. I have hard time finding a reason to buy a Colorado (gas or diesel) over a Transit Connect. And I think that is the problem with small trucks.
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As much as it pains me to say this, but an I3 Diesel Transit Connect is a much better use of ford's money.
In EU and other places, a small truck can be a status symbol (go look around Sweden, Germany, UK). In US the status symbol is the large truck. Because of that the small truck is more of a niche market. It ill not deliver measurably better mileage. It will not be measurably cheaper. It will not .... So the markets that are left is fleet and some urban dwelling truck lovers.
The fleets are much better served by Transit Connect and Transit. There is nothing a Ranger could do that one of those two cannot (ok currently 4WD, but that can change easily). Further, the two transit are much more efficient, meaning they can get better mileage, haul more, and be more compact on the outside. All good things, especially for fleet buyers.
So we'r left with the urban-dwelling, small-truck-loving buyer. I think ford figures that market is too small.
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I think you can find much of the Fusion's portliness explained here:
http://www.caravantalk.co.uk/community/topic/102289-ford-mondeo-kerb-weight-1557kg/?p=1128786
1625kg "mass in service" less 75kg driver + 'stuff' (officially "tools") to correspond (roughly) to US legal curb weight of ~3,410lbs on a 2.0L Diesel Mondeo Titanium, which is not far off the 3,427lbs of the 2014 Fusion Titanium (both FWD).
Ford may be able to take 200lbs off the Fusion when they transition to the next generation of the platform, but I don't think they can take it out of this one.
it's always easiest to take weigh out at complete rebuild.
The curred CD4 datas back to the 2004 C1 Focus / Mazda3 / Volvo S40 ... The new MkIV Focus is coming, I hope they did their homework, and gave the C1/C2 a good once over. I feel that Mazda's Skyaktiv, really bumped up the bar in terms of engineering prowess, light weight, and looks. the new VW MGB seems also off to agood start, and let's not forget that TOYOTA (after 25 years) is bringing out a whole new modular FWD platform for Corolla and Camry. It may be a let down, but it also may be a revolution
I sure hope Ford is not caught flatfooted. If they failed to foresee this, I would almost rather see MkIV Focus and MkIII Fusion soldier on based on the same underpinning for one more top-hat, than have a mediocre platform for the next 2 top-hat generations. After all, the next Focus will once again underpin everything from Focus, to Explorer, to Escape, to Taurus. For 15 years or so.
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I have to say that the last 9speed Chrysler I drove was fantastic in all situations. Because of all the gears when I needed just medium level of acceleration, it kicked down just enough to give me torque without the high-revving buzz (I could ask for more and get the true buzzy kickdown, but...). It was a very satisfying, and luxurious feeling. It was similar to hybrids -- you are accelerating, but the engine is not punishing your ears for it.
With that, I am looking for ford to add FIVE more gears to its 6speed.
Also curb weight ... Ford would do well to pay attention in their cars (and I mean cars, not trucks), all of them are a bit portly.
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probably ebay. Try online ford part stores, but if it comes from the factory as a part there is little they can do.
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Well,
the new MKX will be, and will be the same formula as the current one. It will be a big change since the current model rides on a version of the CD3, which traces back to Mazda' the new one will dire on CD4.2 which traces back to EUCD and C1 (see below)
The three-row Explorer/Aviator is rumored on CD4.3 (LWB of CD4.2)
As for "jacked up Focus" lets not forget that CD4 is a freshened EUCD which was a more size-flexible (complex), version of the C1. The C1, if you remember wsa the coop-project of Ford, Mazda, and Volvo that underpinned the Mk2 EU only Focus, Mazda3, small Volvo. It debuted in 2004 and since then spawned multitudes of derivatives to underpin everything FWD/AWD in Europe/Asia.
The C2 is a refreh of the C1, and the CD4 continues to be its more size-flexible, complex version for larger cars. Both platforms are AWD capable, however (without Volve needs) the Focus version of C2 has no need for AWD, so nothing was implemented. New Models based on C2 and CD4(.1, .2, .3) are slotted to be debuting for another 4 or 5 years (the next CD4.3 vehicles Taurus/Explorer/MKS/Aviator/Flex/MKT(will there be one) may be the last reveals to rride on it; production of C1 based cars then should continue though 2020 - a 15 year run.
The next Focus (MY2016/7) will debut the new C3 platform - a ground-up redesign, first time in some 25 years Ford is developing it ownd FWD/AWD platform without Volvo and Mazda. This C2 platform will ripple through Ford's FWD/AWD unitbody offering for the next 15 years. Everyting bigger than the Focus will ride on a version of the C3 platform.
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Anyone else notice the "+" and "-" buttons on the shifter? Maybe they're ditching the console-mounted shift gate in favor of a rocker button.
I think they figured the little button will be enough for a CUV - as compared to a sedan .. and I am positive it is cheaper to add than a real shift gate or paddle shifters.
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most easy.
easiest
and I agree unless Flat Rock has also problem with capacity.
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The Flat Rock plant builds Mazda6s for Mazda. Would it not be a possible Fusion/Milan overflow plant?
theoretically - but the Mazda6 and Fusion share way fewer parts in this generation than in the last one ...
Igor
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Wow, the interior finally gives Lincoln some original switchgear, but I have a ton of questions. The buttons look tiny!
I'm looking forward to this car, finally the interior divorces itself of the Ford parts bin.
I always use the steering wheel controls, yeppers!
they are tiny, but spaced out .. I like the concept it is different, but it is no different, than having giand guttons edge to edge ... this is easier to operate by touch ... you find the nub and push
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by a show of hands - thsoe of you with steering wheel controls - how often you actually use the center stack controls?
Me - NEVER - despite the fact that I have a volume knob on the center stack and a button on my steering wheel.
I hope they do not use touch sensitive - that is a bad idea for cars - IMO
Love the center stack and all the new switch gear - nothing but the handle, door lock and side mirror controls are carryover from anything - everything else is brand new for Ford - or from Ford europe.
very nicely done.
Igor
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we always knew it would happen ..
the thing is ... Ford has no plant ready - it wil ltake them good 12 months to get it done - way to get caught flatfooted ..
Igor
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not much new for 2010 - then 2011 will see changes ... refresh, and more engine options.
Igor
Ford's Future Models and Platforms
in Ford Motor Company Discussion Forum
Posted
I would be shocked if Ford offered a twist beam Focus. The B-segment in the US is now well established, I would also be surprised if Ford messed with their global strategy and make a US-only Fiesta orphan. I could see Ford designing an EU/US specific interior for the Escort and bringing it to the US to prop up sales, but I think that makes sense only when and if gas prices rise.
For now, I am expecting IRS on the focus (all Foci) and global Fiesta with twist-beam suspension.