shrewd

It doesn't really matter, I have finally done the deal. I bought a mazda 6, 4 cylinder with upgrades... Purchase price after rebates 16,227. otd like 18 something. After test driving the fusion, as I said before I went directly to a mazda dealership and test drove a mazda 6, 4 cyl... Trust me, there is a world of difference in sound between those two cars sound as you accel hard off the line. The mazda is a bit quicker than the I went completely out of my way I have to say to give Ford every chance they could to earn my business. At least my Mazda is made completely in the United States and of course mostly owned by Ford.

I looked at the fusion recently again as a perspective buyer. Actually after comming to the conclusion I should be driving a midsized car instead of a compact. The fusions looks are well done. The interior of the car was also very well done... but a few things need to be looked at on that car that would make me buy it. 1) The 4 cyl. engine is WAY TOO LOUD... my goodness I have never heard a 4 cyl engine whine and complain that much .. ever. After seeing that the 6 cyl. engine had no manual transmission, I decided to look at the original mazda 6 instead... The mazda basically has nearly the same engine as the fusion... but something is completely different about the 2 cars.. the mazda is WAY more quiet.. the engine does not whine nor does complain. UNfortunately, the dealer and sales guy were idiots and could not for the life of them find a black interior model as a 4cyl base model for the mazda 6 (they make them as a value package... but these guys were idiots) Strike 1 BTW, I have yet to test drive the Mercury Milan... but from what I have read, the engine there whines just as much as the fusion... Disappointing. 2) On the base model Fusion... no black interior option... Only medium light stone... WHAT???? You have to go for the grandma interior look if you want the base model? Not going to happen. Oh look you have an SE model for a 1000 dollars more just to get a decent interior color... hmm... not gonna happen... Strike 2 3) At 18355 (with the $500 rebate currently in place) at msrp... you are still over priced compared to the competition of the accord and camry... HELLO. Accord value package $18,625.00 msrp... Camry low end model $18,850... the price is still uncompetetive to either of these brands.... With the 1500 incentive last month I am sure your sales jumped.. since that made a 1500 margin between your sedan and theirs... but at this level... it still is weak. Strike 3 The fusion could be very competetive... but you have to offer something to make it competetive. 1) Better soundproofing or engineering of the 4 cylinder fusion engine (talk to the mazda guys again)... 2) Give a black interior option on the base model or at a 200-300 dollar optional upgrade. 3) The price has to be more competetive. The hyundai Sonata is not a bad vehicle and its warrantee destroys fords... Mitzubishi has enhanced their warrantee to 5year bumper to bumper 10/100k powertrain.. so the Galant is a decent deal... The stalwarts of honda and toyota have matched your pricing point and are stronger brands and their vehicles are built in the USA as opposed to Mexico If you are gonna go cheap... pass on the savings. Good Luck

Actually since ford has done the exact opposite of what you would expect from a car as it reaches its end... instead of making the product better with more options since they make more money out of the product because they have already paid for the plant and the manufacturing process on the car by them... and they have actually had time to get rid of most of the bugs... they actually worked backwards and removed nearly every nice feature of this car.. it is appalling that a a focus today is WORSE than a focus a couple years ago.... hello. Nice job REDUCING quality instead of improving. I would love for someone from ford to explain that one... the idiots. I am not an employee of any motor company. I work for a University as a computer programmer...

Loyalty to what? A ford focus? You know that car that when you price it up against any import the MSRP is over 3 grand higher than the import... then you get a 3 grand incentive to match the import even when the fit finish, quality of materials, and reputation for reliability are all crap in comparison???? I took test drives in no less than the Honda Civic LX, Ford Focus, Ford Fusion, Mazda 3, and Corrolla today..... The Ford Focus is so outclassed by the other 4 cars.... it is not even funny... On my impressions list it is Below the Kia Spectra.... and it costs thousands more for the same options too.... It actually shows up for about the same price as a toyota corrolla when you option it up to match the standard features of their cars... and it is not even remotely close to making the grade... in actuality. The fusion is a decent car... Drop its price by $1500 and with the materials in it it becomes extremely competetive with the Camry because of low price and very competitive ride in my opinion. The Materials in the Fusion are excellent. But it is exactly that .. that I have no way of understanding. The materials used to put together a Fusion are great... the seats are fantastic, the fit and finish were good, the interior seemed semi plush, and I had a good feeling for the car... except I am not in the market for a full sized car... I drove one because I wanted to see what it was like... the handling was excellent as well... yet then I drove the focus... What on earth were they thinking???? What the hell is that garage door opener slot for the roof??? Why are they so freeking cheap that they cannot put a 25 cent latch on that thing.. and instead go for a poorly finished and fitting plastic molding that makes it look supremely cheap and fell open when I hit a bump at speed in the road. After driving the focus... I would literally be embarassed for my friends to ride with me in that car.... embarassed that they would believe I am that dumb to make that purchase. The cars engine was good, the handling was fairly crisp as well.. no issues there... but I can easily tell you... NONE of the cars performed any less well on the test drives... and some (mazda and the civic) were really a class above the rest (well the fusions handling was really good, but I am not in that market). In comparison to the other ford family product.... the mazda 3 series.... there is absolutely no comparison... the mazda is light years better of a product... and it costs nearly the exact same as the repulsive focus. I have already started negotiating with the mazda dealership to get some good numbers out of them..... But really ford has abandoned the small car market it appears to me today. Either that or they make a focus for like 4 thousand dollars and just pray someone doesn't notice and pays 10 for it.

After looking at a bunch of cars wondering what car to get there are alot of cars out there with base prices around 20 to 24 thousand. Nearly all of them have anemic gas milage or are a very small car to get ok gas milage... until I saw the Toyota Camry Hybrid. Toyota Camry Hybrid msrp 25,900 Invoice $23,310 Sedan City (mpg) 40 Highway (mpg) 38 Horsepower Gas 192 @ 6000 RPM Electric No data Torque (lb-ft) Gas 138 @ 4400 RPM Electric 199 @ 0-1500 RPM reasonable stats that trump Fords Fusion by LEAPS and bounds by getting over double the miles per gallon in the city and much greater milage on the highway with the same hpp and better torque in the low end . .. But the most damning stat of all even when you factor in that the Toyota hybrid Toyota Camry Hybrid Location: United States Ford Fusion S SE SEL V6 SE V6 SEL V6 SE AWD V6 SEL AWD Location Mexico Mexico Mexico Mexico Mexico Mexico Mexico Who is the American manufacturer now? :titanic:

And you wonder why people hate Ford's cars? If this were an issolated incident... ok... but it obviously is not.. and it would take me having it happen One time, with a look at the fact that it has happened to so many others and they were all fleeced for the cost of repairs to vow to never buy any Ford ever again. When you see a big problem... FIX IT! Stand by your product... or just get out of North America.

Look my father owns a Hyundai Elantra.. great car. My Friend owns an Accent.. another great car... Both of them bought the cars specifically for the warranty. My father is 68 years old... He used to love to work on cars... Yet at that age its time to let someone else do the work... with a 10 year 100k bumper to bumper (with the extended warranty) he never has to worry about working on that car... ever. Most people I know are not concerned with the absolute looks of the car... they are not massively concerned with the price or HP either... they just want all the standard features, a nice ride, a safe vehicle, and not to be bothered. The car is a tool... no more... no less. Trying to redefine it to a lifestyle and all that is nonsense and smoke an mirrors.

Hyundai surged when the cars got better.... and they had the best warranty in the world... Yet you say that Ford quality is good.... and sales still are not surging .... .... uhmm it is obviously going to take something more than just an opinion on quality huh? How about another 1000 incentive... for people that already pay a 3 to 4k premium to toyota or honda for a car they can count on with excellent standard features.... those type incentives will not work because they are not working now... even when fords are low priced comparitively. They need to do more to make people feel confident that ford is a good quality brand... The only way for them to do that is to get them to own the cars relatively issue free. Yet to do that... you need them on the lot... and adding more incentives like another 1k off the price just makes the car seem "cheaper". The time for talk is over... Ford has to prove they are competitive instead of looking like losers and just abandoning North America like they are doing now. They have to step up their game.

Precisely why you need something BIG to get people back in the show room in a buying mood. If quality is good a GREAT standard warranty will turn heads and get people on the lots. If they have the products, then people will buy them. This is how it would play out... You have Mr Ford, and the new CEO in a commerical... They speak of the financial woes of Ford and speak about how quality has dramatically improved and that the word has not gone out... Then back it up. For instance if Ford really thinks restructuring will take 3 years... then say in the commerical. "For the next 5 years ford motor company and all our associated brands (Jaguar, Mercury, Lincoln, Volvo, Mazda.. etc..) will carry the best warranty in the industry (and DON'T lie) 6 year 60,000 mile bumper to bumper warranty with a 10,100k powertrain on all 2007 to 2012 model cars and trucks. Ford motor company is making this commitment to prove to the American public our comitment to America and to the hard working American spirit." This would not only give Ford a great boost in sales, those sales woudl reinvigorate the companies moral... it would get people talking about Ford again seriously, it would hurt Toyota and Honda sales... and would in that climate give Ford a Much better position in the market to make changes. The only caviot to this is that if they say they are committed to America.. Massive layoffs in the US and more bloodletting would not look good, so they would definately have to stop that or finish up with it before they announced something like this. Good timing would be around Thanksgiving on that Thursday Football Game. This would give people time to buy a car for Christmas if they choose to... with a major follow up spot in the SuperBowl. Ford has to get back on the offensive... and this would do it.

I think while what you say sounds good... people buy more Hondas and Toyotas than Ford. So even if you believe that everything must be committee style and lack good sense in favor of the bottom line... the vast majority of people in the US disagree with their pocketbook... Funny how reality and theory diverge sometimes... Basically... "Do what you have always done... and you will get what you have always got" If they do not change, their slide will not end.

This is half the problem... You try to break it down into people that disagree, agree, and perhaps could be swayed instead of listening to those who disagree with you and actually hear what they are saying. The first car I looked at was the focus. The FIRST. Why on earth if the car was the greatest thing on earth would I have not just bought it right there at full sticker price? Because I hate ford as you say? Then why am I on the lot looking to buy their product if it passes the quality and desireability test. I am not trying to sway you against Ford at all. I am hoping someone from Ford reads something like this and understands they have to step up on their products if they want to compete. You and the other guy are trying to brand people as this or that... and in the branding drive potential customers away because you act like their opinion doesn't matter. Well guess what... it is their opinion that makes them buy a car or NOT buy a car... and doing the lumping in thing does nothing positive for Ford or any other brand. I believe they should back up their product and not be so cheap on materials. But of course don't listen to me... listen to consumer reports... it is apparent that ford needs to step up by the list below. Though the Focus is the only car that Ford (not including Mazda) makes that rates the list for best in class in anything. http://www.consumerreports.org/cro/cars/index.htm Best in class: Owner satisfaction FAMILY SEDANS Honda Accord UPSCALE SEDANS Acura TL LUXURY SEDANS Infiniti M35 SMALL CARS Mazda3 WAGONS & HATCHBACKS Scion xB SMALL SUVs Honda Element MIDSIZED SUVs Honda Pilot MINIVANS Toyota Sienna Best in Class Fuel Efficiency.... SMALL CARS Toyota Prius FAMILY SEDANS Toyota Camry Hybrid SMALL SUVs Toyota RAV4 MIDSIZED SUVs Lexus RX400h MINIVANS Honda Odyssey Family Friendly FAMILY SEDANS Honda Accord LARGE SEDANS Toyota Avalon MIDSIZED WAGONS Subaru Outback MINIVANS Honda Odyssey Safety SPORTY CARS Audi A4 LARGE SEDANS Toyota Avalon FAMILY SEDANS Honda Accord SMALL CARS Toyota Corolla UPSCALE SEDANS Acura TL LUXURY SEDANS Infiniti M35 SMALL SUVs Subaru Forester Wagons and SUV's SMALL WAGONS Ford Focus SMALL SUVs Toyota RAV4 MIDSIZED SUVs Lexus RX330 LARGE SUVs Toyota Land Cruiser FULL-SIZED PICKUPS Honda Ridgeline Fun to Drive SPORTY CARS Subaru WRX ROADSTERS Mazda MX-5 Miata SMALL CARS Ford Focus FAMILY SEDANS Honda Accord Hybrid UPSCALE SEDANS Infiniti M35

Anyone can have a bad dealer. Look I guess you are happy with yours. Good for you, you are not in the market for a new car though... I am. There is absolutely no competition at this point in the small car market. Ford has no place in it. If they want new buyers they can either do something to attract us, or they can just watch us buy imports or another brand. To Stang, you could not be less correct. It has nothing at all to do with foreign or domestic. Though with ford closing all its plants in North America it is hard to tell what truely is domestic anymore. As a matter of fact the best driving car I have driven so far in test drives is the Pontiac G5 (Chevy Cobalt rebadged). I would buy that car easy if it were not for the massive amount of horror stories about an issue chevy has NO IDEA what even the problem is with the front end. From what I have read on that car... if you are turning and go over a bump a large series of knocks starts comming out of the front end... It is a COMMON known issue though most dealers try to sell it to the public as "normal", and GM has replaced like crap loads of the front ends of these cars... (all struts, springs, the steering column, the master cylinder, etc... ) attempting to determine the solution... and has YET (over a year later) to come up with one... then they said, they are not going to continue to try to fix it until they actually have a workable solution... so everyone driving a cobalt or g5 has to just live with it... Hello... not me. Yeah sure spend 19k on a car that no one has a clue what an issue is with a years time to fix it... yeah right. These are the types of issues I am speaking of that make buyers think twice about buying "domestic" as you call it. I was looking at the Chevy GTO as well... would that be Domestic? being built entirely in Australia? So get off the red state blue state dance.

Then back it up with a warrantee. If their product is such high quality that you say it is, then there will not be a huge increase in warrantee costs and it can only help ford out. If it is NOT it still will draw more buyers to help offset the costs of their greater warrantee repairs. Get more customers actually having owned a Ford, and if service is high quality probably get them to come back. Talk is cheap. Action speaks volumes. All I see from Ford, is an effort to end operations in North America. Plant closing after plant closing to reduce production to deal with demand... but relatively NOTHING to INCREASE DEMAND!!! That is why their plan will fail.

Yet another questionable point. IN the actual text of the 5 year 100,000 mile warranty they explicitly only state it is valid in "Florida, Puerto Rico, US Virgin Islands, Guam, American Samoa, and Saipan Deliveries Only" .... hello! Is that what the large * is next to that warranty on the commercial? Or have they changed their policy and the information on their company webpage is just old.... Seriously why am I even wondering... I should just buy what I know works well.. Right? Yet to point out the obviousness of what I am referring to.. see below. Oh yeah notice the other little caviot that they fail to mention in the commericals I have bolded it below... you will love this.

http://www.fordvehicles.com/assets/pdf/2007FocusWarranty.pdf Please look on page 8 of the warranty document provided by ford. Perhaps the above was confusing... since it was 60 month or 60 thousand powertrain which is equal to 5 years or 60 thousand mile. Yet their bumper to bumper warrantee is also referenced there as specifically... I quote.. "Refer to pages 32 - 37 for 5-Year/100,000 Mile Ford Powertrain Limited Warranty (Florida, Puerto Rico, U.S. Virgin Islands, Guam, American Samoa, and Saipan Deliveries Only). Vehicle deliveries in all other states are covered by a 5-Year/100,000 Mile Ford Powertrain Extended Service Contract. The measure that occurs first determines how long your coverage lasts. For example: Your Bumper to Bumper Coverage lasts for three years - unless you drive more than 36,000 miles before three years elapse. In that case, your coverage ends at 36,000 miles." Yet this too is confusing and misleading or contradictory to the GRAPHIC placed in that document that clearly states that the power train warrantee was 5 years 60 thousand miles.... not 100k. You will have to look at the document to understand what I am referring to. They explicitly contradict their own statement in their graphic. That said, even if it is a 5 year 100k powertrain, the bumper to bumper IS 3 year/ 36k. The warrantee they show on TV is the POWER TRAIN warrantee. It is the same BS that Volkswagon used to pull saying they had the best warrantee in the business with a 10 year 100k warrantee... that was powertrain only .... their bumper to bumper at the time was the WORST in the industry at 2 year/28k. Even Volks wagon now has upped their Bumper to Bumper warrantee to 4 years 48k miles.. though even with that warrantee, the incredibly poor reliability of recent VW's has ruled out any purchase there, even though from test drives and driving friends cars... that is one of the best riding cars I have ever driven. So please check your figures again.