hemmer1

Just look at us all!Fighting and argueing among ourselves.Yes people in the Jap plants must be having a great laugh at us.I agree that the U.A.W.leadership has failed us.This didn't just happen over the past couple of years,no,it was years in the making.The leadership at the national level failed or refused to look to the future.Negotiating pensions was useless if you failed to make sure that the plants were viable and in a position to earn money to pay the pensions.That is history,now we must deal with the present.Sacrifices were made the last time we kicked the Japs asses. We can do it again.It won't happen overnight but it can happen.To do it we must stop the squabbling ,we must work to-getherand we need to elect to office, people both in the union and in the government who will work for all the people not just their buddies or party.Toyota is in no way shape or form an American company.A leopard never changes its spots.So lets start hitting on the real opposition.Lets start broadcasting about their recalls.Lets try and put some heat on them.

The best way rhat I have heard the difference described was,C.0.A.=company operated agreement,M.O.A.=members operated agreement.The person who explained this to me is in mine and many others for that matteropinions one of the best around on contract knowledge.He also said that C.O.A.'s in their present form are no good for the union or the company.

The C.O.A. based on the one's negotiated by the Detroit local's {local 600 and local 900 ]are nothing like the old M.O.A.As pipefitter said they just let the company do what they want.They give the workers very little input.They allow the company to outsource basically anything they want.They take away incentive from both production and skilled tradesmen.They will threaten us with ihe loss of our product if we don't give them what they want.The C.O.A. is not the salvation of Ford motor,it will cause Ford to fail.Forget the politics,if you really want to understand what's going on,go ask the Irishman.He still has abetter handle on the issues than any of the others.One thing that Ilearned by talking to him is that despite what is said is that skilled trades does NOT have a veto on the contract if they vote it down.Iwas not abig fan of the m.o.a. when it first started but I became a believer when I saw the people getting greater inputinti the running of the plant.Whats wrong with going back to our old M.O.A.?

Baire was our rep in Villager bodyshop. Most times when you needed him you got a phone call.Problem was one of his buddies would call him and let him know that someone was looking for him .He would call security and have them patch him thru to a number in the bodyshop.HE WAS SELDOM IN THE PLANT.That is why he was called RARE BAIRE.It was no secret that Donovan had to save his job over an incident in the bodyshop.Yeah,Mark Rise did not like Donovan[he hated him]but that did not stop him thinking that Kruse was the most stupid union rep that he had ever known.In fact he told many people this.I was not critizising him for being honest.I ,agree ,let the dead rest.

You must be smoking the same stuff as Kruse when you say that he knows the contract inside out.He is STUPID when it comes to contract.He represented me a couple of times and each time I walked away shaking my head.HE sold this membership out , bottomline.Talk to him ,I guarantee he will soon convince you as to how stupid he is.Walk the lines and talk to people ,they;ll tell you all about him.People like him give stupid a bad name.

Yeah,have to agree with you about Kruse. He is a nut. Everyone that I talk to are of the same opinion,he should have stayed in Detroit .The probably had no clue as to what to do with him also.I once asked Mark Rose[r.i.p.]asto why he had supported Kruse in the run -off election.He said because K ruse would give him an appointed job and Donovan wouldn't.He also said that K ruse was the DUMBEST person that he ever met and that he was clueless when it came to contract.As for the present bunch,most of them can only survive by hog cutting.This local stopped going by the book a long time ago.They are the reason why a lot of people are turning against the union.

Ford talks about the way foreward,about new ways of doing business etc. why then did they agree with the u.a.w. to do away with the m.o.a. at the Ohio Assembly plant. They had one of the best if not the best m.o.a. in Ford,it was a people run system,it delivered unbelievable quality and numbers yet to appease some whacko politicians in the u.a.w. they killed it off.Now they are trying to negotiate ac.o.a. which is light years behind the m.o.a.that they destroyedNo wonder wall street won't give Ford a vote of confidence. Someone needs to say we screwed up royally and order that it be reinstated immediately.If Ford doesn't recognize their big mistakes and correct they will continue on the downhill slope.

Jasper,keep talking,specially to people who have been at Ohio Assembly for some time.You'll soon find out who all the hog cutters are.The newspapers said that Avin Lake had failed in their efforts to land a hog plant.Heck we already have one here at the Ford plant.Our master butcher is FRED PENA.Mind you ther are a few more who will give him a run for his money.While you're at it check on our new returnee to the plant ,Ken KRUSE.He cut the biggest hog of all when he sold out the workers in his unit to get himself a job in Detroit.Now the story goes that he is going to run for chairman again to finish the job.This guy is unbelievable.I'm not a big fan of Nick's but I'll take him any time over someone like Kruse.who would sell out his people again at the drop of a hat.He should have stayed in Detroit.

We had a chairman who sold his entire membership out so he could get a job up in detroit with the international.He then resigned from the international because his wife wouldn't move to detroit.Talk about being stupid.Kruse is his name.He was known as a quitter before he went to detroit.We heard that the people in detroit didn't know what to do with him.So much for deal cutters.We used to have a good union before the people transferred to KTP.What they told you wasn't bullshit.Just time and the players changed.Between the union and the company it's hard to tell who is screwing you the most.Now I see we have to sacrifice more.Gimme a break.

Kind of like we were saying.When something that you don;t like starts being discussed ,you edit it or some idiot airhead makes an irrevelant comment. It is clear that the U.A.W. has lost it's revelance to a lot of it'sown membership.As has been said until such times as the membership regain control of the union'it will continue to decline.As for organizing the transplants,WHO wants to join an organization in which they have little or no say.Maybe if the membership really believed that they had some say in the running and decision making in the union you just might have more who would get active in the union.

I realize that we are just speculating,however I believe that what ever he did would have been as part of the contract negotiations.I am sure he would have been more agressive in organising also.Obviously the time to act would have been before the Japanese got off the ground.Forewarned is forearmed,he along with Schrade foresaw the danger,I am sure he would have acted aggressively to protect his membership.

I believe that Reuther would have recognized the threat from the Japanese early on and moved to counter the challange.One of his Directors a guy called Paul Schrade {may not be correct spelling}came from out west,supposedly put out a leaflet in the early 70's WARNING about the Japanese "cancer"that was entering the U.S.Heard that the rest of the leadership contrived to get rid of him.Supposedly he was a protege of Reuther's .Would like to know more about Schrade.

Was in a conversation recently with a guy who has been around and who is active talking about the shape of the U.A.W.and the need to consoliate and about the current leadership of the U.A.W.He believes that the U.A.W.started its decline the day Walter Reuther died!His position was that Walter Reuther was the visionary who knew what the union needed to be and what it needed to do to to be a force for its members.Since Reuther he said that only one President has really had any understanding that has come close to Reuthers,Doug Frasier!After Reuther theU.A.W.lost its direction,it stopped being a union whose No.1 priority was the membership.It became a union for the leadership and for the preservation of the leadership.This guy says that the U.A.W.never was a democratic organization but became less so after Reuther died.His opinion is that that not only is it less democratic but that it borders on being CORRUPT!!Iasked what he thought about the leadership's ability and he said that with very few exceptions{here he was talking about the Ford dept.}few of them had abilities to be even good service reps. He said that anyone who steps back and examines the U.A.W. will see what he is talking about.His opinion was that the W.A.W.will never be a great union like it once was,in fact he said that to have any revelance it will have to be absorbed and become a department of a bigger union.When I asked how did this decline come about he said that the rank and file ALLOWED it to happen because they became complacent and greedy.He said that the U.A.W.went from being PROACTIVE to being REACTIVE with no sense of direction.It is committed to the survival of the leadership.He said look at the perks that the leadership get then you understand.The membership does not control the leadership rather THE LEADERSHIP CONTROLS THE MEMBERSHIP!The tail wags the dog.Part of us getting our house in order is the rank and file REGAINING control of the union.THINK ABOUT IT!!

Haven't been on this forum for a while,reading some of the posts lets me know that I did not miss much.Fishguy look in your local union by laws,you may have a provision like we have in our local by laws which state that you retain all your contractual rights even when you are elected or appointed to office.Also what does art.10 sec. 9 of the National contract say?{equal application}. Don't put all the blame on Gettelfinger,the rot set in years ago.EVERYBODY,Union and Company failed to look and plan for the future.HELL LOOK WHAT THEY DID IN OUR PLANT !!!Took out a good M.O.A then go around the country telling the local unions that they are to negotiate C.O.A's.No wonder the U.A.W. IS IN TROUBLE.Heard that Kruse is coming back to the plant.Yeah JUDAS tried to give back the 30 pieces of silver also.With him in the plant people will need to watch their backs.Just remember this,You deserve your representation,YOU ELECTED THEM!!!

We will always have our IDIOTS out there. Idon't care who is in office,Gallogly, Donovan,George Washington it doesn't matter,these IDIOTS will not be happy unless they can find something negative to say or write about,it's just the way they lead their miserable lives!I'LL bet that if you knew who yhese people were,you would probably find that they were also the one's who have poor or negative attitudes in the plant also.These IDIOTS are the ASSHOLES who are never happy unless they can screw everything up and they generally do!IGNORE THEM!!!!

How many hourly employees are still in G.E.N at the EDISON plant.How many production and how many skilled trades?

I don't embrace homosexuality nor do I condemn those who do.As for the right of free speech,surely the rights of others must be taken into consideration.By the way the U.S. Supreme has on a number of ocassions stated that the right to free speech is NOT absolute.!!

One of the big problems in Ford is that there are too many sanctimonious,self rightious bigots 'working'here who spend more time trying to save my soul instead of their own.I am not going into a moral or religious debate but I would point out that my god said ''as I have loved you ,so you love one another'.If you want something to focus on and to save why not try to save Ford.KEEP YOUR BIGOTED OPINIONS TO YOURSELF.By the way I PERSONALLY AM STRAIGHT,SO WHAT?

Ohio Assembly is safe.How do I know this? The Irishman told me so! He has been right in everything so far.His saying it is good enough for me.

Seems to me 'IRISH DAD' that you have a phobia about the IRISHMAN.I have never heard him claim that he was the savior of our plant.In fact I have always heard him give credit to the people of local 2000.However even management have gave him credit for his MAJOR contributions in securing product for our plant to replace the villager.From what I hear the U.A.W. guy who was responsible for the fiasco in combining the two units was forced into retirement.They busted him down and to save his pension he retired.Meanwhile Jerry still seems to be getting good information from his 'connections'.So much for people being pissed at him up north.In 5 weeks he will get his shot to argue his case to restore unit 2.Many people[myself included]did not think that he would get this far,if he is successful,and now I think he will be,we will have two units and no one will beat him for chairman of unit2 if he decides to run for the job. then look out,this plant wil start to hum.Let me suggest something to you.Go talk to the Irishman you might be surprised about what he thinks in regards to our plant.The issue is LEADERSHIP and Jerry definately gave it to unit2 when he was chairman.Go out on the floor and LISTEN to what the membership has to say.As for our future he says that we are O.K.Thats good enough for me.Everything that he told us in the past came to pass as he said it would.

I don't believe that the Irishman and Nick have many differences.Matter of fact in my conversation with Donovan he seemed like he was defending Nick.He pointed out to me that often there is a bigger picture that most people don't see.He asked me that if the appeal was successful and we went back to 2 units,who would be an alternative to Nick.He's right, at the present there is no one.The only possible candidates are Bruce Yates who is nothing but a loser and Mike Donovan who is too new and needs more experience.So lets help Nick, he has enough to do trying to hold things together.

Haven't been on here for some time.I see that bucktoothgeek is still foaming at the mouth.No one person could be so stupid.I spoke to THE ONE PERSON,who knows what he is talking about[yeah the Irishman] he says that our plant is safe.[OHTP]Thats good enough for me.He also told me that the APPEAL will be heard on Sept.23,I had nearly forgot about it.Also heard a rumor that Kruse might be coming back to the plant as a millwright[?]He musn't be able to cut it in Detroit,surprise,surprise.Still miss our old unit 2 bodyshop.We lost a lot of good people.