fordforever96

So you don't think Ford can sell 100,000 of these in one full year? Check back in one year.

Borg, I'm curious, what were the sales projections for the Lambdas? they certainly aren't setting the world on fire for sales so far... What are the sales projections for the Flex? 100,000 units per year, appears realistic to me. Don't mistaken success by your own expectations, Fusion is doing well for Ford yet i hear nothing but complaining from people who think Ford had planned to sell 400,000 units a year and knock camry off the top. Edge is also selling well... Now please get of your soap box!

Exactly...This is what i can't understand? why are they picking on Ford only? Many corparate companies are doing the same, it's called moving forward and living in the real world... Why is sexual orientation so important? It amazes me how it turns out to be such an issue, it's 2007, not 1950! Get over it people!

I agree with you 100% on this topic...just more exagerrated crap! next...

Hence why i said they have restructuring costs to deal with...

:boring: where have you been!? They have restructuring costs to deal with for the next 2 years, on top of normal operating expenses.

Agreed Fustrating how some people can't think for themselves. Just another example of propaganda! i get sick of hearing and reading information that is twisted or misunderstood with no effort involved in finding out the REAL truth.

the local press is starting to comment on the fact that the base commodores and the Sv6 competitor to the falcon xr6, aren't as smooth, powerful or as economical as the base and 6cyl sports falcons...the holden V8 beat the Fords for power and speed, but still not consumption... 1 billion spent...and no comprehensive beating...hmmm interesting to see how the Orion 08 falcon will do...my bet, it could give the commodore a kicking...the basics are in place, all thats needed is further refinement.

http://www.drive.com.au/Editorial/ArticleD...=19160&vf=2 hmmm further fuel consumption drops... the VE will leapfrop the BF11, as it should! but not by the margin many think...

Here we go people...just as i suspected Most of the increases came with the 6spd auto! sorry but compare that to fuel comsumption drops with falcons 6spd auto in 6cyl and v8s these figures are average at best... ford fairmont ghia kills holdens calais 11.3l vers 10.2l and before people sing the praises of holden being able to drop the fuel use on tha base omega, with a weight increase, just remember the falcon has more power and still weighs a little more...and then theres talk ford will will working on reducing the fuel use even more when the BF11 comes out in a few months... Omega 180kW V6 four-speed auto: 10.9L/100km (VZ 172kW Executive: 11.0) Berlina 180kW V6 four-speed auto: 10.9L/100km (VZ 172kW Berlina: 11.0) Berlina 270kW V8 six-speed auto: 14.3L/100km (VZ 260kW Berlina: 14.0) SV6 195kW V6 six-speed manual: 11.0L/100km (VZ 190kW SV6: 11.4) SV6 195kW V6 five-speed auto: 11.3L/100km (VZ 190kW SV6: 11.4) SS 270kW six-speed manual: 14.4L/100km (VZ 260kW SS: 14.6) SS 270kW six-speed auto: 14.3L/100km (VZ 260kW SS: 14.0) SS V 270kW six-speed manual: 14.4L/100km (new variant) SS V 270kW six-speed auto: 14.3L/100km (new variant) Calais 195kW V6 five-speed auto: 11.3L/100km (VZ 190kW Calais: 11.4) Calais 270kW six-speed auto: 14.3L/100km (VZ 260kW Calais: 14.0) Calais V 195kW V6 five-speed auto: 11.3L/100km (new variant) Calais V 270kW six-speed auto: 14.3L/100km (new variant)

Theres more to sales figures...yes commodore does sell more than falcon, but...holden can pump more cars out than ford (capacity) ford makes more margin than holden per car sold too. The better vehicle does not always sell better than the one playing catch up! same as toyota is market leader overall in Australia but does not have the top selling vehicle and makes less money overall than both Ford and Holden. any other questions?

They may do! This time around ford didn't make enough visual changes to distance them from the rest of the falcon range...i think they look more like the current Merc GM and Ford Crown Vic!

remember people, the vz commodre was behind the current bf falcon, so holden is playing catch up and should by rights leapfrog ford on the this model changeover. -BF falcon weights about 140kg more than vz with 190kw/383nm of torque fuel use with 4 speed auto-10.9litres per 100klm 0-100klm 7.5sec -VZ commodre (model being replaced) has 175kw/320nm of torque, fuel use with 4 speed auto is 11.1litres per 100klm 0-100klm 8.5 now...add say 90-120kg to the new vz, so almost matching the current falcon. -VE 180kw/330nm of torque, no fuel consuption figures released yet, the feeling is the new Ve will use the same if not more fuel than the VZ...and it will continue to use the 4 speed auto, not the 5 speed in base spec, in fact no commodore v6 will use A 6speed auto. The falcon uses either a 4 speed auto or zf 6 speed auto in its 6cyl cars... I've driven the HF v6 4spd commodore VZ and the BF inline 6/6spd auto...so i have an idea, i worked for holden and ford. the new 08 falcon just needs to maintain the current weight, add the 6 spd auto across the 6cyl range, its already has great suspension set sups. The model cycle for bothe holden and ford differ...ford leapfrogged hold in 02 with the BA falcon...its 06 and holden has its turn, so by no means right the falcon off people! anyone noticed, how simliar the headlight cut outs and bezels are almost the same as the Bf falcon!? or the kick line on the rear door around the C pillar...! how i remind people the rear kick line curve was a long time falcon trait before commodore... and yes the VE interior is the best feature, it had to be...the Vz was very dated, BA falcon made a massive leap when it was released... What i'm really curious about tho, is how that v6 will handle the extra weight with only a 10kw and 10nm increase of power...when i drove the VZ it felt sluggish compared to the Bf falcon and it weights over a 100kgs less... the areas in which the new commodore will have to beat the current falcon in are... 4spd auto Trans smoothsness and noise handling dynamics fuel consumption ride quality interior noise, road, suspension and wind. towing ability thats where its has to catch up and exceed! areas like new boot hinges and space are only just matching now, and they still do not have a 60/40split rear seats, falcon had that back in 1988! I like the look of the new commodore, and the quality is 100% better, but they played it a little too safe in forn and rear stying, mid section is great, the front lights just look to much like a falcon!

exactly, i've mentioned this before...and the fact that the vz, the model being replaced by the ve had more front overhang than the falcon! and the tall, unsteady falcon inline 6 has better handling dynamics than the slimer, lighter all alloy commodore HFv6...hmmm tuning makes all the difference with what you have to work with...BMW inline6's some the best handling vehicles in the world!

LOL yeah we do, we build them to handle better!

Ok guys...my point wasn't too clear...sorry regardless of suspension design, the point i'm trying to make is some people focus on the rehash of the falcon platform, the truth is the platform is almost all new. The falcon does use more technically advanced suspension design than the mustang, but as you guys have pointed out is does the job intended for the mustang perfectly. My main point is the tuning of any suspension design is the critical job...the fact still remains that Ford NA still can't tune suspension like it can outside of ford NA and i don't understand why not?? theres nothing wrong with struts, but they aren't are durable as double wishbones. When the charger and camaro are released do you guys think that the mustangs current rear suspension will be able to match the independant designs of its 2 primary rivals? i have fear it won't, ford did develop IRS for the mustangs current platform so obviously ford is thinking the same thing, that it will need the IRS to compete when fresher rivals hit the market. Do you see BMW using 3 link rear ends? or the fact that the control balde IRS kills the falcons previous 4 whatts link solid axle design and that the jaguar xtype, volvo s40, maxda3, and ford focus use the same basic design. The truth is cost comes into the tuning and development of suspension designs, ford NA just needs to fine tune some of there proven systems, and there getting there faster than ever. Exactly! like what GM has done with holden, bring better economy of scale...i do think that ford worldwide is starting to intergrate its entire operations with much better focus...time will tell.

Over hyped? do you think? take the current all new mustang for instance, it employs a rear suspension that for Aus classed as new when used the the xe falcon sedan way back in 1981! it uses strut front suspension to top it off. Now the current updated bf falcon uses a new control blade rear suspension and double wishbone front suspension...so the carry over tweaked rear control blade suspension for the next generation falcon is not old...and the front suspension will be redesigned! So who has the older tech? the crysler lx series vehicles beat the mustang for tech status when it comes to platform design and yes it all depends on how the manufactures tune there suspension designs...but would bet money on the fact that the Bf Falcon would flatten the current v6 mustang for handling dynamics...the faclon beat the Crysler 300c when it was compared locally. The new mustang and falcon are good examples of how new and updated platforms can be handled if done right. The Ba falcon is almost a new platform compared to the Au falcon it replaced in 2002, so stop claiming the platform is outdated... The deck height may be high, but take a look at the handling dynamics of our local commodore and falcon...the falcon is the best handling RWD budget vehicle in the world, the commodore has a shorter and lighter all alloy 3.6 HF v6 and still doesn't handle as well, go figure. Ford and Holden is Australia have become experts on using basics that are tuned and developed at level and budget no other manufacturer in the world has matched so far... Remember the ovoid 1995 Tuarus cost to develop 3billion? our Ef falcon of the same time was 220millon, yet when compared locally the falcon won...hmmm money doesn't buy you engeneering talent! You may not believe that using the current falcon platform would be a good basis for RWD in NA, but it would seem that the current offering is a little stale, compared to the competition...or that ford NA can't tune dynamics as well as the AUS product developers!

also, our top output turbo inline 6 pumps out 270KW of power and 550Nm of torque, making the falcon run slightly faster in a straight line then its V8 siblings! available in 6 speed manual or Zf 6speed auto. i can only imagine ( what a new mustang with the turbo engine and 6 speed auto, mated to the falcons control blade rear end would go like!

not sure on conversion to HP but, its 4.0l capacity, 24valve, DOHC, dual variable valve timing, fail safe cooling system, variable intake manifold. 190KW power and 383NM of torque mated to a 4 speed auto in standard tune, the turbo version 245KW power and 480NM of torque is mated to the ZF 6 speed auto. we now have the 5.4 3 valve VCT V8 230KW and 500NM of torque in base form and the 5.4 DOHC in higher tune with 290KW and 520NM of torque, both of these V8s are mated to the ZF 6 speed auto. not sure on conversion to HP but, its 4.0l capacity, 24valve, DOHC, dual variable valve timing, fail safe cooling system, variable intake manifold. 190KW power and 383NM of torque mated to a 4 speed auto in standard tune, the turbo version 245KW power and 480NM of torque is mated to the ZF 6 speed auto. we now have the 5.4 3 valve VCT V8 230KW and 500NM of torque in base form and the 5.4 DOHC in higher tune with 290KW and 520NM of torque, both of these V8s are mated to the ZF 6 speed auto.

well, not everything! i'd like a new mustang...they are sexy. Many people claim that exuast emissions are what holds the falcons straight 6 back from USA consumption, i believe it woudn't take much, we just had an update to euro 3 emission standards...that engine could be used as a base engine for a new range of RWD drive cars for Ford NA, f-150 base engine and so on...all i can say is the current BF falcon is being regarded as the best locally developed car currently, we even have a high tech ZF 6 speed auto to choose from.

why can't ford NA work with Ford AUS to develop the next generation large RWD vehicles for Ford NA and the next all new AUS falcon due in march 2008? like GM and Holden with Zeta?? The current AUS falcon has a great base to start with...