rorck and roll

LOL. What a coincidence it would be Joe Peter's, because you flatter Salines "pete" ers, and like to suck Peters. :happy feet: :reading:

There is a letter of understanding that deals with entry level wages. Rawsonville and Sterling, according to this letter, will become entirely made up of entry level employees, thus the comment of "phase out" was used. You will be able to read this for yourself if and when you receive your national agreement from the printer. If you would like to read it now, ask your reps to see the letter of understaning on page 90c of the big blue contract book that they must be hiding from you. In other words, as the JSP folks and all Ford folks are booted out of Sterling and Rawsonville, they will have only entry level employees there, which makes them totally separated by wages and benefits to all other "Ford" plants which is why I can't believe that Saline will be Ford, unless the same language is applied to them that is now only for Rawsonville and Sterling. Saline might be used to absorb JSP people, but I would think we would have to vote on that would we not since that would be a change to the National agreement?

Saline, beware. What I understand is that your plant makes consoles and door panels. Why would Ford pay 72 an hour for you folks to build them when companies are going out of business paying less that 22 an hour all in? I would suspect that the committee their is going to have to give a lot of things up to stay open. Are the orange people going to get a raise? Are they going to get upgraded health insurance instead of only having catastrophic health care? If they take you back under the oval, how are they going to phase out Rawsonville and Sterling while you are brought back into the fold? Be very cautious, ask questions, and demand that the Union give you all the information they have about bump in rights (bet there are none), upgrading the benefit package for the current orange temps (bet there are none). Learn from history folks, the past has the anwser. In the late 70's Ford invested over 150 million into Flat Rock casting, then closed the place. They were still bringing new equipment on the day we were walked out. The 50 mill they have put into Saline was mostly to take care of enviormental issues and work from C@A with the door panels from Utica. Don't get too excited about a full return under the blue oval. Ford is not going to close assembly plants to keep open a facility that makes door panels. They may temporarily keep you open to dump JSP people into your plant before they can place them at an assembly plant, but you will never be Ford as you were in the past.

Why would you be so condescending and call me Mr. Unionist? Could it be because my opinions may not be the same as yours and cause conflict in how you rationalize reality? Correct me if I am wrong, but did not the negotiators at American Axle cancel the huge rally at Hart Plaza because they were close to a "settlement" and they did not want to piss off AA with a show of solidarity. I don't think I made that directive up!! You quantify your going to the Palace because you "love" basketball, what a cop out!!! I love the game myself, but I will not step foot in that place. That is my choice, but unlike you, I don't justify flip-flopping. Hell, I like paying low prices for goods, but that does not make me go to Wal-Mart!!! People that dis the UAW are not uneducated. People that have a difference of opinion than you are not ass-clowns. The reason people dis the UAW is because they feel they are not as strong as the organization was once. They feel betrayed as it seems the only way to survive is leave one of the Big 3 jobs you have and start over. Is it the UAW's fault? Some of it is, but the majority is the huge infrastructure of the companies that are supported by the sale of vehecles. That is why it was so numbing to me that our leadership did not raise hell with the intentional shift from cars to trucks to shrink market share. It is not our wages and bennies that are causing the great harm to Ford it is the size of Ford that we have to pay for. Too many empty buildings, poor design in the past etc. are the main reasons for the plight we are in. That has murdered us. We now have no volume to pay for the infrastructure. We have become republicans in our thoughts and behavior. I believe this was best illustrated by Level when he said it will be nice when all we have to talk about is profit sharing. Do not write in this post that no one saw gas prices like this coming, and besides Ford was suffering long before the roll up of fuel. Don't ever say Bill JR, did not see this, everyone, including those in high positions in UAW laughed at him becasue he was so "green', enviormentally speaking. We would not have the hybrids we have now if it was not for him, and that can not be denied. Hell Walter Reuther spoke of this day coming back in 1968. We lived with our head in sand and now we have to dig out, and I believe we will dig out. The anwsers to issues we face are not easy to attain. We all realize that in order to have beautiful roses, they need to be trimmed and manicured with tremendous care and time. We also know that history points us in the right direction. We need to get to our roots again, keep our resolve and ideals manicured, nuture all our plants, but also realize that we are not the only gardener in town, and that if our caretakers make mistakes, they need to be addressed so the garden continues to bloom. And I don't mean manicured for a bunch of blooming idiots.

Typical reply from a typical lap licking wanna be, Captain . You have to be new to the UAW because all you can reference is American Axle, which was a failure for the UAW. Not only did I go to American Axle on more than one occasion, I went when your beloved leadership said don't go because we could hinder concessions they, opps, I mean contract negotiations. Do the dirty work? I have never considered walking a picket line, taking on polticians, questioning "leadership" as dirty work, but I guess you feel it is dirty. I have been at teacher strikes in the 1970's, construction site pickets, teamsters, mine workers, Free Press, Guardian Glass ( I still will not go to the Palace of Auburn hills, but I bet you do Cap), even was at Caterpiler when Owen babble stood in front of the Cat building shaking his fist and spouting about how he would bring them to their knees, funny thing is that he was in front of the building on a Sunday when no one was there so that must be why Cat walked all over us, they did not receive, or perceive the threat!!!!!! Been very active in politics, but don't feel the need to shoot my mouth off like you do. You are probaly involve in politics because it is mandated for you to keep your appointed job. You never anwser the question about Gettlefinger and the current leadership of the IEB sitting by letting them cut car production and our jobs for profits on trucks, why is that? We had teams, joint programs, high level weekly meetings with the company, but we did not do anything but comply. You need to wake up, and really take a look around you. :reading: I have said this more than once ole Cap. There is nothing wrong with challenging your own leadership, if not you have a dictatorship and all dictatorships fail. We think we know why you challenge and choose instead to belittle the membership and curse them with your works, your afraid too. Your afraid they might take you off your cush job and make you organize in South.

What recovery plan did you sit with the company/Union on in the first place? Quit smoking the company pipe with your volumes and not enough workers will quit their jobs to save Ford from Ford hogwash. Believe me, I do understand what the Union is trying to do for everyone, and I also know that the lack of the Union to respond to management in the past has helped put us in the situation we are in now. Since you seem to be an "insider", you should be fully aware that President Gettlefinger told UAW leadership four years ago that he was in a meeting with Padilla when Ford told them they were going to quit making cars, switch to SUV's and trucks, and INTENTIONALLY shrink the market share fron 24 percent to 17 percent because everyone would have more $$$$$$$$$$$$$$!!! Some recovery plan!!! Brother, you should know that was doomsday for us when we did not respond. That move accounts for the closure of 4 assembly plants, countless part plants (ACH) and the mess we are in now to recover from the fall of trucks and SUV sales. We had the chance to stop this, but our leadership did not tell us this plan until well after the wheels of our dimise turning. Hooray for the buyouts no one wants to take because THEY WANT TO WORK!! How dare those UAW rascal members, fouling up such a great plan. Don't be so condescending to this membership. We see that the Union is trying very hard to save all the dues paying members it can, after all, business is business. It is our dues paying dream, Brother, that you folks in leadership that are working so hard, consumed with every members well being, quit defending what has happened, stop tooting your horns as the hard working saviours of the working class and start fighting this company at the point of their decisions. THe leadership sets on boards with the company to be part of the "team" in decision making, so start making the decisions that will keep our jobs. We don't protest in Washington, we don't go to the streets, we don't make politicians jobs miserable when they crap on the working man, no, our leadership wants to get back to the days of discussing profit sharing. It is the love of money that got us in the beginning, and seems to still consume this leadership, if you are part of it, and we know you are.

The ole Captain 723 ( isn't that the Monroe local?) wants you to be patient eh. Such a caring person :happy feet: !!! He probably is feeling great in his appointed job, not a care in the world. If you folks want to bid on all the Ford jobs, have your Union go to the company and demand that the Ford workers be placed on an ILO then you can bid. You should be able to bid since your plant is sold/closed, but funny things happen when "captains" of industry get involved. I think they forgot about the ACH folks, even cancelled the folks that were slated to move in July and August in favor of the "joel Rawsonvlle" followers. Something smells people. Jody and Level, where are you when Monroe needs you most? :happy feet:

I believe Walter saw much worse times. He was shot, beat up, his brother was shot. You may want to check out some of the great man's speeches on the Wayne State Univeristy site. There is a speech he gave to new hires in , I believe 1964, could have been 1968, at COBO Hall when he talked about the day coming when gasoline would be at high prices and the auto industry needed to get away from high horse powered cars to those that are more fuel efficient. through the use of new technology. That was forty years ago, and that is why I said he would have told Padilla to shove it. HE had vision and strength and would not sit back condoning operations that would harm his membership ( the loss of volume which equals the loss of jobs). While I do not blame Ron and Bob for the mess we are in, I think we can all agree at that pivotal moment in time when Ford decided to go from autos to Trucks and SUVS, Brother Walter would have said no way. As a nation we have drifted fom our historical roots. We used to take too the streets for many reasons. Now we won't because it may "hamper" negotiations (concessionary ones at that)!! Brother Reuther could pick up the phone and talk to the President, or the PRESIDENT WOULD CALL HIM>. Now, the President's don't even know we are alive. Today we support and elect Presidents and Politicians that believe in free trade for all countries but ours. We need to get angry and we need to realize you can only give up so much before you throw the dirt and crap back in the face of those who are shoveling it into yours. There is nothing wrong with challenging authority, that is what causes change.

I believe that Walter Reuther would never have let us get in this mess to begin with. He was very active with Unionism throughout the world, visiting India, South America, Mexico.and many other countries promoting Unionism. He was instrumental in helping Ceasar Chavez organize the produce and farm workers. If you recall, President Gettlefinger told an audience of UAW members at the NPC in 2005 that he was in a meeting with Jim Padilla of Ford motor when Padilla said the Company was going to intentionally shrink their market share by reducing their jproduction of cars and swing over to Trucks and SUV's because they are so much more profitable than cars and Ford would make more money with ashrinking market share. Well, we all know that a shrinking market share means lost jobs and our President did nothing, but he did ridicule Padilla in front of us all after the fact that we lost so many members becasue of Padilla's plan. So Level, Captain 723, and Furious Auto worker, do you think Walter Reuther would have kept silent about this and allowed it to happen as Stinkyfinger did, or do you think Walter would have called Padilla, instead of UAW members, an ass clown and stopped it. I think deep down you know the true anwser, but that would mean you would have to spit the weiner out of your mouth that is attached to UAW international e board members. I think you guys settle for the easy route, believe all you are told from those upon high, and will end up slowly boiled like the frog that does not sense the water is getting hot until he is seconds from death.

:happy feet: You paid him back when you left......... now he lost his election ass clown!! :happy feet:

No one cares who you are. But since you want to play the guessing game. let it begin. Based upon all the time you have on your hands I would have to guess that you must have an appointed job in the Union. I say this because you spend a lot of time running the members down and acting like a know it all. Since you seem to be appointed and seem to think you know everything that is going on in all the plants I figure you must be in the Ford department, probably one of the "wiz" kids, as you refer to the new group down there that works so much harder than all the other reps and seem to be proud of an agreement that does away with cost of living, 30 and out, inferior wages and benefits, and you seem to love all the Modern Operating agreements. Now, your claim to being from the East side is probably accurrate, the East side of Jefferson Ave, which would be solidarity house, ass-clown, to use your favorite quote to people you don't agree with. :happy feet: