Twin Turbo
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Posts posted by Twin Turbo
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I don't normally like to repeat rumours, but rumours are all we have, so.......
The Charger Hellcat is the polar opposite of what the future holds for us enthusiasts. But could Ford be giving us one last hurrah before an all electric future? Ford recently updated the Thunderbird trademark. Would they give us a 6.8/7.3/5.0 V8 muscle saloon? That would certainly give us the thunder!
One would assume such a car would have to be based on a stretched S550/S650 platform, so could this be the rumoured 4-door Mustang? It seems a LONG time ago that such a 4-door Mustang was allegedly mentioned at a dealer presentation. And the "6.8 will be for F150 and Mustang derivatives" comment from the UAW agreement was a long time ago, too. There certainly haven't been any mules or prototypes spotted, heck we haven't seen any prototypes of the '23MY S650 Mustang period!!
Whilst I'd welcome such a car, could they just be benchmarking it's performance whilst they develop an EV muscle car, just as Dodge themselves have announced is coming?
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Indeed, the GT used the 3.5 Ecoboost as it was their best engine to win Le Mans.......which they did. The regulations stated forced induction engines could be no larger than 4 litres (the Ferraris run a 3.9 TT V8). The n/a Coyote or even a n/a 5.2 V8 just wouldn't have been powerful enough and adding forced induction was out of the question due to the regulations, so the 3.5 V6 Ecoboost was a natural fit.
If they're not looking to run the GT in Le Mans or similar series, then they can stick any engine they like in it as a road car.
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Oh, I'm a fan of retro design too..............heck, I own 2 S197s! But the S550 moved the Mustang on with a great blend of modern with just enough retro to know without a doubt it's a Mustang!
However, S550 is an ageing design. Whilst I'd love S650 to have been a clean sheet design, I personally feel S550's bones are still a great starting point. Ideally, if they could trim some weight, that would be good (and that's probably much easier if it had of been clean sheet, so now I'm not expecting much). I'd like to see a Gen 4 Coyote. This will likely be it's last significant update. How cool would it be to see 100hp/litre?
A hybrid is needed in my opinion. If the 8th Gen is going to be a full EV, we need a bridge and a hybrid would take that role. My preference would be a V8 with electric assist for the front wheels. There was a patent that hinted at this but my fear is no other Ford (or Lincoln) uses a V8 hybrid powertrain, so it would be quite the investment for Mustang to go it alone. A V6 hybrid as per the F150 and Aviator would be cool though, but the V8 hybrid would be like having your cake and eating it calorie free!!!
The Mach 1 is the pinnacle of S550's for me. I'd like to see the S650 GT use the suspension and gearbox (both Tremec manual and the revised 10-speed auto) of the Mach 1. A light refresh of the interior would also be welcome. Keep the currently twin binnacle design, but improve the plastics and leather and give the Premium trim a 10 or 12" console screen. Make the 8" standard (getting rid of the frankly useless 4" screen and button that look like an 80's calculator!).
In terms of exterior design, a full sheet metal redesign, just moving with the times to keep it fresh. Think of the change from the '09 S197 to the '10 S197.
S650 could be the last ICE Mustang, so it needs to go out on a high.
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22 hours ago, silvrsvt said:
Mustang sales are mostly suffering due to shortages from COVID.
It is still the best selling coupe Sports car in the world the last time I checked
it is also due for a refresh which will pop sales back up again and they will sag again.I'd hope S650 is more than just a refresh. A refresh is what I'd call the '18MY +. S550 needs to be more than a light facelift. And it needs to be on sale ASAP!
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Maybe I'm just impatient
Hopefully we'll see those fully camo'd prototypes by the end of the year. As a Mustang nerd, I'm keen to start learning as much as I can about S650, even if it's just initial assumptions from the spy shots
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I guess with all the supplier leaks on new product recently, Ford are coming down hard. I guess testing at night and on the proving grounds, makes sense. I'm still desperate to see a prototype though!
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As I understand it, it's still called S650, but it certainly changed direction during development. I was due to be based on CD6, but Hackett cancelled those plans and, as you say, the car is now expected to be a heavily modified S550 with elements of CD6.
So, I guess it would be very easy or them to test the engineering side of things in S550 cars, but at some point production intent prototypes with production ready styling will need to be tested. And that will require the heavy camo. Those are the prototypes I'm talking about. Perhaps its still to early for that.
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The 7th Gen S650 Mustang is expected to be a '23MY vehicle so, in theory, the car would be going into production at some point late in 2022. That would mean it's like to be revealed (either at a show or online) around 6 months prior to that, so lets say Summer 2022. So, we're potentially 12 months away from seeing it in all its glory.
Is it too early to expect to see camo'd prototypes? The nearest we've seen is what we assume are very early S550-based mules with a new brake setup. That was over 6 months ago, and we've seen nothing since.
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48 minutes ago, rperez817 said:
As Ford introduces more performance oriented BEV in the next few years, expect them to increase their presence at future Goodwood Festival of Speed events.
The U.K. is making a transition to 100% electric vehicles for all new car sales by 2030. Also, autonomous and connected car technology is advancing very rapidly. Goodwood is a great opportunity for all automakers to showcase their latest products and services in these areas. The Duke of Richmond said at this year's event "The Festival of Speed has always taken a defining position on cutting-edge technology and the future of mobility, and we have long championed electric, connected and autonomous vehicles."
I absolutely get that. But, there are also at least 8 more years of selling ICE vehicles and Ford at Goodwood this year ignored all the superb sporting ICE vehicles they currently sell. BMW took the right approach, with two stands. One for their EVs, another for their ICE vehicles, including the new 2 Series, M3, M4 and M5.
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I attended the Festival of Speed and I can tell you, as a Ford fan, I was sorely disappointed. The Ford display usually includes a great selection of all the sporting Fords, particularly the Fiesta and Focus ST and Mustang GT. Often they'll even show forbidden fruit, cars not available in the UK market, such as the GT supercar, GT350 and GT500. It is usually sporting Ford overload!
This year? The stand had about 5 Mach Es and the Puma ST. And that was it. It was almost as if Ford were embarrassed to show their ICE performance machines. They didn't even show the Mach 1.
Sure, the Mach E 1400 is bonkers, but the Festival of Speed is about celebrating speed, both old and new.
Mr Farley is a true car enthusiast, and I think even he'd agree this was a poor showing.
I'm hoping for better next year.
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That looks to have some nice proportions..........and, hurrah, doesn't look like a CUV/SUV/Crossover!
But Ford have said the Mondeo isn't being replaced, so I assume this'll have a new name.
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5 hours ago, ice-capades said:
Ford notice to Dealers...
INFORMATION
All-New White Space Vehicle Name Reveal BroadcastACTION REQUESTED
Have your team view the June 2 broadcast to understand the plan for revealing the name of an innovative, all-new ’22 model year Ford Motor Company vehicle.SUMMARY
Something Unexpected Is Coming.Please Tune In For A Special Dealer Broadcast On June 2nd To Hear About An All-New White Space Vehicle Coming For Ford Motor Company!
Check back here on June 2 to view the broadcast.
Stay tuned for additional information regarding the subsequent product reveal later in June.
Unexpected. That's a term used for the original Mustang.
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4 hours ago, jpd80 said:
It could also be that the hybrid Mustang is the other variant being built at FRAP.
I do hope the hybrid Mustang still uses the Coyote V8..........and not just 4 or 6 cylinder versions.
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Nothing but rumors..........but we've heard rumors of a 4-door before. And I guess most of us figured that 4-door was the Mach E.
Personally, I'm disappointed the rumor doesn't include a V8 hybrid as I see that as an excellent way of keeping the Coyote relevant in an EV world.
My other question.....IF this is true, could S650 (assumed to be a revised DC2 platform) actually support a 4-door version? CD6 would make most sense, but its been said all other CD6 development was halted after Explorer/Aviator.
- Ford will release a grand coupe four door Mustang in 2022
- Base-Powertrain will be the 2.3 ecoboost combined with the F150’s hybrid tech
- Coyote V8 will be offered with a manual
- The Powerboost V6 will be the top-end option in the four door sedan and it could pump out 500hp+
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9 hours ago, fuzzymoomoo said:
Trust me, if S650 Prototypes have been built they are most definitely not out in daylight hours and they have not likely made it off of the test tracks yet either. What OP posted may have elements of the new S650 drivetrain and/or suspension (I am not privy to that information and I wouldn't be comfortable disclosing that at this point anyway) but it is definitely not a full blown prototype.
That's absolutely what I was referring to. Perhaps my interpretation of mule and prototype are incorrect, but for me:
Mule - a vehicle based on an existing (in this case S550) body but using some parts that will be used on the next gen (S650) vehicle. In this case, we can tell it has different brakes, so the assumption is these new brakes will be seen on S650
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Prototype - a much more developed vehicle that is, in all intents and purposes, production intent in 95% of its components.
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If something is coming for the '22MY, they'd likely have to release it in the next few months.............the '22MY Job 1 is expected to be in October this year (as per this screenshot........it relates to the GT500 enrolement program for dealers)
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28 minutes ago, fuzzymoomoo said:
I don't want to be a dick about it but I really believe you’re wrong about this.So what do you think it is then? With only one more model year ('22MY) to go before we expect to see S650, I'm certainly not expecting any special editions or upgrades to S550 for just one year.
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7 hours ago, silvrsvt said:
Its most likely an early attribute mule...the wheels look screwed up offset wise (maybe AWD like they said in the article) and maybe new brakes or just a electric parking brake is being tested. The hood looks flatter too, but that might just be the camo.
Yeah, pretty sure it's just an early mule for S650. The wheels are from the Mach 1 Handling Pack. They have a very aggressive offset that require a small plastic fender lip on the production Mach 1 (they run 305 up front, 315 in the rear).
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I'm from the UK and cannot recall seeing a brand new Galaxy or S-Max for a couple of years.Same goes for the Mondeo. The Edge was completely killed off here a year or so ago.
It's all about the Fiesta, Focus and Kuga.
Both these are great 7-seaters though, and the only such cars Ford sells here. They make much better use of their space that an SUV, but MPVs just seem to have fallen out of favor over the last decade.
There were rumors of a 7 seat Kuga (Escape) so I wonder if they'll bring that here to fill the gap once Galaxy and S-Max are culled.
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1 hour ago, rmc523 said:
Lol at the salute there.
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Is this an S650 mule or just another special variant one ('22 MY)? Those are Mach 1 wheels.
With regards the salute..............I honestly think Ford want the attention. Why else would they put camo on a stock car? They're not trying to hide changes, because this is just a mule using the current body. The camo actually has the opposite effect here in drawing attention to an otherwise almost stock car. So the fact the driver is "saluting" is a little ironic
As for another special variant for '22MY........I doubt it, although it's possible. Those are indeed Mach 1 wheels, specifically they're the Handling Pack wheels which have a more aggressive offset, so I wonder if this is needed to clear the revised brakes.
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An early mule with an interesting brake setup
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It's a bit of a jump, but Ford re-Trademark Thunderbird and then they are spotted testing a Taycan........
https://fordauthority.com/2021/01/is-ford-considering-building-a-porsche-taycan-rival/
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This "stuck on iPad" with almost every control buried in a touch screen needs to stop. Not only (in my opinion) does it look ugly, but ergonomically it must be a safety hazard with the user's eyes drawn to the screen rather than the road.
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21 hours ago, pffan1990 said:
I think there may be a reveal of some kind around the April 17th historical date but it would probably be a Concept form of it.
Ford haven't given is a Mustang concept since the S197 was previewed by the stunning concept in 2003.
Most commentators that reported on the "progressive energy in strength" sculpture that was shown at the Chinese auto show back in October seem to think it previews S650. I hope so, because it looks gorgeous to me!
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Why is Ford benchmarking a Dodge Charger Hellcat?
in Ford Motor Company Discussion Forum
Posted
This is what I'm hoping. I'm gutted that CD6 was cancelled as the potential for mouth watering RWD sedan/coupes (including Lincoln) was there for the taking. Perhaps Ford see a better return on investment if S650 is stretched to include a 4 door sedan/coupe.
Right now though, I'd settle for a spy shot of a proper S650 prototype to give me confidence we're really getting a new Mustang in the next 12/18 months