sparks will fly

http://www.blueovalforums.com/forums/index...?showtopic=7866

Maybe I'm screwed up on this one but what about the dipshit who called or e-mailed the news guy to begin with? This is the one who started this shit to help make someone look bad. That is the problem with this world today to many people are worried about someone else getting ahead intsead of worrying about themselves. The give away is that they were concerned about these guys is BS, if they were really concerned confront them not have the news do it, cop out.

They are all over in the main building but moreso on the truck side than SUV, warm and fuzzy feeling isn't it?

I was refering to the last time we gave them something back but I'm with you on the next contract. It will be the talant on both sides that take a hit.

If he is a union negotiator why would he want to wait to bring him in? Sure if he is head of human resources then he will handle both but his background will give Ford one more hardnose on the frontlines during contract time. Most things most likely are agreed upon already but the sticky points left will be the fight and Allen found who he wants to send in the ring.

Your right about the 30 years sorry about that. I agree with the buying of insurance at least looking into it but be carefull about preexisting conditions. If his health is bad enough coverage may be to high, so the early out may be the best for you. That is the beauty of this everyone has a different reason for looking into the future.

The answer is in the name of the thread, $100,000. As in buyout.

I would suggest shopping for insurance to see if it can be an option for you. Maybe that would help decide which way to go. After rereading your post he cannot get the $140,000 because he is not 55, so it would be $100,000 or an early out.

I thought it was 10 months ago?

You might feel at home if you come we just got another maint. supervisor from down south, G.H. I think. I guess he was maint. down there?

Listen it goes like this. where ever you start and where you train has a bearing on who you are partial to. Most of us do this because we want to believe that we had the best training we could get either in the IBEW or at Ford. Most trades that started at Ford have a different sense of loyalty to them and feel like they owe them alot. That is fine because that is the way I feel about the IBEW, they trained me and no matter what I do they will take me back because I didn't burn my bridge when I came to Ford. So when I leave and if I have a chance to come back for a contractor I'm sure I would look at that closely. From your post earlier your numbers look like what IBEW electricians make here in KC with benis and unless Ford is a part of NECA (which they are not) they will have a contractor in the middle of this somewhere. I have thought this has been the plan for a while now in all plants: Have FPS do all they can to keep it running, when they can't call the contractor to fix it and Ford not have the responiciblity of those tradesmen. In KC we have 240 electricians, with a contractor only for the big stuff he would have about 90 on his payroll. The end result is Ford saves BIG money and can point the finger at someone else when it doesn't go thier way. Besides we are capable of doing it on our own, but just like the reason I came here in the first place is MONEY and job security and with Ford's plan not looking bright for the trades future it is time to move on for me.

You can blow if you are IBEW your in. Oh thats right you were bitching about them on another thread.

A list that was in the maintanence shop today (Nov. 1) I don't know who got thier hands on it but the numbers go like this: Total number - 711 Electricians - 26 Pipefitters/plumbers - 15 Millrights - 6 Toolmakers - 4 Hilo mechanic - 4 Tinner - 1 Cleanup - 23 The remaining on the list were production, it was hard to tell the way the list is setup but it looks like it is grouped in the package chosen. This is all the info I have seen so far for our plant if anymore comes up I will post anything I can.

You guys better get back on the topic or fordskilledtrades will get mad and start another thread until someone answers the question.

Sorry I just got this one, we have had one buyout here already, guys left from July 1 to Oct. 1.

Man your good. That is the way I read it too. With a month to go it is anyone's guess but the whole welder thing I would question heavily. Not to long ago I was talking to a manager who without going into specifics he talked about the welders slowliy going away, housepainters and concrete finishers future not looking so hot. He made the comment about having 8 trades in KC. Not starting anything nor putting to much in it, but they have a plan and surprisingily they are keeping tight lipped about it. By the way fordskilledworker the first post didn't go the way that you wanted, but most of the threads on here go astray. More or less it stayed on topic with why the buyouts not how many. Have you found more than 6 electricians yet?

23 months is for STEP ($100,000) as soon as you leave for ESTEP ($140,000). These are options 4 and 5.

Some of the St. Louis guys did come as trades but not many. I don't recall exact numbers but somewhere around 3 to 5 electricians, 3 to 5 millrights, several toolmakers, and I think pipefitters had the most come. Don't quote me on these numbers just going from memory and that is failing nowadays, the less I know the faster I can go. Really these numbers are small for the amount of trades that were at St. Louis seems that only a handfull made it here as trades. With the next buyout maybe some spots will open up here. After 14 years the changes I have seen are big in the maintanence dept. When I hired in all the bosses were former skilled tradesmen so they knew what was going on and right from wrong. It seems like the teachings of Jim Delapp have rubbed off on others here and that "yes man" mentallity is the key to failure. DW called him his problem solver when we all know he was the problem. The last new boss that we had came from St. Louis and had a good head on his shoulders. It was good enough to know that he didn't need the BS anymore and he left for a better job, when he did is when I realized that he had the right idea. If he was better than Ford's BS than so am I.

Well just a hunch but as quiet as it has been since the first of the month I feel like a bomb will drop here after the signups are over. Not sure if it will be COA, loss of production or something else but even in my forties I feel like I have a better chance outside than in here in the long run. Even if I make a choice that some feel is wrong it will be my choice and I will be happy with it. One of the biggest reasons for my change of heart here is the way Ford's management has changed. When I came here less time was spent puffing out thier chests making sure you knew they were the boss. They knew what they were doing and how to do it. Most of all they respected the people WAY MORE than they do now. When was the last time you bought your boss a cup of coffee and sat down just to BS about real life? That hasn't happened to me for a LONG time, most are to busy TRYING to do my job or trying to impress someone to move up the ladder. Sad part is the don't DO thier job and the place seem to be falling in around them and they don't see it, setup for failure.

Well lets see, since most of the installation of all machinery is done by either ECA, Midland or Capital I would say that the IBEW does a little industrial work here. If any Behr work is done useally Mark One does it. As far as programming and startup that is useally the builders job to sit on ie, Pico, Oxbow, Dominion, etc. That has been my whole point, IF Ford chooses to let us go or we decide to leave the choices given away from Ford are more limited for you than me, reality. Sure you have a trade and you will be able to work as an electrician, make good money and pay your bills. The origininal question is if skilled trades should take a buyout, and with the choices in front of me because of where I came from I siad yes. If you think you know, how long ago was I a supervisor and did you work for me?

Just keep Frankie G. up there we don't want him back, besides your right he doesn't have a clue.

Shit talker? I'm so glad you can tell so much and showing your intelligence with those big words, I never have claimed to be the best speller in the world. As far as being pathetic and overrated when did you become the judge? I have never forgotten where I came from and now with a decision to make I will concider going back. If you don't like the IBEW that is your deal and I don't care, if they won't take you I don't care about that either. I think I have more clues than you think. Wow PLC? Is that allen bradley? Is that a 2,3,5, slc or mod. slc 5/01 thru 5/05? Is that HMI or HIM (human interface module)? VFD, allen bradley 1333,1336, power flex 70 or power flex 700, maybe baldor drives? WTC not much with that in a final assembly. RSLogix 5/500/5000 or ICOM, maybe 6200? C/AD controllers for a Kaw.? How about a ABB, american, or Deblviss? Tell me something about GML, perceptron,a smart inflator or a clear vision tool? So while I give it a rest why don't you blow me.

Well I can only think of two guys that are ERT's on the rock, both were on days in CTC during thier apprenticeship. Those were the days when 12 hour days were not uncommon, when some of us worked with you guys for 4 hours. I have a idea which one you are but it doesn't matter. As far as 3rd shift in CTC 3 of us are IBEW one came from Kenworth and now 2 trained here at Ford. One of those trained here is the alt. apprenticeship cordinator.

Simple it must be a local thing. Local #124 in KC has a excellent school with many classes for joureymen to expand thier education. From PLC classes, instruments, and code master classes to name a few. I have yet to figure out why anyone thinks that the education is so much different. Most of the OJT is the biggest differences but the class rooms can't be that far apart don't you think? Isn't Ohms law the same in Norfolk as KC? Like an old super on a job used to say " green is ground the world around." Personally I would like to believe that our classes are the best but it is because the way they are taught that makes me think that way.

Stick to the point? OK. This argument is about how you think that the IBEW guys are grunts and that Ford apprentices have better training to do the job. Like I said before your training is applied differently than ours but ours is just as good if not better. The teacher I had would run circles around just about anyone here at Ford and he is an electrician. I think you should stay here at Ford ride the horse till it dies and hope that you can find work if they die. As far as the original topic it asks if skilled trades should take the buyout and KNOWING that I can go to work outside of Ford, have a good job with good beneis I say I will. As far as Ford apprentices go I know between 5 to 10 that I would work with anywhere I had a job, you my friend are not one of them.