7Mary3

O.K., that would significantly increase the volume, but wouldn't that be even more of an incentive to use Transit parts? Consider what GM did in 2003 with the Topkick and Kodiak medium trucks. A medium duty truck cab that used the windshield, doors, dash, and a lot of trim from their full size van line. As long as the Transit is the right size (and I think it is) no reason not to.

I was told the V-10 is not cheap to build. 30 valves, balance shaft, 2 extra piston/ring package/rods, ect.. The whole reason for the 6.2L was to make an inexpensive replacement. Yes, there was some economy in manufacturing and parts commonality because the V-10 was so similar to the 5.4L, but soon (with the demise of the E series) the V-10 will be an orphan.

Yes, but why would Ford want to tool up a new exclusive cab just for a vehicle line that this year will be lucky to break 8,000 units total sales? Not to mention it is a highly competitive cost sensitive market. My feeling is (FWIW) is Ford is going to take a new approach to medium duty, offering a very price competitive truck tailored to a few specific markets. I think they will be economizing wherever possible, and thus a cab based on the Transit front end might make sense. I am thinking about a truck of less than 26,000#'s GVW, 6.7L Powerstroke diesel or V-10 gasoline, Torq-Shift transmission, and hydraulic brakes. Offer a bunch of different wheelbases, Pro-Loader low frame option, and call it a day.

Question! So it looks as though ALL E-series will be phased out, including the cutaway 450 models? Ford has trademarked T-450 and T-550? Does this mean that Avon Lake will be building 450 and 550 cutaway versions of the Transit? Now that would be interesting!

Indeed! I know what you are saying. Thing is, I work for a large fleet (light, meedium and heavy trucks) and we are looking at being predominatly CNG within 10 years. Even in a commercial fleet, diesel is making less and less sense (cents?). Agreed about the F-650, but diesel emission controls are very similar in all trucks now, regardless of weight class. Price a 6.7L F-250 against a 6.2L F-250 (you can do it on line). The situation could change, liquid hydrocarbon fuels synthesized from natural gas is a possibility. I am looking for more Ecoboost type engines, maybe a 4.5L for HD pickups. Interesting about the CAW and the V-10. I seem to remember reading that somewhere.

Doubt it. Where I am, diesel fuel runs 10-15% MORE than gasoline, and the added cost of purchase is starting to have a NEGATIVE effect on diesel sales. Not to mention the added repair and maintenance costs with these new generation diesels. Direct injection gasoline, Ecoboost, CNG/LNG for commercial vehicles. Unless things change, diesel is on the way out. Side note- Ford's new gas V-10 powered F-650 will sell for over $8000 less than a comparable diesel model. Where's the break-even point for diesel now???

No reason to think there will not be a 750 at this time. I am hearing a rumor that International will consolidate Escobedo and Springfield production in the large new plant they are taking over in Barton Alabama. I wonder if it will effect the Blue Diamond trucks.

I want to start a new topic thread just for the upcoming 'new' F-650 that is supposed to be built in Ohio. Post any and all information, rumors, speculation, wild rumors, spy photos, links, ect. here. I figure (FWIW!) that we should be hearing something soon if the truck is supposed to come out in 2014. Let's try to track down that Magical Mystery Avon Lake Medium Duty!

The real question is how profitable has Blue Bird been. After it was sold by the Luce family (who started the firm) it has been owned by a couple of organizations (including Henley's and Volvo Truck), spun off, and went bankrupt before Cerberus got ahold of it. Blue Bird is up against a couple of monsters in International and Thomas (Freightliner). Both can leverage school bus chassis development and manufacturing with medium duty truck. No idea what Blue Bird makes or looses since they are a privately held firm, but Cerberus isn't known for buying winners, are they?

Not in the U.S.!

I heard a rumor that Ford is looking to buy Blue Bird off of Cerberus. All I can find is Blue Bird is planning on using a Roush prepped LNG V-10 engine in some busses. I would have to say the rumor sounds like a long shot, as Cerberus ownes Blue Bird and NABI, and I would think they would want to sell them together. IF they are in fact for sale. Can't imagine Ford is stupid enough to get involved in public transportation..........

I would have to assume at least some of them did. We bought a number of the 2001-2003 dedicated CNG F-150's. Also had a lot of trouble keeping plugs and coils in them, but that is to be expected. We had other F-150's that were converted dual-fuel (GFI). The last time I was at Landi-Renzo they were doing a bunch of 5.4L E-350's

We just took delivery of a bunch of Landi-Renzo/Baytech CNG Chevys. They do nice work, I have been to their conversion facility. Triton/Mods have not been my favorite engines for CNG conversions in the past. Seem to have more valve/seat wear than other engines on dry fuel. I think Ford realizes there is an issue, they are emphasizing valve upgrades on the V-10 for CNG/LNG.

Almost no intrusion.

I get it, believe me! Here in CA., there is also the added cost of DPF retrofit, which can cost upwards on $14,000 per truck! Many fleets are faced with the prospect of either retrofitting an older truck if they want to continue to use it, or selling it out-of-state and replacing it. This is driving a lot of vehicle replacement, and a lot of fleets are getting really leery of diesel.

In my line of work, it is easy for me to loose sight of the need for the generic spec. medium duty. Without a doubt a great many mediums are set up for nothing more than a simple van or stake bed, while my mediums are highly customized vehicles set up to to be rolling tool boxes. If what you are saying is correct about Ford going for the generic medium market (and I have no doubt it is) it makes sense with regards to Ford's plan on taking medium duty back 'in-house'. I pointed out in an earier post that I suspected Ford's future class 6 medium duty plans will be specific, aimed at certain markets, rather than trying to compete with IH and Freightliner truck-for-truck. However, Ford did try this tactic from 1988-2002 with the Mexican built F-series mediums. Very limited options and a low price, but not very successful. I was told one of the ideas behind Blue Diamond was to increase the availble options and configurations at minimum cost.

Well, to be totally honest I'm not too sure Ford should bother with class 6 and 7 anymore. Their strength is clearly in class 4 and 5. Nonetheless, if Ford wants to be taken seriously in class 6 and larger, they need a sales support organization to assist dealers and large customers. A typical class 6 medium duty has 1000's of available options to taylor it to the job it is purchased for. As an example, you may not only have a choice of several different alternator outputs, but often you can choose between Remy, Leece-Neville, or Denso alternators. You really can't expect dealership staff to keep all that straight.

If Ford is going to be a serious player in trucks larger than class 5, a specialized sales support operation is needed, not only for dealers but for large customers as well. Such an organization is probably not needed for Lincoln, but given Lincoln's market share of late I wouldn't use them as an example!

We are talking about the factory reps. that call on dealers and large fleet customers. Ford had a staff that handled medium duty (and heavy when Ford was in it) exclusively. These guys were important, and now medium duty sales support is rolled into regular fleet/commercial. One of the guys that worked in my area is now selling retrofit DPF's. If Ford was going to stay in calss 4 and 5, it wouldn't matter so much, as those trucks are so similar to HD pickups with regards to options. Class 6 and 7 medium duty is a whole 'nother ballgame, and proper spec'ing is critical. Also, with regards to dealers, the demise of Sterling has hurt Ford a lot. I lost most of the former Ford Heavy Truck dealers in my area, and along with them went a lot of Ford medium duty sales expertise.

Ford has not had any dedicated medium/commercial sales reps. for years! If Ford is truly interested in medium duty (and I for one still question if they are) they need to do a better job of supporting and educating their dealers.

The Torq-Shift will be quite a transmission once Ford gets the programming and shift soleniods figured out. Til' then, an ever-increasing number of TSB's...........

Well, from someone with near 30 years in utility and government fleets, let's say Ford 'bought' a lot of that market share. The majority of those sales are low bid, and the folks in charge of purchasing really couldn't care less what make the vehicle is, as long as it meets spec. and it's the cheapest available. Nonetheless, Ford's market share is impressive in those fields. Ford also often beat GM and Chrysler on delivery time too, and sometimes that could be a factor. GM could be a real PITA if you had a big order in the past, particularly medium trucks. Which brings me to another point: WHERE ARE THE MEDIUM DUTY TRUCKS????????????? I am starting the think the whole Avon Lake move announcement was a ruse to get the UAW local to sign the latest contract. No platform code, no prototypes, only a few old rumors...........

Does that thing use a Dynacorn body? $150K is awfully steep, you can buy a lot of nice restored Broncos for that.

Very cool! Thanks for posting that. Ford, GM, and Chrysler were all working towards gas turbine truck engines in the late 60's.

I think H561 might either be the current F-650/750, or it was an aborted update to the Blue Diamond medium duty trucks. I say this because I found a couple of engineering 'help wanted' job postings for postions in Navistar to work on H561. Specifically, they were looking for body engineers to integrate H561's body systems with those of P473, which is the 2011-up Super Duty F-250-550. Amazing what you can find out reading the Michigan want ads! http://www.simplyhired.com/job-id/c2kpqbfnqf/body-engineer-jobs/ You have to wonder if the decision to relocate the mediums to Avon Lake was somewhat 'last minute', seeing as they were looking to hire for Blue Diamond only a few months ago. Not sure on the next gen. medium duty launch date. I figure sometime in 2014, after the bulk of the E series is discontinued.