Oac98
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Posts posted by Oac98
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On 2/27/2024 at 8:11 PM, Trader 10 said:
Remember that Ford in October announced it was postponing $12 billion in BEV investment. We have no idea what it would cost to postpone production another 24 months, but I don’t think it would be billions. It will cost billions to retool the plant and get the new models out. If the currently planned models aren’t competitive Ford will never make a profit building them.
1.8 billion Canadian to retool OAC
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23 hours ago, joseodiaga4 said:
According to Borg, Ford has delayed the launch of the 3-Row EV by another 2 years, pushing it out until Late 2027..
He says that Ford is going back to the drawing board on the battery pack with a complete redesign that brings it inline with the CE1 platform.
Also, the vehicles may see major redesigns.
This may also explain why Lincoln abandoned electrification plans at the dealerships and removed the Lincoln Star.I’m skeptical and what happens to OAC for the next 3 years?! We have a Stellantis plant that’s on a 2 year retool. If this turns out to be true at all Ford fucked up royally.
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I will let you guys know when our downtime length is announced unless it comes out in the news first. I won't be shocked if they push it back further but who knows.
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22 hours ago, jpd80 said:
On the covered spy picture, the squared off rear of the vehicle that everyone see is actually scalloped
when looking from the rear. Don’t get me wrong, the vehicle is not awful, it’s just not what the folks in
the clinics were expecting, a boxy 3-row like Explorer. If people were looking for a large car hatchback
crossover, then these vehicles will delight those folks, I just don’t think Ford is pitching this vehicle
early enough to build up the hype, they’re gonna let it plop on the market and wonder why folks just
don't respond/ say anything. IMO, it says more about Farley than any vehicle shortcoming…..
I agree they’ve been awfully quiet about these vehicles, they’re coming out within the next year to year and change it’s time to get the ball rolling here on showing them. Farley seems like a decent ceo but that’s a whole other discussion.
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21 hours ago, DeluxeStang said:
Apart from the other image going around, this is all we have to work with at this point in time. Looks smooth.
I’ve seen that, I hope the tarp comes of by the summer or fall. It’s time they show what’s these vehicles actually look like.
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17 hours ago, DeluxeStang said:
I don't have any insider info, I'm just going off of what credible insiders who's seen the finished product have said, people like jmd80 and ExplorerDude. As what why Ford would go ahead with producing them, they don't really have another choice. The current edge isn't competitive, and if Ford wants to bring back a c2 edge or something else, it's going to take a while to put those plans into place. They need something to sell in the meantime even if it isn't going to sell particularly well.
What you’re saying makes perfect sense to me. I can’t wait to see what they look like.
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19 hours ago, akirby said:
Many times focus groups are wrong. It’s a very small sample size. You only need to appeal to 100k - 200k buyers a year so you can find a niche. Especially if it’s something unique.Not saying that’s the case here but I’m sure that’s the thinking if they’re continuing. Then again that’s probably what Pontiac said about the Aztec…. ?
I hope to God it isn’t hideous like the Aztec lol
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2 hours ago, DeluxeStang said:
That's my line of thinking as well. I understand this Chinese edge isn't a flawless vehicle. I'm just trying to think of what Ford can do to fill the void the edge is going to leave behind.
It seems like the Oakville three rows were intended to be indirect replacements for the edge, but they aren't going over well to put it lightly. I'm just looking at what Ford can offer, and fast. Trying to replace the edge last minute and quickly, basically the only way you're gonna be able to do that is by grabbing something that already exists in other parts of the world. Looking at midsized 5-7 seater crossovers, that basically means your choices are Everest, evos, or edge. All good offerings, but as we've discussed, they also have their own share of downfalls.
It'll be challenging for sure. Trying to find a way to stay in that segment, and doing so in a way that aligns with Ford's newer strategy of getting away from commodity products.
If the three row Bevs aren’t being well received why the hell is Ford forcing them out?? You seem to have knowledge of people not liking them. I also think Ford wants Mach E sales to increased with the Edge on its way out. Maybe they just want the existing products they have to fill that void. Lincoln has minimal product so keeping Nautilus alive was a no brainer.
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1 hour ago, DeluxeStang said:
So don't sell it as the next edge. The edge was never iconic anyways, but the explorer is. Expand the explorer sub-brand, take the third row out, all of a sudden, you have a two row crossover with class leading rear cargo capacity.
Retrain your brains to look at that design not as the next edge perhaps, but as an explorer sport or something. I firmly believe what's throwing you guys off isn't the styling, but the fact that it's called an edge when it doesn't look like any other generation of edge. Call it explorer, and you'd be surprised by how quickly the styling starts to look natural.
I wasn't a fan of this design at first. But it's grown on me.
You make some valid points, it doesn’t look like any Edge at all that’s forsure. We will see what ford if anything will do about this whole situation.
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12 minutes ago, akirby said:
The Chinese Edge is not a good looking vehicle to me nor do I think Edge buyers would like it. It needs an entirely new greenhouse and shorter wheelbase to sell here IMO.
Agreed
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8 hours ago, DeluxeStang said:
Why don't they bring the Chinese edge here? They're already planning on importing other models from China, the Chinese edge is hands down the best looking edge we've had in some time. Buyers who wanted a boxy midsized family hauler would be all over this thing. I've mentioned before if the edge doesn't align enough with Ford's new strategy of selling passion products, they could just rebrand this product as the explorer sport or something else with better name recognition.
Edit: Saw your and Oakjay's later comments. I'm surprised you guys don't like how it looks, based off other posts, it seems like you both tend to gravitate towards boxier styling. I agree it's not the most striking or special looking vehicle in the world, but I generally prefer it over the lump that is the current edge design. I find it to be quite attractive, especially in this color.
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I just don’t think that looks anything like an Edge. It’s just a big 7 seat crossover that won’t see North America unless they shrink it down to 5 seat and changed the styling. 5 seaters are a commodity to Farley so I still doubt it will ever happen although possible.
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12 minutes ago, fuzzymoomoo said:
That’s a nice Hyundailol
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7 hours ago, jpd80 said:
OAC is turning into a shit sandwich of epic proportions, the best thing Ford can do is lump it
and keep going, it needs to at least see a ROI for the development but let’s not forget that
part of that CN$1.8 billion investment is also for a battery plant separate to Oakville
I’m curious to know who those suppliers are and suspect that since CD4 Edge/Nautilus was developed from EUCD which itself was an expansion of the original C1 (sorry for the torture)
maybe many of them also supply for C2 vehicles?
So while last supply orders for Nth American CD4s were locked in 12 months ago, I wonder how quickly
a C2 Edge/Nautilus with hatchback rear would take to develop if done as an extension of the current
3-row Edge…. How serious are Ford?
As I mentioned above, how far would Ford go to reverse course and build a restyled C2 Edge/Nautilus
in North America? Ford is pretty much committed to building the EVs at OAC and backing out would
cause major delays to a replacement arriving but in such a large facility, is there an opportunity to build
more than one vehicle type that also use batteries like Edge /Nautilus hybrid PHEV ?
Instead of either/or, could Ford be open to both of them?
If not OAC, perhaps Louisville which already builds C2 vehicles?
Now the counterpoint,Sorry, beyond my enthusiasm, I just don’t see the Ford I know making immediate major changes
and at the moment, they’re probably laser focused (LOL) on cutting red ink rather than adding to it.
At our online ratification zoom meeting we were told that a potential 3rd product could come here in the next few years. Is it possible yes do I believe it no. If they even ever do it when do you think a C2 Edge Nautilus would be built in North America at the earliest??
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18 hours ago, Footballfan said:
This plant is going to be Ford's Saturn. Saturn was supposed to build 500000 vehicles a year but got scaled back. Unless hybrids and ICE vehicles are in the mix for this BOC, this plant will probably never break 125-150k units a year.
Isn’t that Saturn plant GM Spring Hill?? That plant has done lots of overflow production over the years and seems to have done well long term. I believe Ford won’t allow BOC to flop as it is gonna be the newest most modern plant they have. I’m sure there is more planned for BOC going forward. I said it before and I’ll say it again, there is gonna be some plant consolidations going on in the future. I believe everyone in this forum is well aware of this and believes that is the reality of all this ICE BEV HYBRID situation.
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5 hours ago, akirby said:
I would have agreed 6 months ago but with the shift on EVs they might be rethinking that. Too bad they F’ed up the Chinese version with dull styling and a 3rd row. They could at least have imported it in the meantime.You know what? I agree with you, anything is possible at this point. I just can’t get Farley and his commodity product remark regarding the Edge out of my head. The Chinese Edge is very bland so importing that isn’t feasible and the size.
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1 hour ago, akirby said:
They're too far along to stop now. They’ve already cancelled all the current Edge and Nautilus suppliers so keeping the old one isn’t an option, and to bring Edge here requires a new greenhouse at least.I agree with you, these vehicles were delayed and pushed back to late 2024 early 2025 already. They were supposed to be out from 2023 but plans changed when Ford wanted more Mach-E production. Yup the current Edge is in its final days. I just think the Edge is dead period and they won’t bring the Chinese one to N/A with a new top hat.
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1 hour ago, ice-capades said:
I would doubt it considering how close they are to balancing out production for the Edge and starting the conversion to future BEV production.
The project is going forward from what I see. They’ve already set up a small U759 training station for skilled trades. State is the company that is in charge of this project and there is a lot of activity going on.
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52 minutes ago, silvrsvt said:
If they want to close the plant and pay back 1.8+ billion in loans and you want to be out of a job, they could.
It is better to keep the plant open and not lose the workforce.
I totally agree and obviously want to see this plan succeed. The governments forked up 590 million federal and provincial. The rest is on Fords dime. Like I said earlier in another discussion, there will be capacity issues like all of you have said until the situation improves.
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13 minutes ago, akirby said:
The problem with Oakville is not low EV volume per se. The problem is losing Edge production and forcing Nautilus to be imported from China. Seems like a big mistake knowing what we know now.A dumb decision that we will pay for here with low volume and potentially unattractive overpriced products.
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2 hours ago, akirby said:
I think you’re dead wrong about BOC. Having a dedicated plant building EV trucks and vans will bring costs way down compared to Lightning especially when you factor in battery production and insourcing of other parts. This is the future of EV production and nobody does trucks better than Ford even if volume is lower in the short term. You can’t build EVs in an ICE factory and do it efficiently.I’m sure they regret Oakville though.
If Ford wants to they can cancel this project up here if they so choose. Can they not?
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1 hour ago, fuzzymoomoo said:
And the power hungry big head UAW president wants a nationwide general strike on 5/1/28.
I’m sure these corporations will be prepared. They’ve got over 4 years to prepare.
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1 hour ago, mackinaw said:
From today's Detroit News. The recent UAW strike has changed things.
We all seen this coming from a country mile! I’m a union man and knew as we all did that the executives are strategizing how to deal with unions going forward after UAW strike.
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20 hours ago, akirby said:
Sounded like everything except trucks and vans.20 hours ago, twintornados said:Excellent reply....however, OAC needs more than a boutique car to build...
Thanks I agree and that’s why I believe that Ford has to rectify this situation somehow
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On 2/10/2024 at 12:58 PM, tbone said:
I have had pretty good luck with the explorers that we’ve had, which have been built there. However, they are known for a lot of quality problems. Moving the explorer to OAC is an interesting concept though.
Don’t hold your breath, ain’t happening. They sure have had quality problems but that’s a ford wide problem at the moment.
Ford Sales February 2024 - Up 10.5% Overall
in Ford Motor Company Discussion Forum
Posted
I thought it was a dumb move when they cancelled it in the first place. Seems like it was the plan to import all along